Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

[shovenose]

Hi BCN peeps...
Finally got an AC for free from work... in the owner of the recycling place's words: "you can fix it, you can keep it"...

So, I did a ghetto repair job using those yellow twisty caps and a random yellow extension cord, and yay, it works perfectly. (a friend with a car helped me get it home)...

Anyway, pushing almost 900W (measured with my kill-a-watt) the unit's only rated at 820W but it goes over... I don't trust my ghetto repair...

I came up with an idea I think is a good idea since I don't trust the yellow twisty cap thingies and I don't think electrical tape would be good enough either...

I want to make screw terminals inside a plastic box to connect the two ends of the cord...

Where could I get this plastic box and would that be the safest option? Also, can I keep using this extension cord (it's copper and looks to be of decent quality) or do I need something special?

Thanks guys,
shovenose

PS: these things is what I used...


PS #2: should I be worried about my bed room's crappy electrical circuit? it's only two prong I use those stupid adapters...

[budm]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

You may be able to get something like (20A rating) this at Electronics Plus or from Mouser, I use to get them from HSC in Ronerth Park.
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...nc7h8GLZHdk%3d

I would get the 3 terminal but do not use the middle one for more clearance between L and N, the ground wire then attached directly to the chassis with ring lug, use 12AWG wires if you can. I would not use it without Grounding the chassis since it not likely to be double insulated unit and it will have moisture built up inside the unit.

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

You may be able to get something like (20A rating) this at Electronics Plus or from Mouser, I use to get them from HSC in Ronerth Park.
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...nc7h8GLZHdk%3d

I would get the 3 terminal but do not use the middle one for more clearance between L and N, the ground wire then attached directly to the chassis with ring lug, use 12AWG wires if you can. I would not use it without Grounding the chassis since it not likely to be double insulated unit and it will have moisture built up inside the unit.

So you're saying I should use metal chassis instead of plastic?

[budm]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

You can mount that terminal inside the protective plastic box, that terminal block will be screw mounted to the box/chassis. It's the grounding that is important or you can plug it into GFCI outlet for ground fault protection.

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

You can mount that terminal inside the protective plastic box, that terminal block will be screw mounted to the box/chassis. It's the grounding that is important or you can plug it into GFCI outlet for ground fault protection.

I don't follow - could you please make a doodle for me?
Thanks,
shove

[Pentium4]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

I could be wrong on this, but as far as I'm concerned, that 820W rating is usable power, and the kill-a-watt measures total power, including the wasted power in the conversion process

[budm]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

You can get plastic junction box and cable clamp from HD: for example
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Raco-3-4-...u#.UfKhbtK1FQA

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-4-...7#.UfKhvNK1FQB

Then get the terminal block to mount inside the box.

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

AFAIK, they're shouldn't really an issue with power factor unlike AC-to-DC conversion.

[larrymoencurly]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

There are wire nuts filled with silicone rubber goo that never cures, and they're rated waterproof.

I've seen condenser fans spliced in with wire nuts wrapped in electrical tape. Black electrical tape holds up well in Arizona sunlight, at least 3M brand does. I also saw a condenser fan connected with plastic-covered spade connectors -- the wires were outside the fan's grill.

I'd be afraid of using wire nuts without either tape or heatshrink over them in an A/C, due to all the vibration.

Ungrounded A/C? Not for me, unless the AC outlet had a ground fault interrupter. Did I mention having 2 plug-in ground fault interrupters failing on me, one by turning off the power, the other by leaving the power on all the time? The latter was the upgraded version of the first. OTOH its factory replacement has worked fine for over a decade.

[ben7]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

I wouldn't trust that extension cord, not one bit!

The startup current of the compressor motor is quite high ... it will make the lights in your house dim!

My dad is a firefighter and I have seen WAAAY too many devastating house fires started by A/C units used on an extension cord! We had one fire just about a block away from where I live ... the friggin owners have abandoned their house and it is just sitting there, rotting away... >

[Mad_Professor]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

I wouldn't trust that extension cord, not one bit!

The startup current of the compressor motor is quite high ... it will make the lights in your house dim!

My dad is a firefighter and I have seen WAAAY too many devastating house fires started by A/C units used on an extension cord! We had one fire just about a block away from where I live ... the friggin owners have abandoned their house and it is just sitting there, rotting away... >

That's because people use it on under-rated cords, let's use a 16 or 18 AWG cord on a device that pulls 10 amps!

Another reason being that people tend to plug in a 50ft cord just to plug it in at 15 feet away, so it it has to run 50ft in coil before reaching the main circuit, this causes resistance and voltage drop over the long run which creates heat.

Also, why they tell you not to use extension cord on these window A/C is that the receptacle might be weak and not retain the plug as well as a new one that can, This usually results in resistance at the prongs and mating surface of the clips inside the receptacle which heats up the plug and


Seriously all my cords are 14/12/10. I've been running a 5 amp window A/C on a 14 AWG 25 ft cord for the past three weeks while I renovate my shop, I've had no problems yet.

[kc8adu]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

get a nice heavy 12/3 cord and connect it inside the unit properly.
the wattage demand will change with line voltage and temperature.
if you get 20 or more degrees drop from room temp its fine.thats how i test units i repair.
2 digital thermometers.1 in the room and one in the vent.
if you forsee needing a longer cord get the right length for the job now.
NO EXTENSION CORDS!

[kaboom]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

That's because people use it on under-rated cords, let's use a 16 or 18 AWG cord on a device that pulls 10 amps!

Another reason being that people tend to plug in a 50ft cord just to plug it in at 15 feet away, so it it has to run 50ft in coil before reaching the main circuit, this causes resistance and voltage drop over the long run which creates heat.

Also, why they tell you not to use extension cord on these window A/C is that the receptacle might be weak and not retain the plug as well as a new one that can, This usually results in resistance at the prongs and mating surface of the clips inside the receptacle which heats up the plug and


Seriously all my cords are 14/12/10. I've been running a 5 amp window A/C on a 14 AWG 25 ft cord for the past three weeks while I renovate my shop, I've had no problems yet.

Nor should you.

There's also the opposite: People who read instruction manuals or have heard hearsay regarding extensions. You cannot reason with them! They may have "heard about" extension cords, while not understanding about those undersized ones, and then proceed to do the "all extension cords are the same" thing. Don't waste your time.

get a nice heavy 12/3 cord and connect it inside the unit properly.
the wattage demand will change with line voltage and temperature.
if you get 20 or more degrees drop from room temp its fine.thats how i test units i repair.
2 digital thermometers.1 in the room and one in the vent.
if you forsee needing a longer cord get the right length for the job now.
NO EXTENSION CORDS!

Unless they've got screw-terminal cord caps!

Also keep in mind that higher EER/SEER units will have lower coil deltas for a given tonnage, as they rely more on air flow than air temperature.

Those old spinefin GE CarryCools could easily deliver 38 degree discharge air while pulling in 74 degree room air, with condenser entering air temps of 80 or so.

AFAIK, they're shouldn't really an issue with power factor unlike AC-to-DC conversion.

Both compressor and fan motors are what? Inductive, with relatively modest power factor. The compressor's power factor increases with the refrigerant's mass flow. Usually, at part-load, window units still pull almost as much current as at full load, but the work they're doing is less. Verifiable by "clocking" your electric meter.

The fan motor should be .8PF lagging or higher (if it's PSC), as it's always "loaded" by the same amount of airflow, relative to its various speeds anyway.

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

I wouldn't trust that extension cord, not one bit!

The startup current of the compressor motor is quite high ... it will make the lights in your house dim!

My dad is a firefighter and I have seen WAAAY too many devastating house fires started by A/C units used on an extension cord! We had one fire just about a block away from where I live ... the friggin owners have abandoned their house and it is just sitting there, rotting away... >

I've been a bit too busy to work on this but I really do want to do this right, at some point. Here's a pic of the temp repair LOL...

[kaboom]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

I've been a bit too busy to work on this but I really do want to do this right, at some point. Here's a pic of the temp repair LOL...

Regarding that hose going out the window:

That's the discharge air from the condenser. Where do you think it's pulling intake air from? That's right, your house!

When these units got popular a few years ago, there was always the "convenient" omission of the fact that these units will pull hot, outside air into the very house/area you're trying to cool! When only places like Grainger were selling these, that fact was made clear.

You should find a large knockout on that back panel to connect the "optional" (should be mandatory) condenser air intake.

Sorry, but those things are just disgustingly marketed. Originally, "portable" aircons were used to provide "spot cooling" in factories, garages, bakeries, etc, where there was no penalty from using indoor air to feed the condenser. But because of rotten things like QVC, these units and their cheaper "derivatives" began to be pushed on homeowners.

Get that condenser intake duct and stop pulling hot air in, only to have to cool it! If you've got a Lowes or Home Desperate nearby, they'll have flex duct you can use.

I'd go with 8", and uninsulated...


Also, when (not if) you redo that splice (properly), resolder the relays that control the motors. Do this even if they look ok. Cheep little boards such as the ones in there are, well, cheep. And check the wiring, too! Appliance makers like to "cheat" and use wire sizes that normally wouldn't be code. I know that higher temp insulation can allow a fudge factor, but there's still the problem of the terminals being a weak point.

Get some CRC 2-26 and undo each terminal. Spray a bit on and then reconnect. I see too many high-resistance connections in both ACs and space heaters. Very "accident prone."

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

Regarding that hose going out the window:

That's the discharge air from the condenser. Where do you think it's pulling intake air from? That's right, your house!

When these units got popular a few years ago, there was always the "convenient" omission of the fact that these units will pull hot, outside air into the very house/area you're trying to cool! When only places like Grainger were selling these, that fact was made clear.

You should find a large knockout on that back panel to connect the "optional" (should be mandatory) condenser air intake.

Sorry, but those things are just disgustingly marketed. Originally, "portable" aircons were used to provide "spot cooling" in factories, garages, bakeries, etc, where there was no penalty from using indoor air to feed the condenser. But because of rotten things like QVC, these units and their cheaper "derivatives" began to be pushed on homeowners.

Get that condenser intake duct and stop pulling hot air in, only to have to cool it! If you've got a Lowes or Home Desperate nearby, they'll have flex duct you can use.

I'd go with 8", and uninsulated...


Also, when (not if) you redo that splice (properly), resolder the relays that control the motors. Do this even if they look ok. Cheep little boards such as the ones in there are, well, cheep. And check the wiring, too! Appliance makers like to "cheat" and use wire sizes that normally wouldn't be code. I know that higher temp insulation can allow a fudge factor, but there's still the problem of the terminals being a weak point.

Get some CRC 2-26 and undo each terminal. Spray a bit on and then reconnect. I see too many high-resistance connections in both ACs and space heaters. Very "accident prone."

Um... OK?
Besides the fact you probably just explained why thing is almost entirely useless (yes, it barely lowers the temp of my room when it's hot), I'm entirely confused as to what motor relays have to do with rabbits chewing on power cords?
PS: no, there's nothing on the back to connect another tube to.

[kaboom]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

Um... OK?
Besides the fact you probably just explained why thing is almost entirely useless (yes, it barely lowers the temp of my room when it's hot), I'm entirely confused as to what motor relays have to do with rabbits chewing on power cords?

If you're gonna open it up to replace that power cord, you might as well inspect all the connections for oxidation. Clean and/or repair as required. Units having electronic controls will use relays to switch power to the motors, and also change speed taps for the fan motor. I prefer preventive measures, which is why I mentioned the 2-26. There's also "dielectric" grease you can use- seals out moisture from the connections.

Some relays are soldered to a board, others have only the coil and power feedthru (to operate the control) terminals soldered, with the hot and switched-hot-out have terminals on the top of the relay.

PS: no, there's nothing on the back to connect another tube to.

Uh-oh. I hope that thing doesn't use a single air intake for both the evaporator and condenser. If it does, there's probably no easy way to run the condenser on outside-air-only!

So your room temp actually goes up when you run this thing? Or stay the same?

BTW, what's the voltage at the unit with compressor running? Just "backprobe" those wirenuts. I wonder about voltage drop in the ext cord.

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

If you're gonna open it up to replace that power cord, you might as well inspect all the connections for oxidation. Clean and/or repair as required. Units having electronic controls will use relays to switch power to the motors, and also change speed taps for the fan motor. I prefer preventive measures, which is why I mentioned the 2-26. There's also "dielectric" grease you can use- seals out moisture from the connections.

Some relays are soldered to a board, others have only the coil and power feedthru (to operate the control) terminals soldered, with the hot and switched-hot-out have terminals on the top of the relay.



Uh-oh. I hope that thing doesn't use a single air intake for both the evaporator and condenser. If it does, there's probably no easy way to run the condenser on outside-air-only!

So your room temp actually goes up when you run this thing? Or stay the same?

BTW, what's the voltage at the unit? Just "backprobe" those wirenuts. I wonder about voltage drop in the ext cord.

Room temp goes down 0-3C depending on whether I'm standing right in front of it.
The entire left side of the unit is two big intake vents. I'm assuming that's the intakes you're referring to?

[kaboom]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

Room temp goes down 0-3C depending on whether I'm standing right in front of it.
The entire left side of the unit is two big intake vents. I'm assuming that's the intakes you're referring to?

See my edits.

It looks like those two lower intakes feed the condenser and its fan. You may verify this by putting into "fan only." Do not perform the following test with the compressor running!

With only the fans running, block off the round discharge hole where the flexduct normally connects. With that blocked off, you should feel nearly zero suction on those two lower intakes.

If you can confirm this, it's still possible to feed that condenser outside air. Like it should've been originally.

Come on, LG, no provisions for that? Wow.

You'll need to make or buy something to adapt a flexduct to those intakes. Either plywood boxes or something called register boots.

[shovenose]

Re: Shovenose's LG LP0711WNR Air Conditioner Bunny Rabbit Nibble Fix

See my edits.

It looks like those two lower intakes feed the condenser and its fan. You may verify this by putting into "fan only." Do not perform the following test with the compressor running!

With only the fans running, block off the round discharge hole where the flexduct normally connects. With that blocked off, you should feel nearly zero suction on those two lower intakes.

If you can confirm this, it's still possible to feed that condenser outside air. Like it should've been originally.

Come on, LG, no provisions for that? Wow.

You'll need to make or buy something to adapt a flexduct to those intakes. Either plywood boxes or something called register boots.

One problem: not enough space in my room to put something around it!