XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

[momaka]

Another one of these XFX GeForce 8600 GT video cards saved from the electronics scrap yard!
This one is a version 6.5. Technically, it is the same exact thing as version 5.0 from the other thread I created a while back. But I decided to make a new thread for this, as the other one got a bit off-topic with me erroneously concluding that the card was failed. So here goes another one.

As usual, I got this 8600 GT from eBay too. But unlike the previous one, look at what we have here:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499527964
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499527964

This 8600 GT came with pretty much all of the original box contents (including the game, “Company of Heroes”). I am the type of person that likes to keep original boxes, cables, and CDs with my hardware, so I find this awesome!

Now let’s see the card from up close:


Uh-oh - busted Sacon FZ all over again. Let’s have a closer look, shall we?


Ugh! It's like a dejavu of the other 8600 GT. The RAM has both of its caps busted. That’s always risky, as I have two EVGA GeForce 7600 GT video cards that smoked their RAM due to this. But again, the seller of this auction reassured me that the card was working when it was taken out of service. So I took his word and began my recap.

Step 1: Give the video card a Sacon-be-Gone treatment. My spray can of that stuff ran out, so I had to do it manually with a soldering iron

- Ah! Much better!

Step 2: Solder replacement caps.

I probably went a bit more minimalist here than I normally do, as I did nothing to replace the bulged FZ caps on the 12V rail (only left the blue Chemicon PSA polymers). But this was just for testing, after all. I also used more Chemicon PSA caps as the replacement for some of the FZ, just for the sake of consistency and color-matching .

By the way, note the corrosion on the SMD cap pads – not sure why, but it was pretty terrible on this video card. I cleaned them all before soldering my “new” caps.

Step 3: test.
…
Well, it works alright. But for how long? –Probably not much if under load / gaming. Look at these core temperatures:


At a 21°C / 70°F room temperature and open PC case, the GPU core temperature easily reached 62°C (and still rising) after about 20-30 seconds under medium-high load. Clearly, the heatsink is not adequate here, just like on the previous 8600 GT. It will surely need a modded heatsink of some sort.

So now that the card was working, I made a cap diagram for it, so you can see which caps are connected to which rail. Technically, I didn’t really need to make one, as this video card has the same exact layout and design as the v5.0 8600 GT – so if you’ve read through that thread, you may find the information here a bit redundant. On the other hand, the cap diagram in this thread may be easier to follow than the text description in my other thread.

Cap diagram:

If I remember correctly, these were the voltages for the rails above:
GPU V_core: 1.4 Volts
RAM Vdda/Vddq: 1.8 to 2 Volts, depending on RAM type (Infineon typically takes 2V)
GPU Vtt: 1.25 Volts

And finally, I save the best for last. The icing of the cake, as they say.
Let’s see how bad those Sacon FZ caps are once they poped. Ladies and gentlemen, I present you Sacon FZ at their finest:



Lol, look at these c[r]aps! They are a hair away from open-circuit. . Not even two (2) nanoFarads of capacitance in any of them! I think it is an absolute miracle this video card worked at all!

Now that the video card is recapped, the only thing that can kill it is heat. So for this, we need us a modified heatsink that will keep the core lower than 60°C. But that would be material for another post. I am already experimenting with my first 8600 GT. Once I come up with a good heatsink mod that is both quiet and cool, I will then make the same one for this video card.

[diif]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

Thanks momaka, an interesting read as always.

[momaka]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] – heatsink comparison

You are welcome, diff.

Also, just to show that there is a small difference between the v5.0 and v6.5 8600 GT, let's have a look at their heatsinks.

Here are the two heatsinks side-by-side (or one above other, I should say). On the top is the v6.5 heatsink, and on the bottom v5.0.
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499545505

Version 6.5 uses a squirrel cage fan, so the heatsink has holes underneath the fan area to allow the fan to intake air. The fins on the heatsink are straight and air is allowed to go only through them (there is no opening on the top). Compare that to the v5.0 heatsink, which uses a regular style fan and the fins are placed like rays.

The thickness of the heatsinks is also different.
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499545505
On the left side of the above picture is the v5.0 heatsink and on the right is v6.5. Overall v6.5 has much thicker base, which is better, because it allows for a better heat flow from the GPU core to the fins.

But there is a twist. Look at the bottom of these:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499545505
On the left again is v5.0 and v6.5 on the right. Version 5.0 has a thin copper heat spreader, whereas v6.5 does not. Makes one wonder which is better: thinner heatsink with a thin copper heat spreader, or an overall thicker heatsink without the copper heat spreader. Unfortunately, both of these heatsinks are too small for the TDP of the 8600 GT, so it is not possible to determine that with this GPU. Perhaps with a lower TDP GPU, it may be possible.

Finally, here is a shot of the squirrel cage fan, a Protechnic Magic MGA5012XR-O10, rated for 0.19 Amps @ 12V:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499545505

And just for fun, the GPU core:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1499545505

Now here is something interesting: nVidia lists the 8600 GT as being 43 Watts TDP on paper. Meanwhile, they list the 9400 GT (a shrunk-down 8500 GT core) as being a 50 W TDP GPU. But something doesn’t quite add up, because I have an XFX GeForce 9400 GT with a heatsink somewhat similar in size to the heatsinks shown above. It also uses a regular 50 mm fan going at full blast on 12V. Yet, no matter what load I put on that 9400 GT, it won’t go over 52°C with its stock heatsink. So I think nVidia really underestimated the TDP of the 8600 GT – either that, or they just didn’t care to put a proper heatsinks on it.

[Wester547]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

1Lol, look at these c[r]aps! They are a hair away from open-circuit. . Not even two (2) nanoFarads of capacitance in any of them! I think it is an absolute miracle this video card worked at all!

Didn't you find 3300uF 6.3V KZG which failed even more epically, IE they were completely open-circuit? Who woulda thought that KZG had it in them to actually drift more out-of-spec than Sacon FZ?

That said, those PSA polymers would look much better in place of the "blue" FZ. It probably wouldn't hurt to fill those empty SMD cap pads with replacements. Probably not worth it on an 8600 GT, though.

[momaka]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

Didn't you find 3300uF 6.3V KZG which failed even more epically, IE they were completely open-circuit? Who woulda thought that KZG had it in them to actually drift more out-of-spec than Sacon FZ?

I've found plenty of caps fail open-circuit. So yes, Sacon FZ is not the worst in that regard.

But what I find amazing here is how the video card continued to function (or the GPU and RAM VRMs didn't die, at least) with almost no capacitance left - that's a pretty robust VRM design, IMO. Though, perhaps it is also worth noting here that both the GPU and RAM VRMs employ very low inductance inductors. This means the VRMs run at a very high frequency - high enough where ultra-low ESR probably matters even more than the capacitance. With that said, I probably can remove all of the electrolytic capacitors and go 100% ceramic caps. But I don't feel that bored... yet.

Also worth noting is that the PCB near the VRM coils runs very hot on this card (at least with a high ambient temperature of 30°C/86°F). I would guess that's just another factor that helped the Sacon FZ caps go bad quicker.

That said, those PSA polymers would look much better in place of the "blue" FZ. It probably wouldn't hurt to fill those empty SMD cap pads with replacements. Probably not worth it on an 8600 GT, though.

I will fill them, eventually.

The 8600 GT runs Valve's Source Engine pretty well. Thus, for an older card to play TF2, Gmod, Portal 2, or similar... it is more than enough.

So I think it is worth it overall.

[Wester547]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

I will fill them, eventually.

The 8600 GT runs Valve's Source Engine pretty well. Thus, for an older card to play TF2, Gmod, Portal 2, or similar... it is more than enough.

So I think it is worth it overall.

The Source Engine is pretty "dated" at this point... at least that's what modern "tech" people would say. That anything made within the last five years or older is automatically obsoleted.

That said, the 8600 GT was an underwhelming card even when it was first released, over a decade ago.

[acai]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

cool. i had a not bootable gtx 560, then it when missing.

[momaka]

XFX eVGA GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V2.2] recap and cooler mod

Around March of this year, I found yet another of these 8600 GT video cards for pretty cheap on eBay ($8 shipped to my place). Needless to say, the urge to save it came out of me again, so I bought it. Besides, it seems like these XFX 8600 GT cards have been getting more and more scarce lately (probably because either most are dead from bad caps and/or overheating or because they are just too old now), so I figured I’d get another one (for the last time, I swear! ) “while supplies last”, as infomercials would say. Except that this one wasn’t XFX brand – it was E-VGA.

Or was it? Here’s a picture from top:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
OK, it’s an XFX, no argument there. Only the fan says E-VGA. Of course, it’s possible that the previous owner might have swapped the fan, given that the cooler came without its top cover.

The back and the sticker confirm it’s an XFX too.
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
Same model number (PV-T84J-UDD3), except this is apparently even an older revision: v2.2.

Not that this changes anything. The card still has a 620 MHz core clock and 800 MHz RAM clock (gDDR3 memory) like my other two XFX 8600 GT cards. In fact, here is the GPU-Z shot, which also (rhetorically) proves that it’s an XFX card:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500598
Worth noting is that a “standard” reference 8600 GT usually has a 540 MHz core clock, while the GTS version often comes with 675 MHz core clock. So it looks like these XFX GeForce 8600 GT cards are actually clocked somewhere between a GT and a GTS (though, closer to the GTS really). Thus, they do indeed perform a little better than a standard 8600 GT.

Of course, despite the higher clocks (which means higher TDP), XFX still used a crappy cooler on this one that isn’t much different from the previous two I posted:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189

The core is the same as before, too.
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189

And the result with those crappy Sacon FZ caps on the card was also the same:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
I don’t remember if the card was advertised as working or for parts, but given my success with these cards so far (even when the previous two had most of their caps bulged), I felt that this one would be a success too.

… and it was – or at least it worked, is what I meant to say. As for my [re]cap choice, I wouldn’t exactly call it a “success”. More of a “quick-n-dirty” recap, as I used a bunch of Nichicon HN (16V, 1500 uF) and Nichicon HZ (6.3V, 2200 uF) caps with 2005 date codes. From what I’ve found lately, 6.3V Nichicon HN and HZ with 2005 date codes are also unstable and very likely to go bad, just like the 2001-2004 HM, HN, and HZ’s. But I also have two Nichicon 4V, 1000 uF SMD caps in there to keep things in check, should the 6.3V HZ caps fail. And I haven’t had any failures of the 2005-dated 16V, 1500 uF HNs, so those went to match the other Nichicons. The cap positions, of course, are still the same as on the diagram I show in my first post above.

A picture of the recap:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
And you can see I also installed my now-proven Xbox 360 CPU rev.2 modded cooler, as I knew the original cooler wasn’t going to cut it, just like with the other two cards. I only used the original cooler to see if the card would display any output and boot into Windows after the recap. But no further tests were done with it.

A few more shots of the modded cooler:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500189
Actually, this is not a finished version of the modded cooler, despite looking pretty complete. I put the 50 mm E-VGA fan on there just so that the card has *something* for a fan, in case I need it for testing a PC setup. But in reality, that small fan is not enough to keep the card cooled under full 100% load at less than relatively cool room temperatures. At least that’s what I am let to believe, given the shape of the curve in this graph:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...1&d=1531500598

Most likely, any room temperature higher than 70°F / 20°C will result in core temperature close to or higher than 60°C (not good for GeForce 8000 series). At 64°F / 18°C room temperature, though, the card will happily do full load with the GPU core temperature remaining mostly around the 55°C mark or lower. And the 50 mm E-VGA fan isn’t actually too obnoxiously loud either – it runs slower (and thus more quiet) than the fans on the other two XFX 8600 GT cards I posted.

So I think that pretty much concludes all of the recap jobs and tests I’ve done on these XFX GeForce 8600 GT cards. There should be more than enough info here for anyone looking to recap and/or mod one of these cards. Of course, questions, discussions, and posting your own recaps of this card here are always welcome.

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: XFX GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V6.5] GPU recap

3300uF KZG

IIRC, those were the ones that seem to be the most notorious for its lava flows!

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: XFX eVGA GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V2.2] recap and cooler mod

The card still has a 620 MHz core clock and 800 MHz RAM clock. a “standard” reference 8600 GT usually has a 540 MHz core clock, while the GTS version often comes with 675 MHz core clock.

the xfx 8600 gt is a factory overclocked card, i guess; but the gpu isnt the only thing that is factory overclocked. the samsung 1.4ns vram on it should have a nominal clock of 700 mhz but xfx has it raised to 800 mhz. the standard reference 8600 gt should also have a mem clock of 700 mhz if its using gddr3 vram, so u got a factory overclocked core and vram card. nice! lol!

despite the higher clocks (which means higher TDP)

according to the video card list on wikipedia, the 540 mhz 8600 gt has a tdp of 47w; the 675 mhz 8600 gts has a tdp of 71w. so by my estimation, the 620 mhz 8600 gt should have a tdp of around 65w which is the same as the radeon 3650.

that small fan is not enough to keep the card cooled under full 100% load

i find that surprising since i have an asus 3650 agp silent pipe. i slapped a thermaltake 70x15mm fan with a 7v resistor on the heatpipe fins, making it spin at around 2700 rpm and its pretty silent. the resulting load temps were 51°C with my 30°C tropical ambient.

if that 8600 gt were here, the load temps would hit 70°C! i find that a rather shocking difference in temperatures for two 65w tdp chips. both the asus silent pipe and xbox 360 rev2 heatsink have one single thick heatpipe so im guessing the evga fan must be too slow to push any decent amount of air into the fins.

i guess stock fans must be really crap too. should get a better 60x15mm or 60x25mm fan and ghetto mount it on the heatsink. that should work much better. or u can also try two fans in a push-pull config. i just dont believe that g84 gpu core can run that hot!

[momaka]

Re: XFX eVGA GeForce 8600 GT [PV-T84J-UDD3 V2.2] recap and cooler mod

so u got a factory overclocked core and vram card. nice! lol!

Yes, all these XFX 8600 GT cards are factory overclocked, unless the box specifically says "540 MHz core" on the front. Actually if you look at the picture of the box in the first post above, the box does say "540 MHz core", but there is a "620 MHz core" sticker on top that covers it.

according to the video card list on wikipedia, the 540 mhz 8600 gt has a tdp of 47w; the 675 mhz 8600 gts has a tdp of 71w. so by my estimation, the 620 mhz 8600 gt should have a tdp of around 65w which is the same as the radeon 3650.

Yup, 65 Watts sound about right based on the tests I've done with these Xbox 360 coolers. Up to 70W, they will keep things in the 50-55°C with good airflow (i.e. 70-80 mm fan at medium speed). For 100W, they'll need full blast aifrlow from a 70-80 mm fan, and even then temperatures can start getting close to 60°C... or at least that's what I was getting with a 89W TDP s775 Pentium 4 chip (which maxes out at around 100 Watts, I believe).

i find that surprising since i have an asus 3650 agp silent pipe. i slapped a thermaltake 70x15mm fan with a 7v resistor on the heatpipe fins, making it spin at around 2700 rpm and its pretty silent. the resulting load temps were 51°C with my 30°C tropical ambient.

Well, that's because you have a 70 mm fan on it.
The small fan in the pictures above is 50 or 55 mm (I forget which). Between 50/55, 60, and 70 mm fans, the difference in airflow becomes somewhat substantial, given the same noise limit. The smaller fans do typically have higher airflow pressure though, due to the higher RPM. Bigger fans can move the same amount of air at lower speed, but the static pressure is also typically lower.

The 50/55 mm fan I have above is on the balanced side in terms of noise and RPM - i.e. it doesn't push a whole lot of air compared to other fans I have in the same size. So that's why I am getting higher temperatures. With the same size fan that runs much faster (and noisier), the temps will actually stay under 60°C even at close to 30°C ambient and full load.

im guessing the evga fan must be too slow to push any decent amount of air into the fins.

Exactly.
But it's enough to keep the card cool under mild load.

should get a better 60x15mm or 60x25mm fan and ghetto mount it on the heatsink. that should work much better.

Indeed it would. I've done that before, and it's a game changer. I just don't have that many 60 mm fans (only 1 left, actually, but it has a very loud motor like some Delta fans - it's a Cannon 24V fan). 70 mm works even better, but I have even fewer of those... unless I cut/split up some Xbox 360 twin fans - I've done it before too