Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

[Spork Schivago]

Hi,

I'm not sure if this is the correct sub-forum, but it is tv related, so I thought I should post here. If this is the wrong place, could a moderator please move this post to a more appropriate place?

We need to run a new line from the pole to the house. Our cable provider is coming out Sunday to discuss how we're going to do this and what they will do, what I'll do.

I have no issues getting up on their pole to hook up the cable, but I think they might.

Anyway, this was the idea. I run 1/2 PVC schedule 40 (Cantex) conduit from where I want the entrance point at the house, underground, buried, 18", to the pole.

This is where I'm struggling. I want the conduit to go up the pole. Regardless of whether they allow that or not, the conduit is going to have to come out of the ground sooner or later and the coax is gonna have to make it to the top of the pole. I need that end, where the coax comes out, water tight, so water cannot drip down into the conduit.

Are there special ends that someone can point me to that are made for this? I couldn't find anything on google. I thought worse case, I could use something like the RACO Non-Metallic 1/2 in. Sheathed Cable Connector that Home Depot sells and just use some sort of water proofing caulk, but if there's an actual end that's threaded that I can just screw into the conduit, like I use when I run romex, but made for outdoor use and made for coax, that would prevent water from coming into the conduit, I'd rather go that route.

Here's a picture of the ends I use for the romex:

[budm]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

As far as I know out here in my city, any wiring inside your house is your responsibility, anything from outside is the utility/cable/phone company responsibility to keep it in working order, they will not allow you to do any change to the outside wiring.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

As far as I know out here in my city, any wiring inside your house is your responsibility, anything from outside is the utility/cable/phone company responsibility to keep it in working order, they will not allow you to do any change to the outside wiring.

When they were fixing my neighbors cabling, I had asked them about me running conduit underground, and they had said if I ran it to the pole, they would run it the rest of the way, however, this was when it was Time Warner, not Spectrum.

Come Sunday, between 1200 and 1300, they're sending a tech to discuss our various options. The guy said one option might be they do it all and pay for it all. The other might be I run it to the pole, they do the rest. Regardless, we need a new entry point into the house.

I'm hoping the tech will allow it. The last one said they would, but things change. I called the code enforcement office and talked to the code enforcer about it and he said because it's low voltage, he doesn't care. I asked if I needed a permit, he said no. I don't really understand why not though. How will the city know where the conduit is if I don't submit the drawing? But he says they don't care about low voltage and just run it.

I thought that was a bit odd.

[diif]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

I'm guessing they don't care as there is no harm to them if they put a spade through it.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

I'm guessing they don't care as there is no harm to them if they put a spade through it.

Yes, but it kinda sucks for the homeowner (whether that's me or a future homeowner).

I think what I'll do is create a drawing anyways, if Spectrum / Time Warner allows me to go the route I want to go, for references, and just pass it down if we ever sell, or because of my bad memory, reference it if we ever have any digging done.

So, assuming Spectrum / Time Warner are still okay with the underground, I still need to find a way to seal the PVC that will be by the pole or on the pole.

Rain is a more easier fix. I could go straight up, use a 90 degree elbow, go out a little, and then another 90 degree elbow, so where the cable comes out is facing towards the ground.

But insects is something I'd like to avoid. I don't really want to use some sort of sealant because these cables seem to expand and contract because of the weather, hence the little loops they have on the house, and where it taps into the cable line on the pole.

I had two ideas that I thought might work. One was trying to find a top that had something like a rubber seal covering almost the entire top (except the outer perimeter, which would be PVC), and then there'd be just a small hole to push the coax through. I'm not sure a product like this exists though. I've been looking and not finding anything.

The other idea I had was to just take a cap that completely caps off the PVC, and drill a small hole through it, where I could push the coax through, but not too easy like. It could still expand and contract, and if I use the 90 degree elbow ideas, rain wouldn't be an issue.

Do any of you people have any other ideas or know if there's such a product like the first one I suggested?

Thanks!

[budwich]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

you need to bend the conduit (either with heat or otherwise) in a "U" so that it is pointing down (assuming its running up the pole base some distance). Then, the "incoming cable" will go down past the "U" and up again. This forms a "drip loop" so to speak to prevent water that is coming down the incoming cable from following it into the conduit and further protects the conduit from water directly going down into the conduit.

[CapLeaker]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

a: I'd run conduit too
b: I'd be doing that what budwich said

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

you need to bend the conduit (either with heat or otherwise) in a "U" so that it is pointing down (assuming its running up the pole base some distance). Then, the "incoming cable" will go down past the "U" and up again. This forms a "drip loop" so to speak to prevent water that is coming down the incoming cable from following it into the conduit and further protects the conduit from water directly going down into the conduit.

I was just going to use elbows to make that U shape. I'm thinking the same for the water, but I still want to keep insects out. If I seal it completely, I think that will be bad, because it needs to contract and expand (the coax).

I've talked to the cable company. They sent the tech, but after talking to him, he called his boss, and they're going to let me run it up the pole myself.

That's something I don't really want to do, I thought they'd let me run it to the pole, and I could provide the rest and just tell them what to do. But nope, I guess I get a ladder, run it up, and when it's done, call them and they'll hook the actual wire up to their drop or whatever you want to call it.

I was going to use my RG6 quad shielded cabling, but the tech really thinks I should go for the RG11, and in all honesty, if I don't run the RG11, it'll probably haunt me at night....I dunno.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

I called the city and figured for at least the digging, I'd need a permit, but code enforcer says he really don't care about low voltage wires and no permit needed, just talk to the cable company and see what they want done or how they want it done.

I talked to them, they were good, and they're letting me do it, but even letting me go up the pole, which I don't really want to do. Anyway, they said I'd be dealing with Spectrum Business by the time I got it hooked up, not regular Spectrum techs.

We're not switching to business though. I've called and talked to them a few times, looking for a business account that works for us, and there just isn't. Also, our state says they're kicking Charter (who owns Spectrum) out of our state. I guess they have two months to get out, because they been doing some unsafe stuff, haven't done what the state said they had to do, etc.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.

[angelos]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

Normally coax that i buried in a conduit needs to be protected from the inadvertent accumulation of moisture. We use a polyurethane type that reduces moisture ingress. Its a little more expensive but lasts longer.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

Normally coax that i buried in a conduit needs to be protected from the inadvertent accumulation of moisture. We use a polyurethane type that reduces moisture ingress. Its a little more expensive but lasts longer.

Is that "coax tape" or something else? If you don't mind sharing the name of the product with me, I certainly could use it, although, I believe this project is now going to have to be postponed until next summer.

[budm]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

https://www.cablewholesale.com/suppo...ial_corner.php

https://www.anixter.com/en_us/produc...Cable/p/CS5730
Notes, Outdoor: NO NOT OUTDOOR GRADE MATERIAL
Notes, Dielectric Material: FPE-FOAMED (CELLULAR) POLYETHYLENE

Direct Burial RG6 Coaxial Cable: https://www.primuscable.com/store/c/...ial-Cable.aspx

RG6 vs RG59: https://sewelldirect.com/learning-center/rg59-or-rg6

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

https://www.cablewholesale.com/suppo...ial_corner.php

https://www.anixter.com/en_us/produc...Cable/p/CS5730
Notes, Outdoor: NO NOT OUTDOOR GRADE MATERIAL
Notes, Dielectric Material: FPE-FOAMED (CELLULAR) POLYETHYLENE

Direct Burial RG6 Coaxial Cable: https://www.primuscable.com/store/c/...ial-Cable.aspx

RG6 vs RG59: https://sewelldirect.com/learning-center/rg59-or-rg6

Thanks. I love how the RG6 vs RG59 page shows the signal loss for the two cables.

You think I should stay away from the hardline, like this: https://www.anixter.com/en_us/produc...Cable/p/B1618A

?

I see they make low-loss RG6.

I'm staying away from the RG59. I have RG6 for inside, but was questioning whether I should keep that or run RG11 instead.

I like Belden a lot. I'm also trying to future proof a little (I know that can be hard). It seems people are slowly making the shift to 4k, and it might not be too long before we have 4k in the house (maybe another 10 years?) Granted, by then, coax could be completely dead. Here, we have the option of fibre for television, internet, and phone. That might be the future. I'm trying to decide if it's worth spending a lot on good coax that we currently don't need, or just good coax that supports our current needs.

Thanks BudM!

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

We have been in touch with Belden and our distributor. We have a quote for Belden 1525A.

Attached is a datasheet for the 1525A. I was hoping instead of Bare Copper Covered
Steel, we'd be able to find something that was pure copper for the conductor, but after talking to Belden, they confirmed we wouldn't really find anything better that fit our requirements (direct burial, okay for sunlight, RG11, 75 ohm impedance, etc).

What do you guys think? Thanks!

[angelos]

Re: Questions about running coax under ground in conduit

The information that budm sent you is spot on. Couldn't have said it better myself.