What’s the bottleneck with x58?

[shovenose]

Posted on another forum about lame performance, can’t even manage 60fps at 1080p on GTA V with my bf’s computer.

It’s a Dell XPS desktop with an i7-930 and GTX980 4GB GPU.

Initially it was running 3x 2GB memory modules in the wrong slots so it was running single channel.

I replaced that with 3x 4GB running in triple channel configuration. I thought for sure that would solve it.

Nope. A bit better but still no good. According to stats neither GPU nor CPU are anywhere close to 100% and even according to task manager none of the single cores are pegged.

Anyway, multiple other people said the same thing with their X58 based systems performing poorly but also being underutilized?

I’m going to end up building a different system with an E3-1271v3 so the poor GTX980 can actually do something besides sit idle, but I’m curious what on the X58 platform is the limitation?

[Topcat]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

I'm not familiar with that game's requirements and how it would perform on that hardware, but as slick of a setup as that is, it is getting whiskers on it...Game too new? Try any benchmarking to see if it's actually performing at the level it should? My first guess would be to populate the empty 3 RAM slots; that way the NB/CPU can interleave the two banks.

[shovenose]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

I'm not familiar with that game's requirements and how it would perform on that hardware, but as slick of a setup as that is, it is getting whiskers on it...Game too new? Try any benchmarking to see if it's actually performing at the level it should? My first guess would be to populate the empty 3 RAM slots; that way the NB/CPU can interleave the two banks.

Unfortunately the motherboard has 1 dead RAM slot. So I am limited to 3 modules unless I want it to run in single channel

The game runs much, much better on my own secondary PC, an E5-2670 (v1) with GTX970, and that CPU is barely better in single thread performance although far better at multi-threading.

GTA V is a pretty old game (2013), and the recommended CPU is an i5-3470.

https://support.rockstargames.com/ar...m-Requirements

I guess the i7-930 is just too lame... https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare...7-930/822vs835 but I just don't get why I'm not seeing near 100% CPU utilization if it's a CPU bottleneck.

[stj]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

pretty sure it's mostly gpu needed for that game
maybe it's an o.s. problem.
game was written for what - vista age machines? win7??

[Uranium-235]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Posted on another forum about lame performance, can't even manage 60fps at 1080p on GTA V with my bf's computer.

It's a Dell XPS desktop with an i7-930 and GTX980 4GB GPU.

Initially it was running 3x 2GB memory modules in the wrong slots so it was running single channel.

I replaced that with 3x 4GB running in triple channel configuration. I thought for sure that would solve it.

Nope. A bit better but still no good. According to stats neither GPU nor CPU are anywhere close to 100% and even according to task manager none of the single cores are pegged.

Anyway, multiple other people said the same thing with their X58 based systems performing poorly but also being underutilized?

I'm going to end up building a different system with an E3-1271v3 so the poor GTX980 can actually do something besides sit idle, but I'm curious what on the X58 platform is the limitation?

Does he have a varible sync monitor? Make sure you're using that or turn vsync off. Check your nvidia settings panel

I just ran GTA V on my 5800x + 3080 and CPU and GPU ran really low, and I have maximum decked out settings

[Uranium-235]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Wow I had no idea you could save a kidnapping in progress of ex-lost members. Got killed because I haven't played in a loong time

Still, CPU was about 16% and GPU hanged at about nothing. 144hz monitor

[shovenose]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Wow I had no idea you could save a kidnapping in progress of ex-lost members. Got killed because I haven't played in a loong time

Still, CPU was about 16% and GPU hanged at about nothing. 144hz monitor

LOL! I try to log in to GTA V every day, if you go to the Casino you can get a daily bonus if 1k chips which you can then trade in immediately for $1k and there is also a wheel you can spin, sometimes you win something useless like some ugly clothing but sometimes you get a nice chunk of cash!

And as for the monitor, it's a fairly old 1080P 60Hz HDTV.

[Uranium-235]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

LOL! I try to log in to GTA V every day, if you go to the Casino you can get a daily bonus if 1k chips which you can then trade in immediately for $1k and there is also a wheel you can spin, sometimes you win something useless like some ugly clothing but sometimes you get a nice chunk of cash!

And as for the monitor, it's a fairly old 1080P 60Hz HDTV.

Are you on vsync? If you are you can't literally go above 60hz

[Uranium-235]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Also you might want to look at each core %. If it's not optimized for MT it might have one core holding everything back. If true, disabling MT might help give that core some more room

[shovenose]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Are you on vsync? If you are you can't literally go above 60hz

Yes I understand that lol, but if everything is performing as it should it should basically be a fixed 60fps.

The new build with the e3-1271v3 solved the problem.

[Retrorockit]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Look into one of the unlocked Xeons for that chipset. The Xeons support 1333 DDR3, the i7 don't. W3680 is the favorite.
Then overclock it to about 4.1GHz with Throttlestop software. The power settings are a little tricky. This works even on locked down workstations.
With an unlocked system the fixed multi X56xx CPUs work also with BCLK increases.
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...op-pcs.235975/

[shovenose]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Look into one of the unlocked Xeons for that chipset. The Xeons support 1333 DDR3, the i7 don't. W3680 is the favorite.
Then overclock it to about 4.1GHz with Throttlestop software. The power settings are a little tricky. This works even on locked down workstations.
With an unlocked system the fixed multi X56xx CPUs work also with BCLK increases.
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...op-pcs.235975/

Thank you, I'll consider it, they look to be about $40. The Dell CPU cooler sucks though, even with a repaste and dusting it sounds like an airplane. Both the current CPU and that CPU have a 130W TDP though, I guess going from 45nm to 32nm is worth something!

[Uranium-235]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Are you talking about GTA Online?

[shovenose]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

Are you talking about GTA Online?

Yep.

[Retrorockit]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

For X58 there are unlocked Xeons that support faster 1333 memory, and have unlocked multipliers. Typical overclock is about 4.1GHz on 6 cores 12 threads. W3680,W3690 are the unlocked CPUs
Throttlestop software can access power and speed settings.
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...op-pcs.235975/
If you don't want to overclock the X5687 Xeon 4C/8T is the fastest locked CPU in the series with 3.89GHz turbo speed.

[momaka]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

I have a Dell Precision T-7500 workstation with Xeon E5649 CPU(s) and 12/24 GB of tripple channel DDR3 RAM. From what I know, the T-7500 chipset is a variant of x58 or at least very similar.

I'm encountering the same problems with Fortnite - none of my cores get pegged to 100%, yet I get a lot of frame drops and dips. This is regardless of what video card I use. Most of the time, my CPU cores are loaded 30-50% in game, and occasionally peak to 70-80%, but rarely see one go higher... and the frame drops do not seem to coincide with the peaks in CPU usage. Total CPU load never goes above 50-60% (usually below 40% most of the time.) Oh, and this is with ONE CPU too (I removed the 2nd CPU + riser card due to being a dummy and installing Windows 10 Home... which sees the 2nd CPU but refuses to use it... )

BCN member dj_ricoh (Daniel C. on Youtube), also ran into the same issue with GTA V and X58. Strange thing was, IIRC, the higher he put the graphics details in GTA V, the better the framerate got... to a point. In the end, game was still under-utilizing the CPU and GPU in his case.

So yeah... seems like there is indeed some kind of a bottleneck with x58.
I do wonder how better-optimized games for multi-threaded CPUs would fare on these systems, though, like Cyberbug, Battlefield V, and the latest Doom. From what I saw a while back, these did better on systems with more CPU cores rather than systems with faster CPUs with less cores.

Meh. This is why I keep going back to the classic games from the 90's and early 2000's: if it meets the min. CPU speed, it will run OK (for what was considered "OK" back then, of course. )

[dmill89]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

One of the issues is likely that X58 only supports PCIe 2.0 which is half the speed of 3.0 (which is what the GTX980 supports/was built for, granted I'm not sure how much of a difference it actually has on a GPU of that age, and would be much more of an issue on a newer GPU), it also has the PCIe lanes all going through the chipset adding further latency, while most later designs will have at least the lanes for the primary X16 slot going directly to the CPU.

[Kougar]

Re: What's the bottleneck with x58?

There's no single bottleneck point, I'd say it was a combination of CPU and GPU both. But certainly single-thread IPC performance is holding it back. Generally speaking games rely on a single main thread, and what little multicore offloading there happens to be is still reliant on the processing speed of that main thread. It doesn't matter how many cores/threads are available if all the dependent threads have to hurry up and wait on the main thread for more work. So as CPUs age you're not going to see them "max out" even though they're the bottleneck. GTA-V was not known for its multi-threading either.

Nehalem was the first generation of Intel chips with the memory controllers moved off the chipset and into the CPU. It was good performance in its time, but still it was four generations old when GTA-V came along. It doesn't help that NVIDIA drivers have more CPU overhead than AMD's either.

GN has some 2020 numbers here. You can see what a 2500K gets with a 2080 Ti @ 1080p for comparison. There's a straight 2x performance increase in minimums + average just between the 2500K and 9600K. But it wasn't until Alder Lake and Zen 3 that IPC really got a good, healthy uptick over past hardware, so the difference versus a current-gen CPU is going to be even larger.