LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

But the lines still stay there and still stay at the same color (red pixels), the OSD menu is sitting on top of the lines, since the border is white due to blue and green pixels are also turned on to make white border so the line is blended in with the border, if the border has difference color then you will see the effect of stuck red pixels, same for the green lines.
So did you try cooling the COF to see if it has the effect on the red lines or not?
BTW, I do not see the horizontal lines in your pictures.

[rccrasher65]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Looks like panel failure to me.

+1 panel failure!

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

But the lines still stay there and still stay at the same color (red pixels), the OSD menu is sitting on top of the lines, since the border is white due to blue and green pixels are also turned on to make white border so the line is blended in with the border, if the border has difference color then you will see the effect of stuck red pixels, same for the green lines.
So did you try cooling the COF to see if it has the effect on the red lines or not?
BTW, I do not see the horizontal lines in your pictures.

Heres some better pictures. Im afraid i may have wasted money on that tcon. Im feeling its a panel issue as well now.

Not sure why the photos rotated sorry

[budwich]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

you can try disconnect, one at a time, the cables going from the tcon to the panel and see what the result is (of course, do this when not powered up).

It could be a panel issue but not necessarily unfixable as it might be a problem on the bottom edge board with a smd component that might be carefully replaced... maybe.

Further, when you cleaned the tcon cables, did you clean / seat BOTH ends... not just the ones at the tcon?

One other things... the "soccer ball hit" might have been a "window wash"... :-) check around the bottom edge boards and tab bond areas at the panel for signs of contamination.

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

you can try disconnect, one at a time, the cables going from the tcon to the panel and see what the result is (of course, do this when not powered up).

It could be a panel issue but not necessarily unfixable as it might be a problem on the bottom edge board with a smd component that might be carefully replaced... maybe.

Further, when you cleaned the tcon cables, did you clean / seat BOTH ends... not just the ones at the tcon?

One other things... the "soccer ball hit" might have been a "window wash"... :-) check around the bottom edge boards and tab bond areas at the panel for signs of contamination.

I did clean both sides of the cable. This one is a huge pain in the ass. The bottom flex pcbs are completely covered by the metal casing over the full back of the tv. The only way to get to it is to completely disassemble the panel. And they seem fused to the panel so theres no removing them. I dont see hardly any circuitry on them either though. Just a few resistors and capacitors. No IC's or anything like that.

Perhaps all that is on the TCON? This is a rather large TCON with a lot more stuff going on then the normal type.

[budwich]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

I don't think that those cables are bonded to the panel. There is usually an edge board that they are terminated on. The edge board then has bonded tabs that go along to various portions of the panel along with running a connection to the side of the panel (at the corner connection). You need to remove the front bezel to inspect the tabs at the bottom that may have a problem with them.

As for cleaning "both sides"... I was referring to both ends... you need to locate the other end. Unless this set is unusual, most sets have access by removing the protection plate / bracket.... you need to look closer to see how it can be disassembled.... I think.

Anyway, as suggested, what happens when you do the "one cable disconnected" test?

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

I don't think that those cables are bonded to the panel. There is usually an edge board that they are terminated on. The edge board then has bonded tabs that go along to various portions of the panel along with running a connection to the side of the panel (at the corner connection). You need to remove the front bezel to inspect the tabs at the bottom that may have a problem with them.

As for cleaning "both sides"... I was referring to both ends... you need to locate the other end. Unless this set is unusual, most sets have access by removing the protection plate / bracket.... you need to look closer to see how it can be disassembled.... I think.

Anyway, as suggested, what happens when you do the "one cable disconnected" test?

Pictures below of one disconnected. No change. Im including a picture of where the edge board is. Its blocked by a metal face plate that goes around the whole tv. When i tried to take the face plate the whole panel came lose. So this face plate keeps everything together.

Ive taken apart a panel once and i know how fragile they are so im nervous going that route til i know theres no better choices.

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Since the tab bonding boards are on the bottom edge of the panel, I suspect the damages to be from cleaning fluid.

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Since the tab bonding boards are on the bottom edge of the panel, I suspect the damages to be from cleaning fluid.

Theres no chance at all this is a board problem of some sort?

[budwich]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Pictures below of one disconnected. No change. Im including a picture of where the edge board is. Its blocked by a metal face plate that goes around the whole tv. When i tried to take the face plate the whole panel came lose. So this face plate keeps everything together.

Ive taken apart a panel once and i know how fragile they are so im nervous going that route til i know theres no better choices.

"normally" (on lots of sets), the side that is disconnected shows a white screen as opposed to black.

You need to repeat the test with the other side... that will tell more since the picture you post has vertical lines. It doesn't look good.

The third picture appears to show the bottom edge board where the cable is terminated to.

You need to remove the front bezel to look at the tab bonds... you will likely find your answer as to whats up once you see that area.

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Theres no chance at all this is a board problem of some sort?

What do mean by no chance? I guess you never have experience with damages on the tab bonding board due to liquid damage.

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

What do mean by no chance? I guess you never have experience with damages on the tab bonding board due to liquid damage.

Yeah. No. Ive never seen that before. What would you do to repair that?

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

If the corrosion is really bad and eats away the traces then there is nothing you do to fix it.

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Example: https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showth...LN40B540P8FXZA

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Thanks guys. i have it stripped down and the bonds look fine. Nothing really going on there from what i can see..

I used the tape method suggested earlier and it worked. Lines gone. Good picture.

Can anyone explain to me because im really curious why that works. Like i understand if theres a short in the panel taping that one off will fix the issue. But how does it have a perfect picture? I thought thered be a line or something that stays to show where the true short is or something. especially since.. you know.. theres traces not getting power. How can it be showing a good picture?!

[budm]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

So which connector of the two you taped off, can we see the pictures of the taped off section?
Pictures of the LCD panel with the metal frames removed?
Screenshots of the good pictures?

[Demonata08]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

So which connector of the two you taped off, can we see the pictures of the taped off section?
Pictures of the LCD panel with the metal frames removed?
Screenshots of the good pictures?

I actually have it kinda together now. It was the 3rd pin on the left side that i taped off. I took a good picture of it working now.

I think we can pretty well close this one. Its a panel defect. I still have a new tcon coming in a few days that ill pop in and report back what happens. Thanks for the help guys

[budwich]

Re: LN46B610A5F Vertical and Horizontal lines

Its not a tcon problem. The "tape cutoff" technique "isolates" driver issues at the panel such that certain drivers (related to the circuit that is being cutoff) are no longer "loading down" other drivers ... these are usually associated with the horizontal "pairs" (ones on both sides). In addition, on certain types of sets, same drivers load drive lines of some of the vertical drivers causing issues to them.

good to see that the tape cutoff method resulted in a good picture. The set can run in this mode "indefinitely"... if the remaining drivers don't fail which will then result in "total failure" / non working set.