Announcement

**Per Hansson** · 04-15-2006, 10:28 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Yea, buy a LG GSA-4167B DVD drive instead and spend the savings on beer

Either that or buy a "real" DVD drive like one of Plextors... And don't forget the floppy drive :P

Also I'd buy a Raptor HDD instead, the speed difference is really tremendous, atleast for the kind of usage I give my computer...

I'm also a little out of the loop regarding the Intel vs AMD battle nowdays but a while ago atleast AMD gave you more bang for the buck so to say... And looking at the reviews at Anandtech the P4 is still struggling to keepup...

**stretch0069** · 04-15-2006, 11:55 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

yeah...I know AMD is cheaper, but I've still got this old heartburn over their cooling requirements. Not sure if it still holds true, but back in the P3 days, the equivilant AMD would fry if it lost CPU cooling. The Intel would just shutdown with no damage to the CPU.

I agree on the Plextor issue. The money saved would be small and besides....I don't need any more beer.

I'm already paying for past contributions to the delinquency of my belly

I'll look into the Raptor HDs. I might move the video editing to the new machine and it requires fast HDs to keep up with the digital video capture.

**tiresias** · 04-15-2006, 11:57 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Hi Stretch,

Following up on what Per mentioned regarding the choice of hard disks - I've found it depends tremendously on what you're mostly using the machine for. The WD Raptor is certainly very fast as an OS/boot/applications drive, its very low access time being the key here. On the other hand, if you're going to be doing anything involving long sequential reads of huge files (as would be the case with video encoding/manipulation), the I've found nothing beats a striping array - indeed my main machine has two WD1600SD drives set up in RAID 0 for this purpose.

As for the CPU, if you're not in too much of a hurry, consider waiting for a decent Core Duo supporting motherboard to become available. Those Yonah CPUs are turning out to be very good performers, and astoundingly energy efficient.

...

PS. If you're really looking for trouble

, you could wait until either the Supermicro X6DLP-EG2 or Tyan i7520SD hit the 'retail shelves', and marry them to two Xeon LV Sossamans, for an affordable, extremely low-power-consuming, quad-core system!

OK, I confess, that's what I'm secretly planning to use for my next (long-awaited) computer 'build'.

**Per Hansson** · 04-15-2006, 12:27 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Originally posted by stretch0069

yeah...I know AMD is cheaper, but I've still got this old heartburn over their cooling requirements. Not sure if it still holds true, but back in the P3 days, the equivilant AMD would fry if it lost CPU cooling. The Intel would just shutdown with no damage to the CPU.

AMD included a thermal sensor chip in the Barton revision of the Athlon XP, since then all AMD has supported overheat protection...

If you compare one AMD CPU to one Intel CPU that have equal performance the AMD CPU will need less cooling because it both dissipates less heat and draws less current than the Intel equalient

As tiresias hinted this will probably change with Intels "Core Duo" chips... But AMD will probably not sit by and watch as Intel dethrones them as the best performance per watt chip, leaving the customer with even better chips in the end...

**willawake** · 04-15-2006, 12:31 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

imho you should wait for conroe in Q3. conroe will kick presler's ass.

http://www.anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=2713
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=4843&page=1
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/200...tecture/1.html

i have not been happy with sony drives but dont have experience with their high end ones, will you be using DVD-RAM? that will limit your choices if you need that. the LG is a good drive, i have it at home. be careful if you want a plextor, some models were not "real" plextor's they were rebadged. i have been doing a lot of backups with my plextor 716 in the office, it seems a good drive also but expensive.

the hard disks are small though. i agree with the raptor choice but i would get an additional big drive also.

you will get an antec case and antec psu for your best system? imho it would be better to get a lian li or Akasa Eclipse 62 without psu and add a seasonic, pc power and cooling or whatever. it will add a lot to the cost though.

**Per Hansson** · 04-15-2006, 12:43 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Originally posted by willawake

you will get an antec case and antec psu for your best system? imho it would be better to get a lian li or Akasa Eclipse 62 without psu and add a seasonic, pc power and cooling or whatever. it will add a lot to the cost though.

Sorry for hijacking the thread a little, but is Antec ragarded as being very high quality, in the likes of Seasonic and Fotron etc, but just with badcaps? I.e. is it when recapped just as good as the other PSUs in it's pricerange?

**tiresias** · 04-15-2006, 01:03 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Originally posted by Per Hansson

Sorry for hijacking the thread a little, but is Antec ragarded as being very high quality, in the likes of Seasonic and Fotron etc, but just with badcaps? I.e. is it when recapped just as good as the other PSUs in it's pricerange?

Experiences vary, of course - but in general Antec-branded PSUs, which are almost invariably made by Channel Well, are no worse than other equivalently-priced consumer-oriented units, such as those made by FSP or Enermax.

PS. There is, however, a worrying thread on this very forum regarding Antec PSUs "Post your bad experiences with...". Whether this means that reliability-wise, the CWT PSUs fall somewhat short, will be up to you to decide.

In any case, they're certainly not atrocious quality, like recent Powmaxes or other junk that will reliably fail at 30% of its rated load, often disastrously with regard to any attached components.

**Per Hansson** · 04-15-2006, 01:07 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Originally posted by tiresias

PS. There is, however, a worrying thread on this very forum regarding Antec PSUs "Post your bad experiences with...". Whether this means that reliability-wise, the CWT PSUs fall somewhat short, will be up to you to decide.

Yes I know, I was wondering if this was because they cheaped out on the components like Deer etc or just due to badcaps...?

**Galvanized** · 04-15-2006, 02:17 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Shooting from the hip (Dillon reloader

)

No expert but after modding several cases, two Lian Li PC-60s amoungst them, I too would recomend the Akasa Eclipse 62. It can be had cheaper as a GlobalWin(the OEM for Akasa) but the Eclipse is better finished.
All cages and panels are removable, leaving a free standing aluminum frame=a modder's paradise, a fitters dream. The cages are also anodized in black

It accepts eATX boards and is 45mm wider than most ATX cases. Google reviews. Two members at Anand's did mini-reviews on them, one a long time builder and he said it was his best case ever. It'll be my next case.

For a good cheap case w/door(dislike doors) provantage.com has the Antec SLK3000B for $31+ship. Thi$ would leave buck$ for a better PSU. It's caused no RMA problems that I've heard of but most Antec cases w/PSU have the warrenty sticker cut. Odd but true. P150 & P160s included.
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?p=231813

The Higher end AMD CPUs come with a retail HS that has 4 heat pipes and 80x15 fan that rivels the XP-90 w/80mm fan as per testing at madshrimps.be. I'm hooked on Intel and await the Conroes after the initial feeding frenzee is over.

Though rarely used all three builds here have a FDD. I don't remeber the brand but FDDs are being offered now that also read cards, maybe 4 types not 8~9 like a fully dedicated reader.

I'll blame it one you folks for cluing me into the build quality of Enhance. The Enhance units that end the part number in GH are 80plus.org certed. eWiz.com did have a number of them for sale cheap but most are sold. The ENP-5150G there is worth a look. buildtoorderservers.com has the Zippy HP-2 6460P w/o thermal fan for $85 and the HG-2 6400P for $89 with thermal fan (gotta open mine up for some tight pics to post).

...Galvanized

**gonzo0815** · 04-15-2006, 03:40 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

As far as i know, some of Antec`s desings are good, but most are very inefficient. The main problem is, that Antec is selling many diffrent products, probably from many diferent vendors. Some are junk, some are not. I suggest Amacrox Free Earth or "frei Erde", a decent FSP unit or Seasonic S12. They are in all cases very efficient desings (more than 80%) with good endurance and proven good performance in any respect.
And in my opinion, you get more for your money than from Antec.

**willawake** · 04-15-2006, 04:05 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

I suggest Amacrox Free Earth or "frei Erde", a decent FSP unit or Seasonic S12.

Frei Erde AX650-GLN

sounds like a Fortron FSP650-GLN

I don't remeber the brand but FDDs are being offered now that also read cards

both teac and mitsumi do floppy's with 7 in 1 card reader usb 2.0. in black also.

talking about legacy stuff though, they will get rid of the ide connectors some time so its time to be thinking about sata optical drives. i recall the plextor which was the first had problems. is there any ones now that work?

**Galvanized** · 04-15-2006, 05:03 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Mitsumi is to be eschewed, so say most of the old timers say when asked. Teac has generally been a trusted brand afaik.
The only opticals I've used are LiteOn and Plextor and heard of some issues with the first Plextor that was SATA. At this point in time a SATA optical has bragging rights and thinner cabling. About the time Dell starts using SATA opticals the price for one will fit my budget.

I like Plextor but buy older model types for cheap.

I've read a number of posts where the ham-fisted have broken SATA ports, both power and cables. They are quite fragile. A redesign is in order for both HDDs and opticals.
I'll see if I can find it, one of the HDD providers offers a plastic bridge that holds both cables to the drive. Kind of a retro-fix.

**stretch0069** · 04-15-2006, 05:24 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Thanks for all the input y'all.

I would wait for some of the item described, but I need to get this ordered by like Monday. That way it'll be here in time to put it together before heading back to school. (BTW...I wish someone would have told me that my chosen profession pretty much guarentees that I'll keep going to schools until I die.

) Oh well.

Ok...since AMD seems to be a good option......what about this?

AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ Manchester 1GHz HT 2 x 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core Processor - Retail
Model #: ADA4200BVBOX
$355.00

but what to put it on???? I thought about this:

ABIT AT8 32X Socket 939 ATI CrossFire Radeon XPRESS 3200 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail
Model #: AT8 32X
$174.99

....

but its out of stock

and I'd need different RAM.

Ugh.....decisions decisions.......

**Fatal0E** · 04-15-2006, 06:04 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

I'd would definetly take the X2 over the Pentium D. Not a fan of of netburst chips at all. Had great luck with modern Abit boards. For the case I have used several Antec P180's lately, not the easiest case to put stuff in, but damn its quiet and cool. Doesnt come with a PS so you can get what you want, but have to make sure and get a power supply with long cables.

**stretch0069** · 04-15-2006, 07:25 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Yeah...I'm partial to Abit boards. I was looking at the AN8 Fatality SLi board, but the place I was going to get it is out of them too.

Damn.....I didn't think it would be this difficult.

**linuxguru** · 04-15-2006, 10:48 PM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

> AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ Manchester 1GHz HT 2 x 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core

If you can still get them, go for the Socket-939 Toledo Opteron 165, 170, 175 or 180 dual core instead. They have 2 x 1M L2 cache and are supposed to be excellent overclockers.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...oc.aspx?i=2591

**Per Hansson** · 04-16-2006, 03:19 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Yes, the dual core Opteron are nice processors...

The Asus A8R32-MVP Deluxe is a good match for your GFX card, if you want to run crossfire you need a mobo that does not have a nVidia chipset, because it is not supported... (there are hacks to make it work but no one know how long they will work before nVidia disables them via their drivers)

IMO there is not much need in buying very expensive RAM, sure, quality RAM but not RAM that can OC very high, because if you have a AMD system it already has enough bandwidth as it is, and if you OC you will probably need to run on a divider anyway because they OC like crazy and I don't know of many memories that are affordable and does 300mhz

However with the AMD and Intel route comes a problem, AMD is switching to socket AM2 on 06/6/6, there will not be any faster Socket 939 CPU's released after that date I have heard...

A similar cenario with the Intels, the Netburst arcitecture has seen it's last CPU, there will not be a faster CPU introduced than the 3.73Ghz P4...

**stretch0069** · 04-16-2006, 10:45 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Why does this have to be so difficult???? I checked a couple different places for the top two boards I want, but everyone is out of stock.

Choice#1 - ABIT AT8 32X Socket 939 ATI CrossFire Radeon XPRESS 3200 ATX AMD Motherboard
Choice#2 - ASUS A8R32-MVP Deluxe Socket 939 ATI CrossFire Radeon XPRESS 3200 ATX AMD Motherboard

So....what does everyone thing about this:

DFI Lanparty UT CFX3200-DR Socket 939 ATI CrossFire Radeon XPRESS 3200 ATX AMD Motherboard

I'm getting to the point where my head is spinning and I haven't had anything to drink.

**Per Hansson** · 04-16-2006, 11:16 AM

Re: Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

I've heard many complaints about the cousin to the CFX3200-DR... I was going to get the DFI crossfire at first and a X1900XT but "settled" for a DFI Expert (nFoce4) and a 7900GT instead...

IMO unless you are into overclocking and tweaking you should not get a DFI, they can be tricky to get to run well with different kinds of memories etc etc... Of course when you do know what you are doing and get a good board it is the best board money can buy...

And don't take my word for it, have a look on DFI Street...

Announcement

Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Itching to put together another computer..opinions?

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment