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    TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

    Hi everyone - my first thread... so hopefully in the correct place

    This is my first mission and having done some reading here I thought I'd ask a few questions before diving in with my soldering iron (circa 1980!)

    My son's TV, a 'budget' model is around four or five years old (from memory and all the 08 and 09 numbers I keep seeing on the inside) and has what looks like the "2 seconds to black" symptoms:

    Power on and the standby light illuminates, power on from remote and there is a pause and then the backlights flash (as in flashbulb if you're old enough to remember those) then the standby light comes back on and the flash/off cycles. I don't see any picture at any point, even with a torch.

    TV details
    Make: Bush (I've seen it may also be listed as ALBA?)
    Model: LCD2280F1080P
    other numbers after the Serial Number: 10063158 0908
    It's a UK model

    In the best tradition of tinkering I've pulled it apart and there are two boards. The PSU/Inverter board and mainboard.

    PSU board is marked as 171PS15-4 V2 080409 - it's clean with no scorch or leakage marks - as is the mainboard. Anyhow, I have looked at the good/bad caps list and through the TV repairs threads and looking at the make of caps on the PSU board (and the age of the TV) I figured this is probably a good place to start as while none are damaged or bulging (and none appear to be open/short circuit) only one (Samxon) appears on the good list. Two if you count the Chang Primary(?) as well.
    The others are HEC apart from two EPCOS rated at 85C perhaps due to size? The EPCOS and have a lower resistance (800K not 2-3 M ohms) if that has any bearing.

    If recapping is a good starting point, I'm thinking it would be best to recap the board with 105C caps all over (why would you leave 85C caps above the heatsink anyway?!)

    So if I'm correct and recapping is a good starting place, I'd appreciate your views on these as a selection

    EPCOS B41827 2200uF 10v
    Replace with:
    Rubycon 10YXJ2200M10X20 2200uF/10v 1400mA Ripple (105C)

    HEC ZT105CX0C - 1000uF / 25v and
    SAMXON KM(M) Y5A -1000uF /25v
    Replace with
    Panasonic EEUFM1E102 - 1000uF 25v 2600mA ripple (ESR 18M Ohm?)
    or
    Nichicon UPW1E102MHD - 1000uF 25v 1660mA ripple - (ESR 38M ohm?)
    or
    NIC NRSZ102M25V12.5X20F - 1000uF 25v 1600mA ripple (ESR 40M ohm)

    HEC 33uF 50V
    Replace with
    Nichicon UPS1H330MED - 33uF / 50V (250mA Ripple)
    or
    Panasonic EEUFC1H330 - 33uF / 50V (ESR 600M ohm) 260mA ripple

    Chang CD295 68uF 400V 25/105/21
    Replace with
    Nichicon LGJ2G680MELZ20 - 68uF 400V (620mA ripple)

    Note: The existing caps (in the group shot) are all 10mm dia and two are really tight - I'm hoping I can squeeze one in as a 12.5mm without getting too 'creative' as I'm also limited for height - there is about 6-7mm to the case with the present 20mm caps. Any issues from the longer leads if it needs to be 'pursuaded'?

    Thanks for reading this far through my ramblings - looking forward to your words of wisdom
    Attached Files
    Cheers,
    Nige

    #2
    Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

    Hi - Just wonder if you have actually done any testing?
    If the caps look good no signs of leaking or bulging then initial testing
    is the place to start. You could replace all the caps on both boards
    and the fault may persist.
    You mention 2 seconds to black - did you read retiredcaps guide.

    https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...4&postcount=19

    Have you got a digital multimeter
    Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
    http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

    Comment


      #3
      Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

      By far and away the most common fault I've found with a 2-secs-2-black on a 22 inch LCD is bad bulbs/connectors. I believe that Samsung made most of the LCD panels for these sets and they are prone to the connections at the end of the bulb failing causing this exact symptom. Usually an arcing sound and/or burning smell is also present.
      Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
      For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

        Going back to standby is a different issue, IIRC.
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        Comment


          #5
          Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

          Hi guys - thanks for the quick responses


          Originally posted by selldoor View Post
          Hi - Just wonder if you have actually done any testing?
          Tested the diodes and the caps in situ. Don't have a 'spare' CCFL' to test with.

          I felt sure I wouldn't be the first to have seen this....

          Stripped down some more and the tubes are within the panel, not visible, and its made by LG.



          Is it worth stripping down further - will I be able to get new tubes?
          Attached Files
          Cheers,
          Nige

          Comment


            #6
            Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

            Hmm, it's a bit more modern than the Samsung 22" panel I was thinking of. Also LG usually use EEFL which is more reliable than CCFL so maybe it's ok in that regard. Hard to be sure.
            Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
            For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

              Yes - I wasnt sure about the power led going out perhaps RJARRRPCGP will come back and tell us what he recalled?
              In the meantime to get it out of the way you can test the secondary windings on the inverter transformers. Not seen this board but think they may be as marked.
              Power off -Meter on ohms 2000 - test S1 to S2 and S3 to S4
              Attached Files
              Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
              http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

              Comment


                #8
                Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                on 171PS15-4 check C171 if fitted and C124 &130 high voltage ceramic capacitors
                if you can not test them replace them know to give this fault

                different set can have different values post pictures of them so we can id them
                Last edited by FIXITNOW; 11-12-2014, 01:52 AM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                  Thanks again for the replies - they're giving me some hope it can be fixed.

                  Originally posted by tom66 View Post
                  Hmm, it's a bit more modern than the Samsung 22" panel I was thinking of. Also LG usually use EEFL which is more reliable than CCFL so maybe it's ok in that regard. Hard to be sure.
                  Sounds like a morsel of good news at last?

                  In the meantime to get it out of the way you can test the secondary windings on the inverter transformers. Not seen this board but think they may be as marked.
                  Power off -Meter on ohms 2000 - test S1 to S2 and S3 to S4
                  Both test the same - 840 ohms... hopefully more good news?

                  on 171PS15-4 check C171 if fitted and C124 &130 high voltage ceramic capacitors
                  if you can not test them replace them know to give this fault

                  different set can have different values post pictures of them so we can id them
                  Looks like C171 not fitted

                  C124 and C130 are SL 2.2C 3Kv
                  Attached Files
                  Last edited by nigeH; 11-12-2014, 06:47 AM. Reason: oops... removed inline images (as suggested)
                  Cheers,
                  Nige

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                    Can you make it so your pictures just appear as thumbnails so they dont load every time.
                    (as in your first batch)
                    C171 is on the other side of the board likely just under the heatsink? (it pairs with C130)
                    Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                    http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                      [QUOTE=selldoor;500808]Can you make it so your pictures just appear as thumbnails so they dont load every time.
                      (as in your first batch)[/QOUTE]
                      Sorry updated

                      Originally posted by selldoor View Post
                      C171 is on the other side of the board likely just under the heatsink? (it pairs with C130)
                      No cap that I can see... unless it's under the grey blob? (one blob with two brown 'buttons' appear each side in the middle)

                      Side and top shots of C171 location
                      Attached Files
                      Cheers,
                      Nige

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                        We were mislead a bit C171 is not a ceramic you can see the top of it.
                        You can understand why it would fail cooked in an oven!!.

                        Anyway - as you have located your trusty soldering iron - hope its not too big
                        or too hot - what wattage is it? may as well put it to use.
                        I would reflow all the high voltage joints on the inverter transformers and on the
                        blue ceramic caps and on the connectors to the lamps. Ideally if you have
                        any desoldering braid or a pump it is better to remove the old solder and apply fresh. You can also redo any other joints that dont look good.

                        Another thing would be try and test for a bad bulb or bulbs - if you dont have any spare bulbs or something else you can plug these bulbs into you could make up a couple of test lamps - see here
                        https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showth...er+testing+cfl


                        Good news - yes the inverter transformers appear ok
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by selldoor; 11-12-2014, 07:57 AM.
                        Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                        http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                          Originally posted by selldoor View Post
                          We were mislead a bit C171 is not a ceramic you can see the top of it.
                          Sorry that's my bad photography - it's a gap in the heatsink showing the top of the electrolytics.

                          The gap under the transformer where C171 is marked is in red here - all I can see are the pads. I think!

                          Would C171 be surface mount on the other side (lots of stuff is on that side)?

                          As you suggest may be time to break out the iron and try some stuff... busy tonight so may not be until tomorrow
                          Attached Files
                          Cheers,
                          Nige

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                            Well I think your picture are really good - I see now that cap I marked is the one behind the heatsink looking out through the hole. I find it hard to believe there is a C171 but
                            on the otherhand it does look like there is a wire in the solder joints on the back of the board where it would be. At the moment I dont think getting the heatsink off to look is a priority. Re do the solder joints and see what that brings.
                            Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                            http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                              Broken out iron and desoldering pump... removed the two caps C124 and C130. Both test open circuit on the DVM and don't respond on a jerry rigged RC tester like a good 2.2nF (or other various test sizes I used) - I think they are dead.

                              Now a little help needed to find a match please I've not found the original part but can anyone confirm it's a 2.2nF? Don't think there's much doubt about the 3Kv rating

                              Found these - is either suitable or one better than the other in this application?

                              RS Stock No. 721-5057
                              Brand Murata Mfr.
                              Part No. DEBE33F222ZA3B
                              Capacitance 2.2nF
                              Tolerance -20 → +80%
                              Voltage 3150 V dc

                              quite a loose tolerance.... one of these looks better - is there a "but"

                              RS Stock No. 117-388
                              Brand Murata
                              Mfr. Part No. DEBB33F222KA3B
                              Capacitance 2.2nF
                              Temperature Coefficient ±10%
                              Tolerance ±10%
                              Voltage 3150 V dc

                              Any thoughts most welcome...
                              Cheers,
                              Nige

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                                Are you sure the blue ballast cap is 2.2nF? That will be 220pF which way too high of the capacitance for the ballast cap.
                                https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...3&d=1415795064
                                That is 2.2pF 3KV ballast cap, the capacitance is so low that your meter cannot read it, when these cap goes bad they will have leakage resistance and turns light brown due to heat.
                                Last edited by budm; 11-13-2014, 02:46 PM.
                                Never stop learning
                                Basic LCD TV and Monitor troubleshooting guides.
                                http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...956#post305956

                                Voltage Regulator (LDO) testing:
                                http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...999#post300999

                                Inverter testing using old CFL:
                                http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...er+testing+cfl

                                Tear down pictures : Hit the ">" Show Albums and stories" on the left side
                                http://s807.photobucket.com/user/budm/library/

                                TV Factory reset codes listing:
                                http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=24809

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                                  @Budm I am having difficulty finding 2.2pF 3Kv caps for what I would call a reasonable price. 5pF 3Kv are available here: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5pf-3kv-HI...item19da5411b5

                                  Could he use those instead?

                                  If he used 2 of each in series would that be better - 2.5pF or is that too messy.
                                  Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                                  http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                                    You must use the right capacitance but two in series should be ok.
                                    Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                                    For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                                      Thanks for your replies - as you can see I'm no expert in this

                                      Originally posted by budm View Post
                                      Are you sure the blue ballast cap is 2.2nF? That will be 220pF which way too high of the capacitance for the ballast cap.
                                      https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...3&d=1415795064
                                      That is 2.2pF 3KV ballast cap, the capacitance is so low that your meter cannot read it, when these cap goes bad they will have leakage resistance and turns light brown due to heat.
                                      Thanks budm - no not at all sure!

                                      Dug a little deeper in the datasheet and see mention of 3000M resistance (explains the OL meter reading) and fire retardant coating!

                                      Caps still blue - is it worth changing to eliminate - if I can find one?

                                      Originally posted by selldoor View Post
                                      @Budm I am having difficulty finding 2.2pF 3Kv caps for what I would call a reasonable price. 5pF 3Kv are available here: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5pf-3kv-HI...item19da5411b5

                                      Could he use those instead?

                                      If he used 2 of each in series would that be better - 2.5pF or is that too messy.
                                      Won't be too worried if it's a couple of quid and fixes it selldoor

                                      How about these? Wary as no mention of inverters and these seem (from the above) quite 'special' caps!
                                      http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231256242200?var=530483259034

                                      http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181066187474?var=480212657816
                                      Cheers,
                                      Nige

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Re: TV Recap - Bush (Alba) LCD2280f1080P

                                        Originally posted by nigeH View Post

                                        How about these? Wary as no mention of inverters and these seem (from the above) quite 'special' caps!
                                        http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231256242200?var=530483259034

                                        http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181066187474?var=480212657816
                                        You are still thinking 2.2nF? ---- think 2.2pF
                                        Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                                        http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                                        Comment

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