Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

[PCBONEZ]

This occurs with the SmartPower series and I think some of their others.

I see reports of this all over and some mention of it having something to do with +5vsb but most of that information is posted (where ever) by non-techs and there's no definitive (component) cause given.

What is the actual cause?
Has anyone managed to find the fix?

~ Thanks ~

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[Krankshaft]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

I just converted an Antec SmartPower 500 Watt PSU to power my Xbox 360 since the stock brick gets way to hot.

This is my second Antec SmartPower recap the first was on my personal PC which I caught early. After the recap the first PSU was so reliable I decided to get another one.

I bought it as working from E-bay however it didn't work . I expected to recap it as soon as I got it but I didn't know it would be in unusable shape out of the box.

Just after plugging it in when the standby 5 volt supply came on there was a horrible whine from the standby transformer. This was caused by bad standby capacitors (two Fukyuu 1000uf 10 volt jobs). They are located right behind the rear exhaust fan and can be checked for bulging without removing the cover. They are general purpose on the standby line but are low ESR on the secondary side.

To do the proper thing I always replace the standby caps with low ESR versions. Panasonic FC has a small diameter (8mm) tall cap that fits perfectly here.

If they are bulged a complete recap will be in order that includes the secondary caps which cannot be seen.

Upon closer inspection the standby transformer probably was getting hotter then it should of due to the bad standby caps. The board was slightly darkened which can be seen in the picture which was not on my other PSU since I caught the caps early.

There was no damage to the transformer however that showed that those 2 caps left unchecked wouldn't be good for the transformer.

It seems like the person before me ran it 24/7 as temperature rises ESR falls so bad ESR caps can still function in some capacity.

But when the caps cool down all hell breaks loose and the ESR rises again causing all kinds of problems like the one below.

I decided to try to power up this thing anyways even though the standby was whining before I tear into it. So I hit the power button on the test PC and the PSU was surging like crazy the power light was flickering on and off 1 time each second. The hard drive was spinning up then shutting down. The 12 volt rail was all over the place.

After the standby caps were replaced I powered the supply up and the whine was gone. After recapping the secondaries the PSU was back in business with no problems.

[kc8adu]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

fuhkkyu strikes again.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

Thanks Krankshaft.
I wanted to know if the initial problem was totally a caps problem of if I'd need some other part to fix it.

I think your other thread was my inspiration.
-
I'm doing kind of the same thing.
I have one on order with intentions of recapping it. (Not here yet.)
I'm doing it about 1/2 cause I need a spare work bench PSU and 1/2 just cause I wanna look at a SmartPower Series PSU.

Do you have a complete caps list for it?
I wanna do the dinky ones too.

--

Later when this one is done I'm going to do the same thing with a True Power (ONE) series a.k.a. "True" or "True Control". The series just before TP2.
[So if anyone has a complete caps list for those.]

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[Krankshaft]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

If you want to replace the smaller ones too you will need some tweezers since two 4.7 ufs are between the heatsink and the transformers.

I don't have a list but I have a ziplock bag with all of the old crapacitiors in it.

This was a SmartPower 500W but other SPs should be similar.

Make sure to desolder the 2 white voltage selector wires then the AC input wires and work on the board outside the case.

On my first supply I didn't do this and it was a real pain flipping the board back and forth. I actually ended up snapping the lead off of the Y capacitor right where the lead goes into the case from all of the turning back and fourth so I had to order another one from Mouser and wait a week to test the supply out.

The second time around I removed it from the case and it was so much easier and no broken Y cap.

Secondary Supply:

All low ESR caps here.

4700uf 6.3V Qty 2
3300uf 16V
2200uf 10V
1000uf 10V
330uf 16V

The two 4700uf will need some coaxing to fit since the FCs are 12.5 mm diameter I gently desoldered and tilted the 3.3V inductor to fit the rear 4700 uf and the front 4700 uf was a few mms off of the board.

Standby Supply:

Was originally General Purpose but use low ESR here too.

1000uf 10V Qty 2

(Make sure that you get these in 8mm diameter and tall)

The Panasonic FC series has the right one. Using a cap too big here can cause the exhaust fan blades to hit the standby caps when it turns on luckily I had the right size. Ask me how I know ?

On to the little buggers:

They will either be Fukyuu as in this supply or Koshin brand which my previous PSU had.

From here on in you can use General Purpose caps since thats what the originals are.

Be careful one of these caps was mounted in a place where a resistor should have been and I wasted 15 minutes tracing the circuit out so that I wouldn't install this cap backwards.

0.1uf 50V
10uf 50V Qty 2
0.33uf 50V (I replaced this one with 0.47 uf this cap size varies from model to model any value from 0.33 uf to 1 uf will work fine)
1uf 50V Qty 3
47uf 50V
4.7uf 50V Qty 2
22uf 50V
220uf 16V

Onto the fan controller riser card:

These caps are miniature but you can use full size caps easily. I just used full size. Be careful with the surface mount parts on this PCB when desoldering the caps work slowly.

10uf 16V (Bent Over)
22uf 16V Qty 4
0.22 50V

That should do it.

[Krankshaft]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

Oh yeah I forgot the measurements for the 2 standby caps they should be 8mm in diameter by 20mm tall. This will prevent any fan blade rubbing from using caps that are too big.

I used the Panasonic FC series Pana part number EEUFC1A102L you can see it in the FC datasheet.

Your digital micrometer is your friend when measuring for proper sized caps in tight places.

Well I'm wiped going to bed.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

I really just wanna know what the old ones were.
-
I might use FC's for some but I'm want to replace with original diameters so FC won't always work for me.
I know have to go down in uF for the 4700uF filters but I'm going to much better ESR/Ripple when I do. I will use 3300uF there which has been tested to work fine by a few members here.
I have random quantities of MBZ, FJ, ZL, KZE, LXZ, PW and a few others left over from other projects so if they are appropriate I'll be using them.

The one coming is an SP-450P. It think it will be the same as yours.
I do have some TP2's here so I have some idea about the basic layout.

...

Do I have this straight.
PLEASE double check I guessed the original diameters right.

[2] 4700uf 6.3V [10mm]
3300uf 16V [10mm]
2200uf 10V [10mm]
1000uf 10V [8mm ???]
330uf 16V [8mm ??? 6.3mm ???]

[2] 1000uf 10V [8mm]

0.1uf 50V [5mm]
[2] 10uf 50V [5mm]
0.33uf 50V [5mm]
[3] 1uf 50V [5mm]
47uf 50V [6.3mm]
[2] 4.7uf 50V [5mm]
22uf 50V [5mm]
220uf 16V [6.3mm]

10uf 16V [5mm]
[4] 22uf 16V [5mm]
0.22 50V [5mm]

My TP2 fan controls don't even have lytics. They are regular disc caps.

.

[Krankshaft]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

Wow you're good all are correct the 330uf at 16 Volts is a 6.3mm.

The SP will have lytics on the fan control board on the both I recapped they had them.

I haven't cracked open my one TP 2 I have because when I looked through the exhaust fan Teapos were on the standby line so I decided to leave it in service for awhile longer.

Its good to know that if I do need to recap it down the line I don't have to mess with the fan board on that one though.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

Hi
The version I got is an SP-450P
The P means with PFC.
The cap count is a bit different than yours.

[2] 4700uf 6.3V [10mm] TM
[1] 3300uf 16V [10mm] TM
[1] 2200uf 10V [10mm] TM
[1] 1000uf 10V [8mm] TM

[2] 1000uf 10V [8mm] TN
[1] 330uf 16V [6.3mm] TN
[1] 220uf 16V [6.3mm] TN
[2] 47uf 50V [6.3mm] TN

[1] 0.1uf 50V [5mm] TN
[1] 0.22 50V [4mm] TN
[1] 0.33uf 50V [5mm] TN
[3] 1uf 50V [5mm] TN
[2] 4.7uf 50V [5mm] TN
[2] 10uf 50V [5mm] TN
[1] 22uf 50V [5mm] TN

~Fan~
[1] 10uf 16V [5mm] TN
[4] 22uf 16V [5mm] TN
~Primary~
[2] 470uF 200v [22mm] LP
[1] 2.2uF 400v [8mm] (Teapo)

.
The cool thing is I thought it was used. This has never been used!
Seal isn't (wasn't) broken. Not a speck of dust in it anywhere.
-
I'm gonna be able to measure the ESR on some uncooked Fuhjyyu's which is something I've been wanting to do.

.

[c_hegge]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

I replaced the two 1000uF 5vsb caps and the secondaries on an SP400, and the small 22uF 50V, but the whine/squeal persists. I have it running right next to me as I am typing this post and it's giving me a headache. Are there any other caps that would likely be causing this?

[Toasty]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

Paper towel tube to ear. Use as stethoscope to localize whine, then troubleshoot that circuit.

SMD's on this? Check for cracked/cold joints on (chip) resistors or transformer.

Toast


[EDIT: chip resistors ]

[i4004]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...3&postcount=55

and as for explanation, it belongs here too:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...27&postcount=5

worth adding: too low esr is probably making the circuit resonate (as explained here
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showth...0091#post90091 ), and then you have whining....

now you have (more or less) the whole story.

[POM_MJ]

Re: Antec High Pitched Whine - Cause?

thanks to I4004 and momaka
"Figure 6" in section "5. Decoupling" from "bypassing.pdf"
if I understand correctly,
cap before Pi filter is used to decoupling, it should be use standard cap 105c with satisfy ESR. to decreases noise (ripple, resonance caused high pitch sound in this case).
cap after Pi filter is used to bypassing, it should be use low ESR. cap to increases bypass current.