Heating problems just won't go away

[pentium]

Yes, while I am away from the lab nobody says I'm no longer permitted to ask questions.
Anyways, Now that my PC us pretty much up and running (though I still need input on those USB problems) I was able to do what I really like and actually use the system. Everything was fine until I did a check on how my system was going performance and health wise.
To my shock the cpu was idling at 58 C, the radeon 9600 was only displaying the desktop at 66 C and the case itself was a warm 35 C! I didn't have a thermometer on my other video card but I assumed the same. Voltages were also within limits.
I immediately shut the system down and started checking for problems.
All fans were fine and everything had a good amount of thermal paste. The case intake and exhaust and were spotless and the fans were fine. The only thing that was running cool was the northbridge.
I don't understand what's going on. Excluding me clocking the system up to 166MHZ (from it's initial 133MHZ) I didn't overclock the system yet everything is roasting.

[Harvey]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

What CPU? 58C on something like an Athlon ~ 2GHz isn't unusual. Not that its good - but its not unusual.

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

I'm running an Athlon 3000+ at 2.2GHZ.
I have been more used to a cpu temp between 33 and 40 C in my dual P II.

[WNG]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

Well, as you already discovered, too much thermal compound isn't going to help cooling efficiency. Make sure you didn't slop on the stuff excessively.
You mentioned dielectric grease....IMHO, I don't think it's optimal for heatsinks.

Also, what HSF solution are you using? Is it fed with ambient air or case air?
If it's only adequate, and it's not taking advantage of ambient air, install a flex tube to the HSF in order to provide cooler air source from case vent.

What size are your case fans...their CFM?
If you have a lot of HDDs, a passive northbridge cooler, hot video card, hot psu, then expect higher temps.
IMHO, 35C for case temps sounds normal.
My T'bred B o'c-ed to 2.08 GHz w/ 333 MHz cooled by a good, not great HSF, yields 49-52C. Case temps run 33-35C with quiet low CFM 80mm case fan.

[Galvanized]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

I just came upon this while sorting through some old bookmarked sites. Might be of interest. http://www.gen-x-pc.com/cputemps.htm

[gg1978]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

I've got a mobile Athlon XP Barton at 2.2GHz.. Right now i've got an idle temp of 48 C, and that's in a decent ATX desktop case with decent cooling.. Gets closer to 60C under Prime95...

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

Whoops, sorry for the wait but house cleaning called.
Anyways, Almost all the fans in the case are fed by case air, that's why the front (intake) of the case and the PSU (exhaust) have the highest volume fans: get the air out as fas as possible to prevent warm air being used to cool hot heatsinks. I thought Di-electric grease was used on vehicles for heatsinks? I think I remember a while back that someone here said that the stuff did a good job and no I did not overdo it on applying it. I discovered it is slightly conductive.
The drives are pretty cool and the internal MO drive has a fan built into it.
Good luck trying to fit air tubes in this case.
It's narrow as hell.
The front
The back
What it's like inside.

I would use real heatsink compound if it was not $25 per syringe and Yes I did check and I couldn't find it any cheaper (Even the hobby store gouges).

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

God, it's real bad now.
It was around 32 degrees (Celcius) in the room taday and tha evarage case temp was 56 degrees!
Every part of the case is hot to the touch and the rear is roasting.
This thing is giving off more heat than my three 21" CRT monitors COMBINED!
To make it even creepier, the system is at idle.

[Logistics]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

Dielectric grease is used on things like electrical contacts in the jambs of big sliding doors or mini-vans and such which are used to power door locks and such.

With CPU's who use a metal contact patch you must not use a compound or adhesive which is electrically conductive. Arctic Silver has a warning that you cannot use some of their products on CPU's because the electrical conductivity is too high.


Edit: Also, is the system actually rebooting or something? I always have my case side off and yesterday it was around 100F in my room and my video processor at idle was about 58C, but it's core shutdown temp is around 150C. IIRC, CPU's have a similar shutdown around 150C.

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

is the system actually rebooting or something?

Nope. The system is rock solid when it comes to stability but as the video card heats up you can notice the graphics start to drag a bit (probably temp throttling).

The heatsinks are hot so there is a good thermal link between them and the chips so ventilation comes into play. The temp is notably lower with the sides off but the frame still heats up and the PSU is just pumping out the heat not to mention the system still runs hot. No overloading. The monitor shows all voltages are in the green area. One of the few things in the system that run cool are the hard drives.

[WNG]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

Sounds like you have a ventilation problem....air isn't circulating well inside. Too many cables perhaps? Route them neater, it may help.
Also, does your PSU have 1 or 2 fans? Is it a standard 80mm pulling, or 92-120mm pusher? If I have a pusher fan, and the psu has vents to blow some air towards the dead space at the top of the case, I usually cover them to not allow heated air to circulate into the case.
Play around with your case fans. If you have a puller in the rear and a pusher in front, maybe the case is so restricted that the air is being pushed out the side vents.

Use a candle or cigarette to introduce smoke around the case to see the airflow. Do it sparingly as the smoke smells and not good for the PC.
;D

[WNG]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

As for dielectric grease....it's non-conductive, as the name implies.
As a heatsink compound, I don't know.
We had a thread about using anti-seize compound, and that's not the same stuff.
Permatex Anti-seize, in Al and Cu versions. A lot of fine metal particles suspended in the organic lube.
Conductive too. So careful what cpu you try it on.
I found no problems using it on a Tualatin 1.1 GHz cpu. YMMV.

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

As a heatsink compound, I don't know.

It works reasonably well.
I really wouldn't recommend it for the more hotter and overclocked systems though. I was pushing it but on the plus side it never dries out and comes off easily with a cloth.

Yes, the PSU uses two fans. I guess I'll have to use more fans. I can't do it right now but when I get the chance I'll post a photo is what it's like inside. I'm packing for a six-week trip.

[linuxguru]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

Permatex antiseize is conductive, at least at the high voltage gradient that is found between the spark plug and cylinder head of an engine. It's possible that the binding fluid dries out and forces the Al/Cu particles into direct contact, allowing multiple conducting paths.

[pentium]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

UGH! Not now!

I leave in less than an hour and before so I need to reload my Ipod.
Problem is that the system is getting memory errors now. In some cases a driver is faulting and the system is forced to restart.
When I get back I'm giving my PSU and the motherboard a good look. That heat must of caused something. One thing to note that all the major caps on my board are rubycon but I forget which series.

[Spacedye69]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

With that much hardware in one case, you're going to have to put some holes in the case. 1u rack mount stuff suffers the same heat problems, but they keep the air flow in a straight line. They also use a large qty of noisy fans.

[kikkoman]

Re: Heating problems just won't go away

In case the problem hasn't been solved yet....what motherboard do you use?
I once had a SocketA mobo that was notorious for overheating the CPU with some BIOS versions, while it ran perfectly cool with others.
The Asus A7V had that problem, too.

My 9500 ran pretty hot, too, even with an Arctic VGA Silencer (not to mention the stock cooler), but I got a grip on it with a Zalman cooler which has a HUGE copper surface.
Seems to be normal...just remember the Voodoo3... we once fried an egg on it...