Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

Nice!
Come to think of it, that was 18 years ago! Where did time fly?! (I feel old for saying that now.)

My first ever self-built PC was in late 2003, I think (or was it 2004, I can't remember.) Also an AMD/socket 462 with a cheapo Duron 1.4 GHz. But I used it proudly for about 3 years until the PSU became unstable. After this, I've moved onto different PCs, but still kept that PC as well. Many years later, I fully recapped the motherboard, as it was a beautiful red Jetway, but littered with crappy GSC caps. I posted about it here:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showth...ghlight=Jetway
Eventually, I also found an Athlon XP 2500+ for cheap, along with fixing up a Radeon 9700 video card. Back in the days, hardware like that seemed like a dream. But many years later, these things cost me barely anything on eBay... though now it seems old "retro" PC stuff (like high-end AGP cards) are climbing back up in value. So maybe a good thing I saved it.

Yes, time absolutely flies, really feel that both we human and the hardwares could use much longer life span!

Your recapped board looks really nice! I will study that thread carefully, when current trouble with mine finally go away.

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

By the way I just noticed an other problem, due to handling of the board lately, the spacing of the top of 2 replaced caps noticeably changed/reduced compared to my photo from the weekend, I've attached a comparison. The solder joints are all solid, so the difference must be caused by the legs being pulled out from the cap slightly. I do not think I was that heavy handed, probably one of the cap was a bit loose already.

I think I'm getting a bit paranoid here, tested with remaining cap, the legs are very strong. There should other reasons that the caps appear to be tilted closer now.

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

what is the voltage of the cmos battery? considering the age of the board, the cmos battery could have gotten weak from all those years in storage. a weak cmos battery is known for causing boot & post problems on motherboards and clearing cmos sometimes alleviates the problem albeit temporarily.

if it still persists even after replacing the cmos battery, replace all the ost caps on the board. i had an asus p4c800 (875p chipset board for the intel pentium 4 platform) board which also had boot & post problems similar to yours, requiring cmos clearing to get it to start and post. it was a boardful of ost caps. after i got rid of all the ost caps scattered around the board for general filtering, the problems disappeared.

considering the age of the board and the caps (nearly 20 years old now) and the dubious nature of the caps, u can try replacing them to see if it fixes the problem. i dont think running a board with 20 year old junk caps is a good idea here anyway...

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

what is the voltage of the cmos battery? considering the age of the board, the cmos battery could have gotten weak from all those years in storage. a weak cmos battery is known for causing boot & post problems on motherboards and clearing cmos sometimes alleviates the problem albeit temporarily.

if it still persists even after replacing the cmos battery, replace all the ost caps on the board. i had an asus p4c800 (875p chipset board for the intel pentium 4 platform) board which also had boot & post problems similar to yours, requiring cmos clearing to get it to start and post. it was a boardful of ost caps. after i got rid of all the ost caps scattered around the board for general filtering, the problems disappeared.

considering the age of the board and the caps (nearly 20 years old now) and the dubious nature of the caps, u can try replacing them to see if it fixes the problem. i dont think running a board with 20 year old junk caps is a good idea here anyway...

Yes, it's still the original battery but it still has 3.1V! I measured it both on and off board, it's the same. It should still have some years left.

This time the boot problem first reappeared after I left it off(onboard power LED still on) for more than 24 hours, all previous boots was always OK. I think I might not have fully cleared the CMOS last time, as the manual just isn't clear at all, now I have left the jumper closed for long enough time. I shall test again on this Sunday, it's really strange.

Before the recap there is no issue at all, but thanks for your advice, I will indeed recap the entire board. Since I have 2 boards now, I will first try to figure out which board still work fine, probably I will spare the working board for now, as I'm not fully ready yet. If both works then it would be ideal, I will then just recap the unused board, I can also be sure about the success or failure of my complete recap.

[momaka]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

This time the boot problem first reappeared after I left it off(onboard power LED still on) for more than 24 hours, all previous boots was always OK.

I'm starting to see a pattern here:
The motherboard boots OK when warm, but has trouble when cold. That's a very common symptom with bad caps. Of course, the issue could also be a bad solder joint somewhere, bad contacts in the CPU and/or RAM, or bad BGA chip. The last one is very unlikely, given you have a VIA chipset, and those just simply don't go bad. Bad contact in the CPU and RAM can be tested by removing the RAM and CPU a few times... but you already fitted the board with a new CPU when the old one burned, so I don't imagine that or the RAM as being the issue. That leaves either bad solder joints on the new caps (I doubt it, I looked at your work, and like I said, it doesn't seem bad in any way - I won't lie, it's not pro level, but it's OK adequate) or more bad caps left that just simply don't appear to be bad (those OST caps by the RAM slots and AGP connector should be the first to go.)

I think I'm getting a bit paranoid here, tested with remaining cap, the legs are very strong. There should other reasons that the caps appear to be tilted closer now.

Yup.
Those caps are probably more than fine.
Sometimes I also happen to be a little less than "gentle" with some of my motherboard too. I've bent quite a number of caps a little like your example above. It's never caused any problem and probably never will. It takes a lot of force to pull a lead out of a cap. Usually pulling on a cap while its very hot (for example, due to being unsoldered at the bottom with a soldering iron) is one of the easiest way to pull a lead out and damage it. But even that is not so easy to do. You'd have to be completely reckless to do that.

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

I'm starting to see a pattern here:
The motherboard boots OK when warm, but has trouble when cold. That's a very common symptom with bad caps. Of course, the issue could also be a bad solder joint somewhere, bad contacts in the CPU and/or RAM, or bad BGA chip. The last one is very unlikely, given you have a VIA chipset, and those just simply don't go bad. Bad contact in the CPU and RAM can be tested by removing the RAM and CPU a few times... but you already fitted the board with a new CPU when the old one burned, so I don't imagine that or the RAM as being the issue. That leaves either bad solder joints on the new caps (I doubt it, I looked at your work, and like I said, it doesn't seem bad in any way - I won't lie, it's not pro level, but it's OK adequate) or more bad caps left that just simply don't appear to be bad (those OST caps by the RAM slots and AGP connector should be the first to go.)

Thanks for your reply! I did leave it off over night the first day though, it was still OK in the next morning, so I thought everything was fine. Maybe it was not long enough, I will keep it off for more than 24 hours again and see how it goes. Next I will recap one of my boards completely then. It's very reassuring to read what opinion about my soldering And I will work to get better.

Yup.
Those caps are probably more than fine.
Sometimes I also happen to be a little less than "gentle" with some of my motherboard too. I've bent quite a number of caps a little like your example above. It's never caused any problem and probably never will. It takes a lot of force to pull a lead out of a cap. Usually pulling on a cap while its very hot (for example, due to being unsoldered at the bottom with a soldering iron) is one of the easiest way to pull a lead out and damage it. But even that is not so easy to do. You'd have to be completely reckless to do that.

Thanks! That's very reassuring to know too! Thought I was quite gentle, but the photo really shows otherwise

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

Hi guys, after many boot ups I finally pinpointed the problem, and probably solved it too! Cold start today after some 36+ hours was successful, everything appeared to be normal, so I stretched my head but was still happy. Then I shut off the PS to connect some more cables and case fans to the board, at the next boot CPU was set to some strange frequency. It turns out that the CMOS doesn't keep it's settings any more. I think that has caused the problem at the previous cold start after 24h too, because I did shut off the PS and worked a little on the wirings during that time, and the auto detection of CPU frequency just doesn't work.

Depending on how long the PS was off, I lose BIOS settings or clock or both. The battery has 3.1V but I still changed it, unsurprisingly that didn't work. I thought there could be more serious hardware problem, like defective CMOS?? If it's caused by bad caps it would take a lot time for me to fix it too. But still, I just tried to clean the battery itself and the battery contacts and bend back both contacts a little, so far that actually worked! I have shut down the PS for as long as 15 mins, both clock and BIOS settings are retained, it took me at max. 5~7 min previously to lose everything. I think after my previous attempts to clear the CMOS to try to get it to POST, the contacts gave in a little and turned bad.

So it again seems to be OK for now, I will put this one back together to test more. When I have more time I will test my second board and try to completely recap it. Thank you very much for your help guys!

[momaka]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

Ha, I've had that happen before too on an old Pentium II motherboard, where the CMOS battery was just marginal (about 2.4V). Except in my case, the CMOS language changed itself to a random one. But the CPU clock speed was retained. I suppose anything can happen when the CMOS is not getting the right voltage, be it from a bad battery or poor contacts on the battery connector. In any case, keep us posted. Hopefully that was indeed the issue and motherboard won't give you trouble no more.

[pfrcom]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

it still has 3.1V

Not necessarily a bulletproof criterion

I recently replaced two CR2032 - one in a GM Vectra car key whose remote functions stopped working, the other in an Aldi electronic scale which wouldn't turn on

Replacements fixed the issues, both both old batteries measured >3V

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

Ha, I've had that happen before too on an old Pentium II motherboard, where the CMOS battery was just marginal (about 2.4V). Except in my case, the CMOS language changed itself to a random one. But the CPU clock speed was retained. I suppose anything can happen when the CMOS is not getting the right voltage, be it from a bad battery or poor contacts on the battery connector. In any case, keep us posted. Hopefully that was indeed the issue and motherboard won't give you trouble no more.

Yes! Finally I have no more troubles! Yesterday I put everything back together, luckily it went fairly straightforward, Windows booted normally like I did nothing! Only except one thing, for some strange reason one of my Voodoo2 has been redetected and required a driver installation again. I wasn't even sure which driver I used for the other card. and it did take me a few attempts to get that card to work too, it always appeared disabled in the device manager. I tired to boot into safe mode to do something there and went back to the normal mode a few times, tried reinstalled the driver for both cards, but nothing worked. Then I just shut the PC down and that shut down the problem too! Afterwards every device works fine, just like before the recap! Finally a cold start that removes problem!

Now I have left the PS off over night, and nothing is lost! I almost can't believe it was as simple as poor contracts! I never had them before, I don't think I ever changed batteries of any PC before, the contacts just look normal and perfectly clean, I thought I should just try it and never thought that will actually work!

I have now run some tests with Prime95 and 3Dmarks, both stability and performance are fine and remained the same. So I'm very happy to report that the recap turned out to be successful in the end! It was a hell of adventure though! Thank you very much for the helps from you and others! I was at point of giving it up Even 18 years after the original build I've learned a lot about it! Though I hope that'd be just about everything! The recap process was probably the most straightforward part of it, now I will try to learn more about recap and soldering before further attempts. At least now I don't have to worry about the bulged caps leaking and causing damage.

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

Not necessarily a bulletproof criterion

I recently replaced two CR2032 - one in a GM Vectra car key whose remote functions stopped working, the other in an Aldi electronic scale which wouldn't turn on

Replacements fixed the issues, both both old batteries measured >3V

Yes, I guess so, I was searching and reading about internal resistance of batteries, untill I found a new one to try, it made no difference at all. I did some cleaning and bending, no sure which actually helped or maybe both. Now I'm actually still using the original 18 years battery on the board! As I wanted to see if it's indeed just bad contacts. Probably because I rarely turn off the PS, so it still has 3.1V, but I think it's still amazing that it doesn't seem to lose/leak it's charge at all.

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

what brand of battery is that stock battery from asus? i believe both asus and gigabyte both like using kts lithium cr2032 batteries? im asking because there are a lot of crappy and shitty cr2032 battery brands out there and im creating a list of reputable cr2032 battery brands and avoid wasting my money on the crap ones. thanks.

as for the battery holder contacts, it could also be that u have a bad cmos battery holder. there are a couple of cases here, myself included, of bad defective asus cmos battery holders constantly causing cmos reset warning errors on post. changing the battery holder with a new one or known working used one from a scrap board fixed the problem.

[pfrcom]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

lot of crappy and shitty cr2032 battery brands out there

You forgot to mention counterfeit

I get my CR2032s from Daiso, the Japanese store

Two with Mitsubishi logo, made in Indonesia, are $2-80 (aud), Daiso's fixed price for everything

[delide]

Re: Killed my Asus A7V266-E? Need advice

what brand of battery is that stock battery from asus? i believe both asus and gigabyte both like using kts lithium cr2032 batteries? im asking because there are a lot of crappy and shitty cr2032 battery brands out there and im creating a list of reputable cr2032 battery brands and avoid wasting my money on the crap ones. thanks.

It's a Maxell CR2032 battery from Maxell Hitachi Ltd., it also has a number code 47 printed on it. On my newer Asus boards they are using KTS CR2032 battery indeed.

as for the battery holder contacts, it could also be that u have a bad cmos battery holder. there are a couple of cases here, myself included, of bad defective asus cmos battery holders constantly causing cmos reset warning errors on post. changing the battery holder with a new one or known working used one from a scrap board fixed the problem.

Thanks, that's intereting to know, I never know that it can be a problem. In my case a litte bending and cleaning really helped, I will see how long that holds.