Announcement

**jpdoe** · 11-11-2008, 11:02 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

@momaka: I have a Pioneer dvd writer. Model DVR-110D. A few years old.
I'ts always been picky about blank dvd brands. Likes SONY blanks (writes them at 12x). When used with verbatim blanks, if 12x is used, the write speed fluctuates, and the buffer has sudden resets. So I write them at 8x, speed at which writes them as good as does the sony blanks at 12x.

**i4004** · 11-11-2008, 11:23 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

the thing is: scenic doesn't have wide enough sample to judge reliably(unlucky with 3 drives doesn't mean much).
then again what you say about cdfreaks drives being new can also be the case.
(would be good to start the thread where one would ask about age and if they work etc.)

wether truth is with scenic, or cdfreaks, or somewhere in between...(probably these drives work ok for most, but crappy for unlucky few) is hard to say.
perhaps i would buy samsung drive(and probably be fine with it) if i needed to burn some lesser quality media, but i dunno why when verbatim and good dvdrs aren't too expensive at all....
(that would be my objection to lg: can be picky when it comes to blank media....samsung seems to chew anything you throw at it...)

anyway i don't have place in my machine to put it. if i had i would probably try it: burners are cheap now, and it's worth the effort to have best possible burn.
as for return, i don't have a problem with that: place i would get it from would pay transport fees. so if they return it every 3 months...who cares?
it's not like it would be my only burner so i have nothing when i return it.
it would be 3rd drive.

**Scenic** · 11-11-2008, 11:57 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Originally posted by i4004

the thing is: scenic doesn't have wide enough sample to judge reliably(unlucky with 3 drives doesn't mean much)

i've had (and still have) a lot more drives than just 3...
i'm doing computer stuff for $$$... i need to have a little "stock" here...

those are just the drives i've got right next to my desk (for testing and stuff like that..)... not counting a few brand new ones and lots of used ones (mostly DVD-ROM drives, but a few DVD-RW drives too) in my cellar..

Originally posted by i4004

samsung seems to chew anything you throw at it...

good point, but that doesn't count for me when i'm buying a new drive..
it's a good thing that they (meaning samsung drives) don't seem to care about what media you put in, but thats a useless point if the drives themselves crap out after less than a year (some drives even less than 6 months).. and don't read anything anymore or get slow like hell..

i've had quite a lot samsung drives here... from customers PCs (putting a new drive in because the old won't read/burn anymore) or because i've bought them for my own PCs..
most of the time i get PCs for reinstalling windows or boring stuff like that.. but a lot of those guys tell me by the way, that the optical drive doesnt work anymore, and if i could put a new one in..

most of the time, its samsung, Lite-On, NEC (not many) or noname stuff (no brand at all)..
some of those drives are less than 1year old (according to the manufacturing date printed on them).. completely dead... no disk...

so why should i buy optical drives from manufacturers like samsung, Lite-On and so on if those are the ones that fail so often ..?

PS: sorry for my weird english... dunno how to explain some stuff... so i "wrote around" to describe it...
i shoul've paid more attention in english at school back then...
i had a 5 on my school certificate (if kikkoman or gonzo know what "zeugnis" means in english, help would be appreciated

)
a 5 is the 2nd worst mark of all here... :/
learned everything else by myself.. (chatting with native english speakers, reading techical stuff in english....)
reading & understanding ain't a problem for me, but speaking/writing... well...

**PCBONEZ** · 11-11-2008, 08:22 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Replacing the same drive over and over if fine for people with nothing better to do.
I have better things to do.

**i4004** · 11-11-2008, 10:44 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

>so why should i buy optical drives from manufacturers like samsung, Lite-On and so on if those are the ones that fail so often ..?

something that might of skew your image of these manufacturers: if you take everthing you've seen so far, what drives you saw the most?
if you saw most of samsung, then it's to be expected samsung also has most problems, right?

what i'm saying is that i don't see people over at cdfreaks bitching about their samsung drives lasting less than a year...and they probably would if this was the case.
(that user feedback thread for 203b is over 1 year old)
i think they would and to the point they would say to everybody to steer away.
also, you can't really say what did user to do it's drive.
and finally was it this particular drive(203b)?

also ,there are such things as bad batches etc.
and lg has its problems too
http://club.cdfreaks.com/f91/solutio...2/#post1788437
(also other stuff on lg subforum...there are obviously cases of lg drives not recognizing media etc.)

in the end, if it was so crappy nobody would use them, as they would be just the loss of money, if the return rates were too big.

i'm not saying they're awfully good, or something, i'm just questioning are all samsung drives THAT MUCH better than lg drives.
i think it would be hard to prove it statistically.

your english is fine btw.
i'm usually making a lot of typos on crappy shallow laptop keyboard...

oh yeah...if i buy samsung drive and it lasts me 6months(i'll do all burning and reading on it) will you buy me 2 new lg drives?
hehe...
(i probably do 5-6 times(or more) of what normal user will burn...then again, i don't play games so it wouldn't be playing as much...)

>Replacing the same drive over and over if fine for people with nothing better to do.
I have better things to do.

yes, you watch 3hr conspiracy theory crap. them wealthy jews are out to get our money and stuff.
i would rather use one of those 3 hours to try new optical drive...because i wouldn't like to establish poor burnuing quality is reason why i can't read dvdrs 10 years from now...

replacing: i've mentioned 3 months as scenic's worst predicition; it doesn't mean it would happen....i think it's more than likely samsung drive would last longer.
like i said, if all samsung drives would last that much, nobody would be buying them, that's for sure.
and returning them wouldn't amount to much time; i would put the drive on the box, not in it, so i would just pack it in 5min and call delivery service these use...
if they would last 3 month, i would all in all lose 20min, if warranty is 1 year...
and it seems it's 2 years, same like for lg burners..
heck i would devote it 20 more minutes!
hehe...

perhaps i'll do it for the hell of it: to relieve lg and lite-on, if nothing else.

**PCBONEZ** · 11-11-2008, 11:14 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Yes Scenic: Your English is fine.

>> (that user feedback thread for 203b is over 1 year old) <<
Yes, and a year ago when it was written the drive was a week old.
- hahahaha

i4004: You seem to be going on the idea that a given make's quality never changes with time.
- As like: who was better 5 or 10 years ago is the same as today.
- Simply not true.

Seems to me like:
>> anyway i don't have place in my machine to put it. <<
i4004 has limited hands on experience with drives and
[based on that photo up there] Scenic has loads.

If performance is what matters to you then more power to ya, go for the short life gear.

That's not what matters to me.

.

**Wizard** · 11-12-2008, 08:13 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

I had about 1 year life on many Liteon drives so I went looking for better drives and tried LG, so far good. Dirt wasn't the problem, opened up and looked, not even dusty.

Reason I had Liteon was in early days, I bought one or two Asus drives and was really tired of LOOONG mounting process after inserting a disc. I like quick mounting, example 2-3 seconds after inserting, I'm now exploring the contents or playing games Is there another make of optical drives that is even quicker and quiet? Least vibration, yes there are many that do vibrate badly, some so silken smooth.

Cheers, Wizard

**i4004** · 11-12-2008, 02:06 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

>Yes, and a year ago when it was written the drive was a week old.
- hahahaha

no, they're still adding burn quality scans....i'm not talking about review itself, but burn quality scans for that drive...

>i4004: You seem to be going on the idea that a given make's quality never changes with time.

nope, i didn't say that. i think both lg and samsung had their ups and downs.

>i4004 has limited hands on experience with drives and
[based on that photo up there] Scenic has loads.

oh, i 'm sure i could stack same amount of used drives(all those drives look used), but why? will i be putting them as replacement where they're needed?
putting used stuff? nope.

i'm not contesting he has experience, but i would say he paints a too grim picture of that manufacturer. i'm also saying that it can happen that drive lasta less than a year WITH ANY BRAND! does that mean all their drives suck and won't last?

how would one do it properly?
but you would need to have(say) 100 lg and 100 samsung drives and put them to machines, and then monitor what happens, ie how many fail.
did he do that?
did he test a particular samsung (203) model in that way?
i don't really see sumsung being extremely bashed(on web forums) as scenic's experience would suggest. that is HIS experience, and i would prefer to know what more people are saying. because one can have bad experience without most having it.
it's more significant what majority say. it's more statistically significant.
that's all.
if he can say he sees same amount of lg drives as samsungs(on machines he's fixing), and samsung has more failures, it would be enough. but did he say that? has any numbers?
i see a lot of samsungs("in the wilds"), and i see less lgs. in such situation i cannot say samsung is bad if (for example) i see 10 bad sams. on 100, and 1 bad lg on 10.
it's same performance.
i can say i saw more failed samsung failures(based on the above), sure, but that's distorting the truth...as i also saw less lg drives overall...

just had a pc older than 3 years here with samsung in it and it's working fine.

>If performance is what matters to you then more power to ya, go for the short life gear.

prices are so damn low that this is not the issue at all.
fix one pc and you can buy few...

if samsung would offer better burns and last just as much as warranty(2years) and lg would last 4 but with worse quality i would pick samsung, sure...because in the end any burner will die...its discs that should last...
and the samsung 203 burns look excellent. look good on crap media(which lg can't do) and look excellent on good media.
most important thing is to monitor burn quality.
like i said, that's why i got liteon burner in the first place.
oh something else i noticed: lg burners do well when reading bad burns. (much better than liteon!)
i didn't test samsung when it comes to that.

plastic is still chapest per-gb storage option.
it's really dirt cheap(both blank media and burners), so one can buy few(burners and media) and see what burns best.
----------

wizard, what do you mean "mounting"?
drive initialization when you insert media?
it's usually 20-30sec, isn't it?
one of the main problems with pc overall is that slowness,
and also unresponsiveness of the system when one copies bigger files on hdds.

you say you know of drive that can read disc contents 2-3 sec after inserting it?
which one?
i want one too!
hehe

**Scenic** · 11-12-2008, 02:58 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

worst drive ever.. guess what? samsung.
to be more precisely... Samsung SH-S223F

example of user comments on a big online shop 'round here...

http://translate.google.de/translate...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

average lifetime of this drive seems to be around 2 weeks..
i wonder what the guys at cdfreaks write about crap like this..
let me guess..: good write quality... okay.. but what they won't write is that it craps out after less than a month... guaranteed..

**Wizard** · 11-12-2008, 03:23 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

linux speak, but it still applies to any OS. Mounting a disc at point of insertion of media have specific time at point when able to browse the data media or "autorun" kicks in.

In my case, it wasn't the windows issues that was slowing up the mounting time. It was the drive themselves. Asus in particular, I had these that took full 10-15 seconds to finish mouting the disc (spinup, drive reads it, then get ready, windows picks it up, and mount the disc (more reads), finally available for use). That's darned long and LOUD and vibrated hard in use (WHIRRR!), so asked around and picked up philips-based mechanism BTC 16X brand (when that quit, it was awesome drive, quick mount and quiet, quick transfer), then Liteon, all burners nature did ok on performance, noise and mounting time is ok. Now LG disc drives. Ok so far but I have feeling that would do better if I knew which to look for.

Cheers, Wizard

**Scenic** · 11-12-2008, 04:07 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Originally posted by Wizard

Now LG disc drives. Ok so far but I have feeling that would do better if I knew which to look for.

just measured the time... was curious how long it takes..

drive: LG GDR-H20N DVD-ROM
disk: GTA San Andreas (no pirated stuff here)..
according to my stopwatch it took 7,8 seconds (first try) measured from closing the tray until the autorun thing popped up
tried that 3 times.. always between 7-8 seconds

only rewritable DVDs took longer (15sec), but thats normal (drive tries to read a usual (original or DVD-R) disks at first, then tries to search for rewritable media (more laser power needed to "see" the disk))

**i4004** · 11-12-2008, 05:13 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

>that it craps out after less than a month... guaranteed..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...1171&Tpk=S223F

77 fuckin % of "excellent".
sure is worst...huh...

now one or two lg drives
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827136153
77% but with 53 reviews
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827136144
72% with 114 reviews...

that's what i'm telling you: you need to have bigger "sampling rate"

strange things can happen: on some serbain forum people were saying wd hdds are crap. i buy nothing but wd and never had a problem. many people here do the same too...
here it seems germans get crappy samsung quality.
perhaps it can be boiled down to some drives made in particular factory, or so.

i wouldn't be surprised much if all these mfrs actually have the same or very simillar return rate, because prices suggest they use more or less same technology, so same number of flawed products can be expected...
"very poor" seems to be about 4-5%, and that's overall decent result...

----
about the time...dunno, but it seems burners take many times more, then.
i can't expect anything under 20-30sec on my lg or liteon burners...
have liteon rom in playback machine, but didn't pay mauch attention to loading times...

7-8 seconds would be awesome!

**PCBONEZ** · 11-13-2008, 05:32 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Newegg reviews are usually written in the first week and usually clueless idiots.
-
I still love the one that goes on and on about how great his new video card is and all it's features and then says .. "I can't wait until my motherboard gets here so I can try it."

.

**kc8adu** · 11-13-2008, 07:59 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Originally posted by PCBONEZ

Newegg reviews are usually written in the first week and usually clueless idiots.
-
I still love the one that goes on and on about how great his new video card is and all it's features and then says .. "I can't wait until my motherboard gets here so I can try it."

.

combination of idiots and shills with a few good reviews from credible users.
with enough ratings(thousands) good and bad products stand out.
funny though i got 2 dud mobo's in a row.i posted a rating of these boards and the reason they were going bad.
these ratings went poof!
mfr didnt like the truth and leaned on the egg?
btw it was a tyan board that had bad bga soldering under the nb.i suggested a fan might help lessen the stress due to the extreme temp rise.a small hsf likely would have prevented this.

**RJARRRPCGP** · 11-18-2008, 09:02 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Originally posted by i4004

buffer constantly fluctuating and burning taking ages...

Likely in PIO mode! Please check Device Manager!

Also, FYI, Windows 2000 sets CD drives to PIO mode by default.
If you have Windows 2000, you will be required to go to Device Manager and change the transfer rate yourself.

**madmax_2069** · 11-18-2008, 09:28 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Originally posted by jpdoe

@momaka: I have a Pioneer dvd writer. Model DVR-110D. A few years old.
I'ts always been picky about blank dvd brands. Likes SONY blanks (writes them at 12x). When used with verbatim blanks, if 12x is used, the write speed fluctuates, and the buffer has sudden resets. So I write them at 8x, speed at which writes them as good as does the sony blanks at 12x.

i own a Pioneer DVR-110D, i have had it for a few years. the only media brand i use is memorex (for CD-R/RW, DVD-/+R/RW, DVD-/+ DL) i have burnt hundreds of disks without a single frisbie. i have put this drive thew hell (burnt 13 DVD disks back to back without fail, burnd 5 DVD DL disks back to back without fail. so far this drive is solid and still quiet. its also running the latest firmware. i dont know about your drive, they did address a few burn issues with some brands that would cause overheating.

that is why my next drive i will buy will be a Pioneer DVR-115 or higher.

i hate that XP sets some drives in PIO mode ( a very very slow mode), i always check after i install a OS to make sure the drives are using DMA if available. it so much better.

**jpdoe** · 11-22-2008, 09:28 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

@madmax: thanks for the info.

**Wizard** · 11-22-2008, 12:59 PM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

What was GOOD years ago with your story is not true now.

Pays to ask what is GOOD for THAT generation of drives.

Pioneer burners aren't what was used to be and I had terrible experience with these.

Cheers, Wizard

**i4004** · 11-24-2008, 12:21 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

RJA, i think i checked and it was not pio mode(win xp).
also i don'0t think win2k defaults to pio.never did for me.
xp or 2k go to pio when they ecounter many errors on other(faster) modes, which can be hardware issue.

>Newegg reviews are usually written in the first week and usually clueless idiots

may be, but what is this (scenic's link)
http://translate.google.de/translate...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

13 people who got broken drive bitchin, it seems to me.

sentences like this
"but what they won't write is that it craps out after less than a month... guaranteed.."
are crap, and you know that as well as i do.
it's broad sweeping generalization that's totally false.
nobody would be buying or putting in a machine drive that craps out after a month.

so clueless idiots they can be, but they still know if their drive works or not.

i'm more inclined to believe quality is overall simillar, but he is having more samsung problems because there it seems samsung is sold more than other brands.
also, i'm not inclined to believe everything that comes from a mouth of person who said maxtor drives are good.
he had too low sampling rate with both maxtor hdds and samsungs optical drives, it seems to me.
(not that i'm saying samsung is the best or anything, but i very much doubt they're the worst, like scenic tells it...
i'll probably buy samsung(some drive that did well on cdfreaks reviews..that's why i got lg too...) next time i need the drive...heck, i should buy it now...extend the sata and power cables and put it on the top of the case...all sata ports are unused anyway...)

**gdement** · 11-24-2008, 08:33 AM

Re: Burning issues. No idea what is up.

I didn't realize DVD burners were so crazy cheap nowadays. It scares me about the quality though.

I was very disappointed to read a comment somewhere that Plextor doesn't make drives anymore, they just relabel them now. Probably because they've gotten too cheap and have been reduced to disposable commodity status.

I don't know who the Cadillac brand is now. I'm afraid there isn't one, and I hate unreliable burners. My old Plextor CDR has been working for 7 years, but I'm afraid the new ones probably aren't that good.

People talk about Pioneer being good... well I have a Pioneer 12X DVD-R which might be working, or it might not, I've been having about 50% failed burns on my spindle of Sony discs. Hopefully it's just the discs. If the burner is dead, I would call it's quality mediocre, not great.

Announcement

Burning issues. No idea what is up.

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment