HP Dv9000 shuts off

[senchire]

So have this one around here (ye again one).
Turn on and it gives me the 6 displays, so I thought its oke reflow and see will it work. After cleaning (red epoxy) I wanted to try out will it work, and it turns off after 2 sec O.o. The hell could happen during the cleaning the expoy let the gpu connections get worse?
I had these problems with dv9000/6000 but it never happened after cleaning.
(still haven't reflowed)

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

I've seen that happen a few times. Reflow it and it should work, until it dies again. Btw you don't even need to clean the epoxy if you're just going to do a reflow on these, as it's the chip itself and never the solder balls.

[senchire]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Well reflow didn't fix my problem .

[mmartell]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

I've seen that happen a few times. Reflow it and it should work, until it dies again. Btw you don't even need to clean the epoxy if you're just going to do a reflow on these, as it's the chip itself and never the solder balls.

Do you mean that the chips internal connections are temporarily restored by the heat gun or what exactly does the reflow do if it's not to repair the solder balls ?

[Ramee]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

So have this one around here (ye again one).
Turn on and it gives me the 6 displays, so I thought its oke reflow and see will it work. After cleaning (red epoxy) I wanted to try out will it work, and it turns off after 2 sec O.o. The hell could happen during the cleaning the expoy let the gpu connections get worse?
I had these problems with dv9000/6000 but it never happened after cleaning.
(still haven't reflowed)

The only way to fix it is to replace vga chipsetl with a new one.

[senchire]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Well I had 6 screens, I know that is a logical follow that the gpu comes to this point (2sec off) because thats how it slowly fails . But that a cleaning could make it do that ^^ never knew.

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Do you mean that the chips internal connections are temporarily restored by the heat gun or what exactly does the reflow do if it's not to repair the solder balls ?

Yes. That's how it is for those nvidia chipsets. The soldering of the chips to the board has always been flawless (they use 0.6mm solder balls), the problem is internal to the chip itself.

[senchire]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

So ppl's exchange chip or reball it? (maybe epoxy is ruining connection on one solder point, had few of them were 1 piece of epoxy went under balls when it was in liquid).

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Haven't seen one in a while tbh. Okay, besides my own which i use every day. The last dv9000 i fixed was AMD with nvidia 7600 and the fault was the SPP100 Northbridge, not the GPU. I have replaced the SPP100 in that one.

When i first powered it up i had a lot of stuff to install - apparently the wifi had already gone out (due to the bad NB) when Windows was last installed on it.

And yes epoxy can get in the way when trying to lift the chip, that's why you have to clean it as good as possible. But it cannot damage the soldering when you reflow it. The GPU has just crapped itself in yours.

[senchire]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Yea haven't seen them like 6months, then I got like 4, from which 2 are working without any problems. While I got still this dv9000 and one dv6000 (which worked fine after a GPU reflow, then it went into reboot loop had to reball it to get it work).

Yea pieces of crap they are , but customers don't wanna chip exchange just the lowest end cost repair.

[mmartell]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Yes. That's how it is for those nvidia chipsets. The soldering of the chips to the board has always been flawless (they use 0.6mm solder balls), the problem is internal to the chip itself.

Is it not much more common to have bga solder problems due to lead free solder ? I have an Onkyo receiver which I believe the DTS ic has failed. People say a reflow fixes it temporarily but that the chip is actually flawed. I wonder if this is the exact scenario...

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Yea haven't seen them like 6months, then I got like 4, from which 2 are working without any problems. While I got still this dv9000 and one dv6000 (which worked fine after a GPU reflow, then it went into reboot loop had to reball it to get it work).

Yea pieces of crap they are , but customers don't wanna chip exchange just the lowest end cost repair.

I know. I had stock of SPP100. I think i still have a couple. With more expensive chips like 8600 or god-forbid, MCP67, replacement is out the window, it is just not worth it anymore for these machines. But same customers that want the lowest cost repair then come back and yell at us coz their pile of trash failed again. You just can't teach common sense to some people.

Is it not much more common to have bga solder problems due to lead free solder ? I have an Onkyo receiver which I believe the DTS ic has failed. People say a reflow fixes it temporarily but that the chip is actually flawed. I wonder if this is the exact scenario...

Yes, the usual problems are due to the lead-free solder used in board assembly, however the 2006-2009 nvidias were a special case. Google it, the info is everywhere.

What they did is screw up the materials holding the die (the shiny stuff in the middle of the chip) to the substrate (the green stuff that solders to the PCB), along with underspec'ing the current carrying capacity of the solder bumps that connect the die to the substrate, and using higher supply voltages than necessary. All this led to chips that basically desolder themselves from the inside. Most sites that researched the issue focused only on the materials, but i've found that the issue has more to do with internal heating due to the resistance of the connections inside the chip, rather than everything else.

This is confirmed by the fact that the new, "fixed" chips (the ones manufactured 2010 or newer), besides doing a much better job at staying alive, also run cooler than the old ones they replace. If the "fix" were a simple materials change, the working temperatures would've been identical.

The situation can be improved considerably by lowering the core voltage (undervolting) after a reflow or reball on such a chip. I've yet to have a laptop with an undervolted chip fail, and it's almost 1 year from the first one.

I do not know about your Onkyo receiver, sorry.

[mmartell]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

I need to find the service bulletin on it. Part of the repair was to undervolt the ic in question.

Btw, these DV9000's are they food machines ? I picked one up last visit to the dump. It's near mint but I seem to recall when messing with it that it was a bit flaky where booting was concerned.

Thanks for the info and my apologies to senchire for muscling in.

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Flaky when booting? Likely the AMD version then... If the hard drive is good, then it can be either the NB or the SB. I'd say NB though.

Open a new thread, remove the mainboard from the machine and tell us what board it's got.

[mmartell]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Ok will do. Thanks.

[MDY]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

Hi Th3_uN1Qu3
How did you undervolting the GPU core voltage?

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

It depends on the particular board you have. It is a hardware mod involving replacing a resistor in the GPU power circuit or soldering in parallel of another resistor of the right value.

[MDY]

Re: HP Dv9000 shuts off

And this way you think GPU will work more time?
How much did you undervolt? 0.1V?