NAS boot issue

[alindumitru46]

I have an old NAS, Thecus N2310 with PowerPC 465 CPU @800 MHz
There is a teardown https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3z3A9Tk8X4
I have experienced frequent problems with system corruption, resulting in emergency and temporary repair and I thought to check the CR1220 battery, similar to computer motherboards, which was outside the parameters with a voltage of 2.5V.
I have already replaced the battery, but I can't start the NAS to continue with OS6 installation or reinstall procedure.

Although there are methods specific to the manufacturer to rewrite the firmware, I failed to do this and, similarly to computers, I think that there should be a method to force the writing of the firmware or the start of the writing sequence.

Can you give me a solution to revive this NAS?
Thanks

[Curious.George]

Re: NAS boot issue

I have an old NAS, Thecus N2310 with PowerPC 465 CPU @800 MHz
There is a teardown https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3z3A9Tk8X4
I have experienced frequent problems with system corruption, resulting in emergency and temporary repair and I thought to check the CR1220 battery, similar to computer motherboards, which was outside the parameters with a voltage of 2.5V.
I have already replaced the battery, but I can't start the NAS to continue with OS6 installation or reinstall procedure.

Although there are methods specific to the manufacturer to rewrite the firmware, I failed to do this and, similarly to computers, I think that there should be a method to force the writing of the firmware or the start of the writing sequence.

Can you give me a solution to revive this NAS?
Thanks

Some NASs have software that resides on one (or more) of the drives. Firmware on the "motherboard" just loads this into the system's memory. (this isn't the case for all NASs as the FLASH complement is increasing and, with it, the amount of cruft that can be crammed into the FLASH image)

For such a system, a defect in the FLASH contents (firmware) OR the image stored on the disk(s) leaves you with a non-functioning NAS.

In some cases, the firmware will fallback to relying on a TFTP service (or comparable) to download its disk image from an external server. In those cases, it's just a matter of having all of the right services in place for the NAS to perform this task (often initiated by some "magic button sequence")

[alindumitru46]

Re: NAS boot issue

Ok.
The firmware is stored on the Micron nand flash: https://techplayboy.com/10959/thecus...rage-review/4/
There is a procedure to force write firmware:
http://esupport.thecus.com/Knowledge...27-usb-upgrade
But I think the process cannot start because I used multiple usb flash disks without success.
And I keep thinking that maybe I can get him to start reading the USB flash somehow...
LE:
I verified with a backup hdd but is not initialised, does not spin at all. I also suspect that the USB flash disk is not detected because the boot procedure is not initialized.
Anyway, I'm intrigued by the LAN led and power led continuous activity. I think that only trough LAN port I could force a write but I can't figure out how, if a device is not identified by the router.

LE2:
I took courage. I thought of connecting my NAS directly to the computer. I captured the activity with Netmonitor3 and I see that the NAS is identified. But I don't know how relevant the information is. What is certain is that it is detected and there is a chance to be accessed, to receive an order through a protocol accepted on etehrnet ...

[Curious.George]

Re: NAS boot issue

Ok.
The firmware is stored on the Micron nand flash

There is a procedure to force write firmware:

But I think the process cannot start because I used multiple usb flash disks without success.
And I keep thinking that maybe I can get him to start reading the USB flash somehow...

You have to very carefully review the process that is prescribed. Little changes can cause it not to fail (e.g., having the network cable plugged in may change whether or not the process works; failing to hold down any magic buttons at the correct time; etc.)

LE:
I verified with a backup hdd but is not initialised, does not spin at all. I also suspect that the USB flash disk is not detected because the boot procedure is not initialized.
Anyway, I'm intrigued by the LAN led and power led continuous activity. I think that only trough LAN port I could force a write but I can't figure out how, if a device is not identified by the router.

The LEDs associated with the LAN may be driven entirely by hardware. I.e., they may simply reflect the signals detected on the network connector. Don't assume the processor is actually involved.

You can use a network monitor to see if there really is any traffic originated by the NAS -- best done on a quiescent network, though.

LE2:
I took courage. I thought of connecting my NAS directly to the computer. I captured the activity with Netmonitor3 and I see that the NAS is identified. But I don't know how relevant the information is. What is certain is that it is detected and there is a chance to be accessed, to receive an order through a protocol accepted on etehrnet ...

DHCP, BOOTP (simpler than DHCP so present in older devices), TFTP are the most common protocols relied upon for initializing "appliances" -- because they are low level and don't rely on a full stack to function correctly (less code to go wrong).

You can watch for this sort of traffic on your network (start the analyzer BEFORE you power on the NAS so you can see EVERYTHING that it may be emitting).

Once you have the firmware functional, you'll have to see how to coax the NAS into accepting it's "software".

As that software will likely be stored on one (or more) disks, it's usually wise to image the disk after the NAS is working properly; this makes repeating the process a lot easier (just install the image on a new disk using another computer!)

Damn near every NAS that I've owned has had a different procedure for reinitializing the software (after replacing drives). Taking notes helps to give you clues for the next NAS you end up annoyed with! :> Restoring images is a sort of universal way of avoiding the hassle.

[This reminds me that I have to image the drive in my DVR while it is operational]

[alindumitru46]

Re: NAS boot issue

Thanks for this very valuable information . I will move on to experiment as soon as possible.
Unfortunately I have 3 disks with previous images but none can start the NAS. It is not actually physically turned on.

[Curious.George]

Re: NAS boot issue

Thanks for this very valuable information . I will move on to experiment as soon as possible.
Unfortunately I have 3 disks with previous images but none can start the NAS. It is not actually physically turned on.

My advice? Do yourself a favor and repurpose an old PC as a NAS. There are several "free" packages that you can load on generic hardware and get these features (often MORE features than a "proprietary" NAS).

[FreeNAS comes to mind. There are others.]

Then, worry about how you can transfer the contents of those images to the NAS. (there are some tools available that purport to be able to read many NAS images -- for recovery, only!)

The advantage that this approach has is you can replace the hardware at any time. And, add or upgrade disks - without relying on how/if some firm decided to support these actions.

And, can possibly store information on the drives in a form that can directly be read without the support of the NAS software.

Yeah, NAS appliances are "sexxy" in that they are smaller than real PCs. But, that comes with costs (that you are now experiencing).

I've used "Shuttle" PC's, in the past, as 2drive NASs -- adding other drives externally via USB. You'll have to decide what your needs are and the extents you're willing to go to achieve them.

(I.e., you could just buy a *new* NAS... <grin>)

[alindumitru46]

Re: NAS boot issue

I'm convinced of your advices. Fortunately, no recovery is needed
But what displeases me about a new (another?!) computer is that I have to make additional investments in a silent source and a kit quiet enough and economical to be able to keep it on already too loaded UPS
I also have an old EX475 that I would like functional again.

[brethin]

Re: NAS boot issue

nothing wrong with a NAS if you know how to maintain them, I Have 42 hard drives for Buffalo NAS units with firmware I have restored over the years, it's just a matter of knowing what you have and how to fix it.

[Curious.George]

Re: NAS boot issue

I'm convinced of your advices. Fortunately, no recovery is needed
But what displeases me about a new (another?!) computer is that I have to make additional investments in a silent source and a kit quiet enough and economical to be able to keep it on already too loaded UPS
I also have an old EX475 that I would like functional again.

Sorry, I just noticed your location. We think nothing of having "extra computers", here.

Unless you are really hammering on your NAS, you can usually opt for a less capable "PC" to host the software. I've used "diskless workstations" with external USB drives to expand storage. They (the workstations) are often fanless -- as are the external drives.

I just pulled two T610's out of my stash (I rescue these as there is little recycle value in a box that weighs less than a pound!) to use for a database server. With an external USB3 drive, the network will likely be the bottleneck.

The advantage is that you don't have to deal with whatever software the NAS vendor opted to think was appropriate for their product and can, instead, rely on more mainstream support.

[I have over 200T in my NAS/SAN fleet; probably 150 physical drives?]

[Note that you can also operate the NAS as a SAN with some of these FOSS packages]

[alindumitru46]

Re: NAS boot issue

Guys, if that's somehow part of your daily work, I'm just doing it as a hobby.
@brethin, I don't quite understand what you mean by "firmware restore". I know very well the firmware restoration procedures from Thecus and I tried both options:boot with an older hdd backup and rewrite with usb flash disk.
Maybe because my NAS is entry level... but maybe you enlighten me in case I didn't do the right thing

[Curious.George]

Re: NAS boot issue

Guys, if that's somehow part of your daily work, I'm just doing it as a hobby.

It's not part of my "job" (I'm not an IT person). Rather, I have a sh*tload of stuff that I preserve as a consequence of designing hardware/software (for decades).

As a "normal person", I'd typically just be buying bigger disks for my "PC". But, why would I want to keep all that stuff on "my PC" when most of it is for legacy purposes (do you have your tax returns on your PC? Or, have you archived them, somewhere?)? And, once you get beyond a few TB, it's just not convenient to store stuff INSIDE a PC (usually, you need more spindles than the PC supports).

So, move the disk drive to a "headless PC"... a box that you interact with via a network interface/protocol. As such, you need a CPU, some RAM (for the code that the CPU will execute as well as "working memory"), a persistent place to store the software (on an internal disk/flash), a network interface(s) and one or more disk interfaces.

With the T610 approach (external disk used to store files), you can swap external disks to increase capacity while the "software" remains on the T610 (internal flash or laptop drive).

[I have "disk shelfs" -- 15 or 12 removable drives per shelf, usually 3 shelfs per storage device (NAS or SAN) -- that are driven by a generic processor box.]

[brethin]

Re: NAS boot issue

Guys, if that's somehow part of your daily work, I'm just doing it as a hobby.
@brethin, I don't quite understand what you mean by "firmware restore". I know very well the firmware restoration procedures from Thecus and I tried both options:boot with an older hdd backup and rewrite with usb flash disk.
Maybe because my NAS is entry level... but maybe you enlighten me in case I didn't do the right thing

I can't really help you with this device, if it were a buffalo unit of any type I could sorry.