Are bad-cap brands getting better?

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I would use old stock Xicon, but I would not touch anything Lelon.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

According to this document, Xicon and Leon have some sort of agreement, it seems as if Lelon has taken over Xicon's electrolytic division.

But according to this, Lelon did not in the past manufacture Xicon caps:

In which case, should we trust them?

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I have compared Xicons and Lelons. They look identical, aside from the sleeve color and brand name. Also, every store that used to sell Xicon now sells Lelon.

I have heard of motherboards that used Xicon caps, but they may have been recapped.

According to this document, Xicon and Leon have some sort of agreement, it seems as if Lelon has taken over Xicon's electrolytic division.

But according to this, Lelon did not in the past manufacture Xicon caps:

Xicon are good caps but little or none available in the way of low ESR.<snip>

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I have compared Xicons and Lelons. They look identical, aside from the sleeve color and brand name. Also, every store that used to sell Xicon now sells Lelon.

I have heard of motherboards that used Xicon caps, but they may have been recapped.

So are Lelons Xicons or are Xicons Lelons?

Are they okay, either way?

[lti]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I think Xicon has been a victim of globalization as Mouser lists mosts of their stuff as "discontinued". For the record, Xicon is NOT Lelon. From what I can gather Xicon is a reputable American brand and Lelon is Taiwanese garbage. Also Xicon does have some low ESR caps (albeit discontinued but still stocked).

I have compared Xicons and Lelons. They look identical, aside from the sleeve color and brand name. Also, every store that used to sell Xicon now sells Lelon.

I have heard of motherboards that used Xicon caps, but they may have been recapped.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Teapos in a P3 won't fail catastrophically like they will in something that puts more stress on them. Yes, I have countless FSP Teapo PSUs that have failed and are failing. They were used on Phenom X4 machines.

I think Xicon has been a victim of globalization as Mouser lists mosts of their stuff as "discontinued". For the record, Xicon is NOT Lelon. From what I can gather Xicon is a reputable American brand and Lelon is Taiwanese garbage. Also Xicon does have some low ESR caps (albeit discontinued but still stocked).

They're in a P4 machine.

[goodpsusearch]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

From my experience, their KM series seem to be just a bit more reliable, but those aren't low ESR.

Bulging Capxons, mostly KM

Their only excuse is that they should not have been used at smps, as they are not low esr.

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

But do they really? I had Teapos in an old PSU from 2001. 1U PSU in a Optiplex. Tortured that machine, and none of them failed.

Teapos in a P3 won't fail catastrophically like they will in something that puts more stress on them. Yes, I have countless FSP Teapo PSUs that have failed and are failing. They were used on Phenom X4 machines.

Also, Xicon and Lelon caps appear to be identical, aside from the brand name.

I think Xicon has been a victim of globalization as Mouser lists mosts of their stuff as "discontinued". For the record, Xicon is NOT Lelon. From what I can gather Xicon is a reputable American brand and Lelon is Taiwanese garbage. Also Xicon does have some low ESR caps (albeit discontinued but still stocked).

[lti]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Make a video of the load tests. There aren't enough videos of stuff blowing up while running under conditions that may occur in real life. Maybe people will see why they shouldn't use Radio Shack caps on motherboards and power supplies.

Actually, I just want to see something blow up. I have a FU-YU, a few Jackcons, and some Fujicons on the "to blow up" pile. I wonder what they will do.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Ah ok. I haven't been on in a while.

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Perhaps some time. Don't know how to test caps really...Got some general ideas. But idk.

I posted about a capacitor load tester a while back. I'll probably build it in a month or so.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I think you get assurance when buying a Japanese capacitor. When you buy some of these other brands, you might be getting a good product...but you don't really know. It's a mystery.

I kind of want to do some experiments and use some of these brands, especially Lelons. Some "toughness tests".

Perhaps some time. Don't know how to test caps really...Got some general ideas. But idk.

[c_hegge]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I'll trust teapo when I stop seeing them failed from 2 and 3 yr old PSUs

[momaka]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

But I've been starting to wonder. Are we beating on something that no longer exists? I know Japanese caps (and the other good ones) will probably be better forever, but are the other "inferior" brands really that inferior anymore?

OST for sure. Perhaps not so bad in well-cooled power supplies, but they do horrible on motherboards (either dry out and die with no visible sign or they do bulge if it's very hot, like in those mini Shuttle computers).

Teapo caps are okay with good cooling. Like OST, they don't do well on motherboards. They're much better in power supplies, though. Occasionally, one or two will go bad for no apparent reason. Perhaps it has a lot to do with the batches. Generally, I would consider them good, but they are not as consistent with their quality as the Japanese brands, and that's what I think often brings them down.

L-tec are not very good either, but they seem to do fairly well in those OEM Delta power supplies for Dell/Gateway/HP/etc. Most likely good design on Delta's part.

Su'scon I'm not sure where to put. Haven't seen too many bad ones, and they do seem to do okay in computer power supplies as well.

CapXon - very inconsistent quality. They do, however, consistently fail with visible signs in hot places, such as in LCD monitor power supplies.
- Good job, CapXon, at least your vents are working properly .
From my experience, their KM series seem to be just a bit more reliable, but those aren't low ESR.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Well honestly, I've bought a lot of Jap caps, and theyre great....but, they're really expensive. I buy primarily Panasonic, and with FCs being $1+/cap, I can see why manufacturers go for the Lelons or the Teapos.

[lti]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I have seen a lot of motherboards using the bright green Lelons. I even saw a Gigabyte board with Lelon caps for the tiny caps.
Also, Xicon and Lelon caps appear to be identical, aside from the brand name.
Considering the amount of monitor and TV cap kits I've seen that had Xicon caps in them and the amount of idiots that buy general purpose Xicons and Lelons at Radio Shack to replace low ESR caps, they might not be that bad. I've even used them in locations that did not require high temperature, low ESR caps.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Teapos and OST in PSUs will fail within a relatively short time in PSUs especially in MATX cases where they are exposed to more heat.

Also, no one knows for sure how much ripple they're failing to suppress and are introducing to the motherboard circuits when they still are functioning.

But do they really? I had Teapos in an old PSU from 2001. 1U PSU in a Optiplex. Tortured that machine, and none of them failed.

I know that's only one instance, but I don't get the hatred for Teapos. OSTs I could see....

But I've been starting to wonder. Are we beating on something that no longer exists? I know Japanese caps (and the other good ones) will probably be better forever, but are the other "inferior" brands really that inferior anymore?

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Capxon are very bad capacitors. I see them fail all the time...

Teapo and OST are probably ok, depending on the right series selection (not putting GP caps in place of entry level low esr caps for example) and how much heat they get.



And one question by me: Are Lelon capacitors getting better?

They even have a good bung now, in comparison to the cheap round bungs the majority of bad caps uses...

Had the same question about Lelon. I caught Asus using them on a sound card, and I'm trying to see if Asus is just being dumb (likely) or if Lelon is getting better.

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Teapos and OST in PSUs will fail within a relatively short time in PSUs especially in MATX cases where they are exposed to more heat.

Also, no one knows for sure how much ripple they're failing to suppress and are introducing to the motherboard circuits when they still are functioning.

[Dgtech]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I just had a vivid thought.
Follow me on this one.

What if:

Since the World Wide Web is worldwide, and if you type in a product model number of a power supply you were looking to buy, and find it on www.badcaps.net, and if that just happens keep you from buying it... multiply this times a few thousand people over the course of a year... It might just have a trickle down effect on component manufacturers.

I know, run on sentence. Capxon (the worse) and other brands of bad caps have given bad names to good companies that have been making excelent products for years. It's only a matter of time before it shows in their profit margin. Then they go after the component manufacturers. Maybe they have to make a better product to make a sell or else.

It's just a thought. It's a longshot.
Don't underestimate the power of the internet.

Badcaps.net rules!