AC to Ground?

[EasyGoing1]

OK, I'm not asking if this is a good idea ... cause I know it's not ... but I am curious ...

IF you connect the supply side of an AC line to a circuit and the other side of the circuit to earth ground ... will it power up?

[stj]

Re: AC to Ground?

it should, but it will trip any RCD or GFCI on the circuit.

[dmill89]

Re: AC to Ground?

OK, I'm not asking if this is a good idea ... cause I know it's not ... but I am curious ...

IF you connect the supply side of an AC line to a circuit and the other side of the circuit to earth ground ... will it power up?

it should, but it will trip any RCD or GFCI on the circuit.

Yes, unless as stj stated the circuit has GFCI protection, however you will potentially make the entire ground circuit in the building "live" in the process (although current limited by the device, i.e. something like an LED lightbulb would only be a few mA, while something like an electric heater or toaster 10A+ which could give a nasty shock, anything that is metal and grounded could now potentially be "live", though current will take the path of least resistance so it depends on the distance the load is from the panel, and how conductive whoever touches it is if they would get a shock or not). In the US electrical system neutral and ground are bonded at the main panel, however ground is intended as a "safety" in the event of an electrical fault and should not be made used as a neutral and made "live" (even though a neutral isn't "hot" doesn't mean it does not have any current on it, if a device on the circuit is drawing current that current will be on the neutral (due to the "alternating" aspect of AC).

[ReeceyBurger123]

Re: AC to Ground?

I wouldn’t advise it tbh, keep all mains stuff as it should be.

[sam_sam_sam]

Re: AC to Ground?

OK, I'm not asking if this is a good idea ... cause I know it's not ... but I am curious ...

IF you connect the supply side of an AC line to a circuit and the other side of the circuit to earth ground ... will it power up?

The only reason why you would do this is if you are testing a grounding rod for a machine or if you are using a grounding rod at your house but make sure that you do not have a GFCI circuit or outlet while doing this test you will trip it if it is working correctly

Use caution while doing this test if you have not done this test before

This test is done with a 100 watt incandescent light bulb which should light up at full brightness if you have a good grounding rod connection

[eccerr0r]

Re: AC to Ground?

If you're thinking about a way to save a wire, no, likely getting an equivalent good ground is unlikely and you'll end up with lots of different voltages around, generating ground loops...but yes with a proper ground it should work as it's "theoretically" equivalent, hence the electrocution danger and the need for isolation transformers where there's a risk of accidentally grounding a live wire through a human.

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

If you're thinking about a way to save a wire

My curiosity was purely academic.

[stj]

Re: AC to Ground?

it can be used at very low current - i use it to power neons in lamp switches.
(find the switch in the dark. )

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

it can be used at very low current - i use it to power neons in lamp switches.
(find the switch in the dark. )

Have you ever stood under large high-power transmission lines with a fluorescent bulb tube (like what you often see in a garage) and held one end on the ground and watch it light up? It's ... interesting ...

[sam_sam_sam]

Re: AC to Ground?

Have you ever stood under large high-power transmission lines with a fluorescent bulb tube (like what you often see in a garage) and held one end on the ground and watch it light up? It's ... interesting ...

This does not sound like something you would want to do very long microwave oven do the same thing so really can not be good for you in the long run

[stj]

Re: AC to Ground?

Have you ever stood under large high-power transmission lines with a fluorescent bulb tube (like what you often see in a garage) and held one end on the ground and watch it light up? It's ... interesting ...

seen it done - that's why you get cancer clusters under power lines and why the land is cheap.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXxQKUPB0vs

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

This does not sound like something you would want to do very long microwave oven do the same thing so really can not be good for you in the long run

It was something I did once around 20 years ago.

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

Your intresting things will get you or some killed. Asking questions when you should know better just shows how stupid you are. Go lick some 110v ac and tell us how it went for you, moron.

Never been electrocuted in the 50 years I've been on this planet.

Funny that you call me the idiot, yet I'm the one asking questions, and you're the one asserting that I do things I don't ever do ... Pretty hostile for someone who doesn't even know me ... your posts are VERY "Troll-ish" if you ask me.

[stj]

Re: AC to Ground?

Never been electrocuted in the 50 years I've been on this planet.

that's lame - your not trying hard enough.
my best yet - 16KV from a 14inch crt anode!!!

[eccerr0r]

Re: AC to Ground?

Not quite as good as a CRT anode, but I stuck my hand across a photoflash flash capacitor I thought was discharged... yow. "Test before touching" ...

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

that's lame - your not trying hard enough.
my best yet - 16KV from a 14inch crt anode!!!

That probably had a hell of a kick ... did you suffer any serious injuries?

[redwire]

Re: AC to Ground?

I was always careful around CRT's but car ignition coils on a 555 timer were such a blast.
I connected one to a TV HV multiplier and was watching the arcs many inches, it must have been well over 150kV, full power lol, when the arc jumped to all the junk on my workbench. You know, nuts, bolts, tools, test leads, boards etc.
It then arced onto a test lead that had one end dangling by my leg and through my jeans and nailed my leg. That hurt and was not at all expected. Keep your workbench clean lol.

Running AC mains current to ground works but the safety is low.
In North America, earth-ground and Neutral are bonded together in the electrical panel (service). So using Neutral as a GND, or GND as a Neutral can and does happen.
There is of course a danger if that (panel) ground connection went high resistance or open-circuit, that all devices grounded to that would float up to shock levels, due to the leakage currents. This is why people flip out about it.

[stj]

Re: AC to Ground?

That probably had a hell of a kick ... did you suffer any serious injuries?

i hurt my back when it threw me into a worktop.
i'v said before, it's not the voltage or current that kills people - it's the thing you get thrown against!

[EasyGoing1]

Re: AC to Ground?

i hurt my back when it threw me into a worktop.
i'v said before, it's not the voltage or current that kills people - it's the thing you get thrown against!

So I remember back in school, we were told that if you see someone being electrocuted by standard home electricity, you were supposed to grab a piece of wood and knock them away from the source ... the wood part makes perfect sense, but what's the deal with someone holding on to the wire or whatever is feeding them current? Is it normal that people hold on when - for example, they accidentally grab a live wire with their bare hands? Why wouldn't it knock them back like what happened to you with the CRT? And is that a reflex that is more common with AC vs DC?

[redwire]

Re: AC to Ground?

Electricity affects the human body a few different ways. A sine-wave is different than DC or pulsed DC, to both the nerves and muscles.
Nerves will get activated- a tingle, all the way leading up to pain receptors being activated, which triggers a reflex to pull away.
At higher voltages, muscles will turn on to varying degrees depending on the voltage, frequency.
High voltage mains 50/60Hz AC shocks, the muscles just turn on and you can't move or let go. This commonly kills people.

For the physiotherapy electrical muscle stimulators, they are optimized pulsing waveforms that activate a muscle but not the pain receptors. A narrow few kHz DC pulse train but AC coupled through a capacitor, this turns on muscles.