3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

[mockingbird]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

If they'd made them 10x35mm, it would have been ideal. They're a tad underspec'd for my liking. I'm using them right now in a 450W PSU which probably never draws even more than 250w peak and they're fine. But I'd imagine in a hot and heavily loaded PSU, you'd want something a little better. They are a bit puny.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

You have the spec wrong.

Prove me wrong. I have been sourcing from official Samxon datasheet which I also have printed as a nice catalogue directly from Man Yue. The same for KMG official datasheet.

Official datasheets state KMG to be much worse than RS. You on the other hand have only some wild ideas in your hand. Forgive me but who do you think I will believe?

As for their endurance, I have Samxons RS in Enermax Liberty 400 W for several years now. Last at least year and half, I don't know exactly, the PSU is being loaded with 80-100% output power 16 hours a day. Absolutely no problem with that so far, gonna measure the caps as soon as ESR Micro arives. Also 500W Liberty used CEC 3300uF caps. All of the high-quality PSUs with KY and such have 2200 uF only as they don't make higher capacity.

Looking at RS datasheet the "confirmed" RC of 1675mA makes sense to me, RS 10x20=1228, 10x25=1447 so every 5mm increase = 200+ mA increase.

You have noticed the ripple increases with can size, voltage AND capacitance also, haven't you? Just that I don't see why you base your opinion of 1000uF cap when we are talking about 3300uF…

[SIDMX]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Man Yue Part No. Series Cap Vol Size Packing Unit Price/USD Lead Time MOQ/MPQ
ERS338M1CG30RRS0P ERS 3300 10 10*30 RR 0.167 6 weeks 4800/200
ERS338M1CG30RRS0P ERS 3300 16 10*30 RR 0.173 6 weeks 4800/200

So were talking about a 10x30mm cap right? ... ok then read below

You have noticed the ripple increases with can size, voltage AND capacitance also, haven't you? Just that I don't see why you base your opinion of 1000uF cap when we are talking about 3300uF…

The answer lies right before your eyes in that datasheet excerpt that you've posted, can size is what dictates RC & Impedance ratings in RS series, it doesn't matter if it is 1000uf or 3300uf or if it is 6.3v or 50v, can size is the key and you can see this all across the datasheet...
btw..i'm still IN for RS

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

I surrender, you got me here

Still, KMG's 1000h life is too low for any serious use in PSU…and the RC is too much on the low side for me…almost everything you may replace with the KMGs has higher (specified) RC…

[mockingbird]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Behemot - I was going to wait till I got the response about the KMG series cap to point out that the spec for the Samxon RS cap came straight from the mouth of Man Yue (As if it wasn't already obvious from my post), but I still haven't gotten a response yet on the official ripple rating of the unlisted 10x40mm part.

1000 hours at 105c... Perfectly fine for a PSU... Not as good as Samxon RS, but close to it, and still a viable option for the 12V rail. My point was that Samxon RS is not that much better than KMG, and that if you were going to place a custom order for 16V 3300uF caps in 10mm, why not order something really unique like the aforementioned 10x50mm UCC KY series cap...

Nothing personal, but you chose quantity over quality. At least you gave me a good dream of a 10x50mm cap... drool

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Yes, I prefer quantity now. The RS can back me up for a few years maybe because I can sell them cheaper and still get better profit. As long as they have been perfectly fine so far I prefer them.

KMG may be good but as I sad, they are barely low-ESR and if you call 1/5 of the life a perfectly fine, than…

Take it as this: RS are minimum quality wise for me. KMG may be not that far but are just below. KY are top but too expensive to use them in crappy 350W PSUs and I just cannot afford that. Now I can make money on RS and than buy KY with that. You see the point?

[SIDMX]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

...Still, KMG's 1000h life is too low for any serious use in PSU…and the RC is too much on the low side for me…almost everything you may replace with the KMGs has higher (specified) RC…

Well I take endurance numbers just like and indicator but not like absolute truth (for any cap), i see both of you (and several others in BC) have good experiences (so far) using RS so that is a better indicator to me than just the numbers, OTOH IDK anyone with experience using KMG in PSUs so thats enough for the moment to discard it, about the RC rating of KMG i think it's perfectly good as long as it is not used to replace a cap with better ratings but the same applies to any other cap so don't see anything wrong with that, what I just don't get is why KMG at 10x40 prices are that high specially being a GP cap even good KYs at 10x30 have lower prices specially in larger quantities ...maybe supply-demand ?

With some modifications it may do 350 W quite fine, 400 W max.
At what power does it shut down?

I want to thank you for that "mind poking" in the PSU pictorial thread , I've been doing some research about that stinky PSU (Acteck AFB-500P) and I'm getting closer to understand what can be done to make it better and what kind of protections are actually implemented, don't want to hijack more this thread with what has been done already to PSU so maybe i'll be creating a new thread about this rebuild/upgrade in the future.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Well I take endurance numbers just like and indicator but not like absolute truth (for any cap), i see both of you (and several others in BC) have good experiences (so far) using RS so that is a better indicator to me than just the numbers, …

Exactly, even the crap caps list whatever fantastic looking specs in datasheet. The thing is, good caps are those you can believe they can do what they have spec'ced. I think it's proved enough that at least some lines from Man Yue are good now.

If we take the aproximation of life doubling with every 10 °C lower temperature, than at 55 °C you can get less than 4 years from from KMG. I more like 20 years view with RS

[SIDMX]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

...why not order something really unique like the aforementioned 10x50mm UCC KY series cap.

I also would have preferred KY/KYA, but I was late to the party and the decision have already been taken, if a custom order for KY ever happen count me in.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Just letting you know guys, RS are manufactured and on the way to warehouse where I will have them picked up by courier.

[mockingbird]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Can you post pics when you get them? Also, don't forget the obligatory smell test.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Sure

I'd add some ESR/capacitance readings, but the ESR Micro is still somewhere at russian customs. It's more than 2 months now, I don't really like that…

[SIDMX]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Just letting you know guys, RS are manufactured and on the way to warehouse where I will have them picked up by courier.

Great! I'm really needing these caps.

...I was going to wait till I got the response about the KMG series cap

Any news about KMG specs?

EDIT: Good to know there are other options, BTW can you post the entire Man Yue catalogue? or link it?

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

I am also trying to determine whether Samxon can make something in D10x35 mm casing.

If not, there still are Samxons GT with obligatory D10x30 mm casing with ESR of 1910 (vs 1675 for RS) and 1000 hours longer life.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Have it confirmed, Man Yue can make Samxons GT in D10x35 mm casing with aprox. 2200 mA ripple current.

[mockingbird]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Any news about KMG specs?

This is all I got back from Mouser:
"LINE 1:The ESR for KMG is calculated from the DF and capacitance. DF0.24 Cap 100uFESR=3.981 Ohms This is the max ESR at 120 Hz"

I think Behemot was right in that the ESR is too high for KMG.

Have it confirmed, Man Yue can make Samxons GT in D10x35 mm casing with aprox. 2200 mA ripple current.

That's good news. Same price as RS?

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Haven't asked for price actually, but I asume it will be cheaper than KYA. Besided that, they are actually very similar, GT has slightly longer life than RS, as KYA has over KY (and RS).

[mockingbird]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

Just for reference, 10x30 Samxon GT is 0.031 esr 1910 ripple. Is GT a reliable series?

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

I don't have informations about the opposite.

[Behemot]

Re: 3300uF low-ESR caps suitable to PSUs in D10mm - may be possible!!

I don't know why But package is in France now. I guess it should be delivered to me by the end of next week, including delay of procedures and ransom from customs.