capacitor replacement in Camaro

[avidgamr]

I have a 1992 Camaro that has an electric speedometer (analog needle-type of speedometer but driven by electricity, not a cable). From what I gather the circuit board driving the speedometer is the culprit but I'm not that great when it comes to the technical stuff with capacitors so here I am!

Chip almost looks burnt or leaking but possibly the cap leaking? Didn't look swelled from my perspective when I had it out but...
Pics are attached.
Capacitor is an Nichicon 150uF 25V PF(M) (which "M" I've read is 20% tolerance and "PF" is the series...
I think I found the datasheet

which says this cap has an impedance of "0.33 ohms max at 20c". I removed and measured mine it was 0.75 ohms with my ESR meter

(uF measured 142 I think? my notes are confusing )
so it seems it's definitely bad. Question is, what should I replace it with?
Seems it's low ESR, 150uF with a tolerance of 20%; got that much...
The datasheet says this series has been replaced/upgraded to PJ series.
PJ series data sheet

says the equivalent cap is 0.26 ohms @ 20c (lower is good, right? ) and says the rated ripple is higher (is higher better?).

I've searched for caps on eBay and found several that state they are low ESR but the datasheets say "applications: general purpose"?). I've found one that looked good but stated "not for automotive". Why?!?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-Elko-Pana...IAAOSw-vlVnmm6
https://cdn.badcaps-static.com/pdfs/...4e2acec5e3.pdf

Others I've considered:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/8pcs-Nichico...uYhjyVedVGPwtQ
datasheet:


http://www.ebay.com/itm/150uf-150mfd...cAAOSwuMFUbtP2
datasheet:
https://cdn.badcaps-static.com/pdfs/...d7b9ce5b39.pdf

Help!

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

Forgot to mention I do have a few more pics of different angles if desired...

[stj]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

desolder the cap and chip,
clean up the mess with IPA

DONT BUY EBAY CAPS.

does this board get hot & cold?

[stj]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

looked at the datasheets - that cap is crap by modern standards.
panasonic FR series should replace it.

probably a good idea to work out what the cap is doing first though.

btw, they say not for cars because it's not AEC-Q200 certified.
personally i wouldnt care, it's not like it's part of the ABS or Drive-train.

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

desolder the cap and chip,
clean up the mess with IPA

DONT BUY EBAY CAPS.

does this board get hot & cold?

IPA?
Where can I get the Panasonic FR series cap I need then? That's typically my go-to place when I need one. LOL

Have no idea? It's behind the instrument cluster in the dash when it's installed and using it... I suppose so: Winter/summer/air conditioning and heat when needed?

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

looked at the datasheets - that cap is crap by modern standards.
panasonic FR series should replace it.

probably a good idea to work out what the cap is doing first though.

btw, they say not for cars because it's not AEC-Q200 certified.
personally i wouldnt care, it's not like it's part of the ABS or Drive-train.

Ah, ok, I see. So it's basically the temperature rating more than anything that this refers to? So I can just go by the 105c rating on the original cap?
Thanks for your help!

[stj]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

IPA = Isopropyl Alcahol

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

By the way, to stj or whomever will answer...
Let's see if my understanding is correct on caps (and my situation specifically):
1. I need an exact uF replacement (specifically 150uF) to maintain accuracy.
2. 25v is not a strict number- I can go above that, just not below (35v, 100v, etc. ok but not 20v for example, that is as long as it fits within the replacement area as in #6 below)
3. I need at least 105c to handle the heat behind the dash
4. 20% tolerance, no more than?
5. Low ESR required. Have read about ESR but still don't understand it
5a. much less the "rated ripple" of 296 mA rms @ 105c 10-200KHz (or 205 @ 120Hz) (is higher or lower than the original ripple number better?)
6. Size of cap doesn't matter as long as it fits in the area it's being installed in? (higher voltage caps are larger in size)

Is all of this correct? My dad was the electrical technician and I'm still clueless!

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

IPA = Isopropyl Alcahol

Ah, already tried with alcohol to the best of my ability.
All of it wouldn't come off.
Oh, and forgot to mention I already tried heating up and adding a touch of solder to all connections except the large chips- I was afraid I'd do more harm than good with heat!

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

Panasonic FR Series
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10PCS-25V150...YAAOSwPe1UAZBE
Are the ones from China safe enough to use or possibly cheap knockoffs?
@stj: Where do you buy your caps?

[stj]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

i use farnell / element14

try scraping that shit off with a screwdriver - use a wire-brush on the chip and hope it's not damaged inside.

the esr can be lower - not higher
voltage can be a bit higher - like 35v, never lower
the ripple current can be higher - never lower
tolerance can be ignored, it's always 20% for electrolytics.

the uf can be a bit higher - it depends on the circuit.
unfortunatly i cant trace the numbers on that chip - so i dont know what it's doing.

[Per Hansson]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

And again, never buy caps from eBay.
There are a few legitimate sellers but for each legitimate one you will find a hundred selling fakes!
It's not worth it, especially in electronics in a car that are exposed to some nasty temperature ranges.
You need good quality Japanese caps, not some cheap knockoff made in China and then resleeved to look like a genuine Japanese one...

Panasonic FR or Rubycon ZLJ would be excellent replacements.
https://www.elfa.se/en/capacitor-150...x11/p/16705164

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

Thanks everyone! I (think) ordered some from Mouser Electronics via COD.
Came across this guide. Says pretty much same info stj said about choosing a replacement:
http://www.niccomp.com/help/capsubguide.asp

[WeaselXP]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

Thanks everyone! I (think) ordered some from Mouser Electronics via COD.
Came across this guide. Says pretty much same info stj said about choosing a replacement:
http://www.niccomp.com/help/capsubguide.asp

Great! Ebay is infamous for vendors selling counterfeit capacitors. Mouser,Newark or Digikey will likely be a much better bet.

[Agent24]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

You have the capacitor replacement figured out OK.

The hard part will be removing the IC and capacitor without damaging the PCB and then cleaning and checking the corroded traces.

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

I've removed the capacitor once, hence why I knew the actual measurement of it via my ESR meter...
Why remove the IC?

[Agent24]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

I thought the pads around the IC were corroded.

[stj]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

I've removed the capacitor once, hence why I knew the actual measurement of it via my ESR meter...
Why remove the IC?

you need to clean all the shit off the pins, and from between them.
you also need to check the pads and tracks have not been eaten away by the leakage.

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

DONT BUY EBAY CAPS.

qft!

[avidgamr]

Re: capacitor replacement in Camaro

you need to clean all the shit off the pins, and from between them.
you also need to check the pads and tracks have not been eaten away by the leakage.

Ah yes, never even gave the thought about that! When I receive the new cap, I'll remove the IC as well and do that. Thanks stj and Agent24!
Until the cap comes, I'll just have to wait and not drive my Camaro!