That’s where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

[i4004]

http://www2.carleton.ca/newsroom/inf...-battery-life/

Atif Shamim, an electronics PhD student at Carleton University, has built a prototype that extends the battery life of portable gadgets such as the iPhone and BlackBerry, by getting rid of all the wires used to connect the electronic circuits with the antenna.

i can usually say something, but this left me speechless...

[Logistics]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

So... they're saying that the antenna being connected by a wired connection is acting as a power-sink on such devices?

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

yes.
furthermore they say if you make a transmitter-receiver link there, it consumes less energy...than a (probably) 1(or few) cm of wire...

now i have the greatest idea ever: let's deal away with the wires alltogether...we'll make trasnmitters and receivers everywhere, and that'll be it...
much, much more efficiency...why do it with a piece of wire(that wastes power) when we can make transmitter-receiver system?

he..
hehe...

[KeriJane]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

This sounds awfully Teslonian.... transmit power and information without wires...

Nikola Tesla! Holder of more patents than anyone.

Including patents for most basic computer logic circuits.

The ubitiqous 3-phase power grid.

Practically all of our modern technology has its roots in Tesla.

The only human to ever come up with a possibly workable plan to split the Earth in two! Odds are that the Tunguska explosion was one of his "oopsies".

His greatest aspiration was to electrify the entire planet, thus providing a convenient source of power for anyone anywhere, complete with streaming audio, data and images carried with the same waves as the power.

But some wannabe named Marconi used some Teslonian technology to "invent" mere Radio just before Nikola was ready to FRY the entire planet!

So, essentially Tesla was right? About wires that is.

Have Fun,
Watch out for that skinny guy with the weird compulsions and obsessions, (Tesla)
Keri

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

>So, essentially Tesla was right? About wires that is.

i would say not.
this article left me speechless in a bad way, ie what can be published....this is such a nonsense....

tesla was one of the brightest people ever, but in the end he was still just a human, and not all of his ideas are brilliant...
i think "magnifying transmitter"(as he called the system to trasnger electric energy without wires) was one of such ideas...ie i question how much power do you need to pump into (essentially) earth and atmosphere in order to bring power to all people from just a few places, ie how much power would be lost AND how would that affect the planet...
earth should not be our lil toy after all...

[PCBONEZ]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

I think they neglected to consider the power use of the amplifier needed at the other end of that wireless connection.
.

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

AND transmitter....
i mean i think that if they put superconductor instead of usual wire they would only gain few percents, ie nothing....it's the cellphone, it's not miles of cable...

[argon99]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

You think he might be able to get a grant now? I think at least half of all the things we see published as science is in reality advertisements to get grants and endowments. Then again maybe I'm just cynical.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

Cynical helps keep the dip-shits in line.

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

>I think at least half of all the things we see published as science is in reality advertisements to get grants and endowments.

or just short SF stories?
lot of the time it's just SF rubbish indeed...
it will just never happen.

[PM650]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

Really, this is not as surprising as it appears. Transmitting rf power efficiently is not at all similar to how we transmit dc or low-frequency ac.

Guided media such as coaxial and twisted pair electrical cable, radio frequency waveguide and optical fiber have losses that are exponential with distance. The path loss will be in terms of dB per unit distance. This means that there is always a crossover distance beyond which the loss in a guided medium will exceed that of a line-of-sight path of the same length.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_bu...or_other_media
RF signals do, after all, propagate in air and other dielectrics (clearly not electrically conductive mediums).

[PCBONEZ]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

Really, this is not as surprising as it appears. Transmitting rf power efficiently is not at all similar to how we transmit dc or low-frequency ac.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_bu...or_other_media
RF signals do, after all, propagate in air and other dielectrics (clearly not electrically conductive mediums).

You are right!

It takes a SHIT TON MORE power to send a signal through air than it does through a wire.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

The -total- power of my VCR is say.. 35 watts. Most of that is probably the motor.
How many watts is that -transmitter- at the TV station?
- Used to send the same signal.....

The signal has to be -TRANSMITTED- *before* it can 'propagate in air'.

[PlainBill]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

I think the significant thing here is most people don't have the foggiest idea how most things work. It's not just electronics. Where does the food in the supermarket come from? How does an airplane fly? What steps does the check you write go through before the money is deducted from your account.
Let's not get into something REALLY complicated like economics. Or weather.

From personal experience, there is nothing intuitive about a radio transmitter. Heck, there is a lot of engineering involved in a 'simple' transformer! If you map the power useage in a cell phone you will see that a lot of it goes through the wire to the antenna. Someone who doesn't understand radio transmission will think it is lost. Some of us know that 90% of the conversations are pointless.

PlainBill

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

http://www.engadget.com/2008/12/19/s...ur-iphone-bla/

some comments
"Ari Moshe @ Dec 21st 2008 4:14AM

If you look at the actual paper, you'll notice the total claimed power savings is about 35mW. If such a savings was realized, this might improve the standby life of the phone (when the screen is off and the CPU usage is low). However the power usage of the screen backlight, and of the CPU usage during actual usage of the phone the saved 35mW will be relatively insignificant. Also, if i read the paper correctly, with the proposed power savings comes a 60% reduction in range. In no way could this technique ever result in a 12x reduction on total power usage of a 12x increase in battery life."

"Name of the idiot responsible: Sarah Schmidt, Canwest News Service

Engadget just copied the headline from her article. She is the one that translated "one small component will consume 1/12 the power" into "battery will last 12 times longer"."


"Professor STFU @ Dec 19th 2008 8:59AM

For a reality check, assume the only part of a phone that uses power was the GSM communications subsystem. Then assume that this new guys system makes the GSM subsystem 100% efficient (practically impossible, but for arguments sake). Given a fixed capacity battery, calculate the original efficiency of the system with his '12 x battery life' claim. It's pretty obvious that this is a case of terrible journalism [likely], or even worse research [possible].

Remember the gravity lamp? (http://pesn.com/2008/02/19/9500471_Gravity_Lamp/) It even received an award, it must be real!

background reading: http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2008/03/03/stop-press-pixie-dust-unsuitable-for-household-lighting/"


"Miguel Marrero @ Dec 19th 2008 10:50AM

As an EEE graduate you should know the physics that are in play when transmitting "microwave level" frequencies through a cable and signal loss. This is why cell towers and related equipment use waveguides to get the signal from the transmitter to the antenna.



Neutral

Professor STFU @ Dec 19th 2008 1:50PM

This is over mm's, not meters. Controlled impedance lines are not the cause of losses on the scale - which is what this guy is implying."

"John @ Dec 19th 2008 8:46AM

?hnnunnh? How about this - take the idea one step further but removing the connections between the device and the battery too. Some loss of functionality, but a massive increase in battery life..."


"John Blankenau @ Dec 19th 2008 12:21PM

Hey, Mr. Funky-stuff. I think the 12x reduction in power is just applied to the power that is consumed in going from RF to antenna....not full system power...its still a good thing but not to the crazy extent that seems to be implies....any way, read the full paper from Mr. Sharifi here: "

let's read that paper....

[i4004]

Re: That's where the power gets lost,” Mr. Shamim said

reading that pdf i would say such chips have no purpose in cell phones.

essentially, he made tx chip(system on a chip transmitter) that uses less power but also has lower range....range of such products doesn't make any sense for cell phone use, ranges are from 1m to 75m....

this is the case of crappy reporting.