Stereo Setup Assistance

[KenwoodExpert]

Kenwood VR-309 This is believed to be about 100 watts Per Channel?
Bic Venturi Formula 2 Stereo Speakers

Here are the specs
8" Woofers
Horn Midrange
Nominal Impedance 6 ohms
Rated Power 75 Watts is this the RMS or Peak Power?

[Tube_Dude]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

rated power 75 watts is this the rms or peak power?

Rms!

[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Too much power for these Speakers or is this considered a good match up?

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

It's gonna be fine. Generally it is recommended that the amplifier has twice the power output that the speakers are rated for. That of course, only if both ratings are honest.

[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Okay Thank You but how do I know if both ratings are honest or not?

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Well that brand of speakers is known for quality products. As for the receiver, it probably won't do 100W on all 5 channels at the same time, but it'll likely meet that rating for stereo.

[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Well I have no plans to use all 5 Channels I just have it hooked for 2 Channel Stereo Music Listening. So is it too much power for these speakers even in Stereo Mode? Can you guys help me research it I'm a little confused. any kind of Overload Protection Circuit Breakers built into these Speakers? An old pair of HH Scott Speakers I had once did.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

It's gonna be fine. Generally it is recommended that the amplifier has twice the power output that the speakers are rated for. That of course, only if both ratings are honest.

That doesn't even make sense.
If you send more power to speakers than they are designed to handle they will sound like shit, if not blow-out.

Speakers should be rated for more than the amp [for component safety & longevity].

Amp should be rated for more than you will ever use so it's never maxed out. [A good one would come that way from the factory by how they set up the volume control. Full volume would be less than the amp can actually do.]

.
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[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Truth is my understanding is that you are more likely to damage speakers from distortion and too little power rather than too much power. Bic Makes high performance Loudspeakers. there is glue on the woofer and some great big Styrofoam thing that I can't figure out what it is? Dustcap? The woofers are like a Baige Cream Color.

[weirdlookinguy]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Clipping is why you want an amplifier that is more powerful than your speakers. An amp, especially a crappy one, putting out near-max power is likely to clip which destroys tweeters.

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

That doesn't even make sense.
If you send more power to speakers than they are designed to handle they will sound like shit, if not blow-out.

Speakers should be rated for more than the amp [for component safety & longevity].

Yes but you forget that amps and speakers are generally used for MUSIC which has a peak value 10-20 times higher than the average. Mechanical assemblies (ie speakers) tolerate short term overloads without sounding like shit or blowing up. Whereas an amplifier that is forced to reproduce a higher peak than it can do, clips it off and sounds like shit. In extreme cases (ie drunken parties) it can damage the speakers as well.

Now, with a higher power amplifier, a speaker "fart" due to excessive cone excursion on an otherwise clean reproduction is a lot easier to notice than if the music was driven into clipping already. No matter how drunk everyone is. I've DJ'd several drunken parties with high power amps. No speakers ever blown up - because the amps and speakers were capable of more than peoples' eardrums would comfortably take. Overkill is good.

Clipping is why you want an amplifier that is more powerful than your speakers. An amp, especially a crappy one, putting out near-max power is likely to clip which destroys tweeters.

Exactly.

[Scenic]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Now, with a higher power amplifier, a speaker "farts" due to excessive cone excursion

...and damages the voice coil assembly as it bangs against the magnet multiple times and kinda folds the paper (?) tube (where the voice coil is mounted on) over so in the worst case, it'll scrape against the magnet = speaker shot

in other words: in both cases, the speakers will be damaged.. one way or another..

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Clipping is why you want an amplifier that is more powerful than your speakers. An amp, especially a crappy one, putting out near-max power is likely to clip which destroys tweeters.

Yes exactly...
.. That's why you never max out the amp.
And I'm not talking about the knob, it's about the circuit.

Your your guys' theory is that putting 10 watt speakers on a 200 watt amp won't hurt them..
RIIIIiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiGHT!!!
I'll get right on that one!!!
.

The Amp on my Kenwood setup is 150 watts [at the knob] and the speakers are 180 watts.
... So Kenwood doesn't buy your theory either.
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[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

Your your guys' theory is that putting 10 watt speakers on a 200 watt amp won't hurt them..

It won't if it's played responsibly.

@ Scenic: You have to let a speaker fart for quite a while for the coil former to be damaged. And if it isn't in a bandpass enclosure, the noise is extremely offending so you will almost certainly turn that down as soon as it happens.

[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

These 1970's Bic Venturi Series Formula 2's can sound amazing with music like Jackyl,Metallica,Black Sabbath, Did I say Velvet Revolver Libertad CD? All my cd's are played through a Highend Model Teac CD Player an older Single Disc Model.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

It won't if it's played responsibly.

@ Scenic: You have to let a speaker fart for quite a while for the coil former to be damaged. And if it isn't in a bandpass enclosure, the noise is extremely offending so you will almost certainly turn that down as soon as it happens.

When it comes to things like stereos it's better to design for stupidity than to rely on responsible operators.

The amp should set so the dial stops before clipping [dial determines the actual output which is less than the theoretical OP] and the speakers should be rated for more than the amps actual output.
- That's the SENSIBLE way to set one up.

That's how the quality brands do it.
That's how my Kenwood came from the factory and it's been sounding great for 25 years now.
.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

It won't if it's played responsibly.

Bullshit..
Sending more juice to a speaker than it can handle will cause clipping just as over ranging an amp will.
Except the clipping will me -mechanical- as in when the magnet bottoms out in it's range of movement.
- This the defect in your theory..
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[KenwoodExpert]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

PCBONEZ Is my Kenwood gonna cause my Speakers to get damaged in the long run? What is the watts per channel just in Stereo Mode? Model # VR-309. They Speakers are rated @ 75 Watts.

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

It's limited at the same 100W per channel in stereo mode by the power supply voltage. With all 5 channels driven the limitation would appear because of maximum current supported by the PS. Your speakers will be fine.

@ PCBONEZ: Bottoming out vs exceeding linear excursion are totally different things with totally different audible (and physical) results.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Stereo Setup Assistance

PCBONEZ Is my Kenwood gonna cause my Speakers to get damaged in the long run? What is the watts per channel just in Stereo Mode? Model # VR-309. They Speakers are rated @ 75 Watts.

I dunno about that specific amp but if you crank it up past what the speakers are rated for then yes.

And it's physics, no audiophool wives tales are going to change that.
Unlike most other kinds of circuits audio amps PUSH power to the load.
That's why it's best to pick parts such that that can't happen, even by accident.
-
You are safe so long as you don't push it past what the speakers are good for.
You could also spread the power across more speakers.

I'm not an audiophool.
I just have a really nice Kenwood I've maintained,, and can do math.

I've run into 'wannabe' audio engineers my whole life and so many of their ideas are as inherently stupid as those wannbe mechanical engineers that slap 3" exhaust systems on sub-3 liter engines and think it's an improvement somehow.
[What it does is destroy low-end torque, make it run lean, overheat the rings and burn vales.]
- But ~all~ their buddies agree it's a great idea so they just ~KNOW~ it's true regardless of what the math says.
- No point it talking sense to them. None..

It is entertaining to challenge one of their ridiculous theories once in a while and watch them spin.
- Gotcha....
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