Are bad-cap brands getting better?

[Agent24]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

OCZ, Antec and others...are using lots of CapXons, OSTs, Su'scons, Teapos etc.

None of them are Fuhjyyus by any stretch, but are they getting better?

Pretty sure my friend has an Antec Basiq 350 with Fuhjyyus in it.

But Antec have a history of using crap capacitors... and I wouldn't trust any of their supplies unless they're top of the line with Japanese capacitors.

[Digital Technophile]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

On a limited resources micro like a PIC, you're gonna have to drop down to assembly for critical routines anyway, regardless if your main program is in BASIC, C, or whatever else. So you might as well do it properly the first time round.

PIC assembly is quite a bit different from x86 btw.

That's my point exactly and no matter if you're working with PIC, 80x86, or whatever else is out there, assembly works directly on the machine without an interpreter.
And just to prove my limited electronics experience, I never knew there was such a thing as a digital potentiometer- very cool.

Perhaps we should continue this discussion under a more aptly named thread as we've obviously gone waaaaaaay off-topic!

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

On a limited resources micro like a PIC, you're gonna have to drop down to assembly for critical routines anyway, regardless if your main program is in BASIC, C, or whatever else. So you might as well do it properly the first time round.

PIC assembly is quite a bit different from x86 btw.

Anyway, i got an LCD running. I think i'm going to do something similar to this meter but since i've already started on a different (and bigger) micro i'll probably drop a few extra features in. No, i'm not telling what they are. Not yet. The circuit is AC coupled so it should work for what i'm trying to do, but you never know. Well, at least it won't blow up.

I'm going to code the whole thing myself, because all the LCD routines i found on the net needed substantial re-engineering to even initialize the display properly, at this point the screen is running on my very own display routine. It's based on this one somewhat, but a lot of things have been changed. Luckily both my micro (PIC16F876A) and the Pickit 2 programmer support in-circuit debugging, it makes adapting existing code less of a guessing game. For example, this guy's delay routine got stuck in an endless loop in my PIC. And that's just ONE of the wrongs i found.

Anyway, i'm going part hunting. I'll keep you updated. Edit: Found just what i wanted. Take a look. http://ro.farnell.com/microchip/mcp4...sop/dp/1840755 And hey, it's the same price as a regular pot. Now, take a wild guess as to what i'm going to control with it.

[Digital Technophile]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

x3. Yet another area of expertise that is found wanting. Assembly is handy to know (don't know BASIC well enough to compare), I know from past experiences with BIOS modding (no, I was toooo chicken to try) about those "calls", eax push and mov, but I've never really been dirty handed enough to do something useful enough to warrant going beyond a simple understanding. Then I read a book that might as well been written in Portugese (some people's writing can make me very, very sleeeepy).

PHP I've had a better understanding of, but like all languages (including human), if you're not using it on a daily, forgetfulness begins creeping in; I haven't really done any of it for over two years' now.

@sevarch: Yes BASIC,C++,Javascript,Python,etc. "DO" the same thing, the distinct difference is assembly requires no compiler and is what is considered low-level programming where hardware (like PIC, PC BIOS, etc.) can read code directly.

[moola]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Pretty complicated stuff. I don't blame you for being too lazy to figure that stuff out

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Yeah, that meter looks really neat. Also he has the same DMM as i do. However, i'm not too sure about the measuring method used... looks like too many parts involved in the "calibration". I am going to do large signal measurements - analyzing the behavior of the cap in a real world application. Since the ripple currents involved will be large, the accompanying voltage drop due to ESR will be high, thus easier to measure.



The analog meters aren't up to snuff. You either get large useful range but low precision or high precision but limited range. As far as PIC programming goes... i managed to learn the basics in 3 days. And that's in assembly language not BASIC or C. Their limited instruction set makes them really trivial to code for. It also means that you have to use a lot of tricks however, but you can make subroutines that you call to make those tricks... Once you've written all your subroutines the code pretty much becomes "call this, call that".

I'll be getting two 28-pin PICs along with two 16x2 LCD displays today. 5 output pins really aren't enough for anything more than dimming/blinking/spinning a few LEDs.

Well good luck on that. MCUs kind of turn me off unless the code is right there for me. I really should learn about them more....If only I had time.

[severach]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Once you've written all your subroutines the code pretty much becomes "call this, call that".

Isn't that what the BASIC already does?

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

http://kaspars.id.lv/?menu_id=32

This guy makes some really neat stuff...especially with power related things.

When I get the nerve , I definitley want to try this thing. It looks like one of the best DIY ESR testers I've ever seen...though I can't be sure.

Yeah, that meter looks really neat. Also he has the same DMM as i do. However, i'm not too sure about the measuring method used... looks like too many parts involved in the "calibration". I am going to do large signal measurements - analyzing the behavior of the cap in a real world application. Since the ripple currents involved will be large, the accompanying voltage drop due to ESR will be high, thus easier to measure.

I see a couple of road blocks in this endeavor, mainly PIC programming (uhh, Th3_uN1Qu3???) and/or calibration. I do however feel fortunate to live in a town (albeit a small one) that just so happens to have a PCB manufacturer in it
Perhaps some more reading and info digging are in order.

The analog meters aren't up to snuff. You either get large useful range but low precision or high precision but limited range. As far as PIC programming goes... i managed to learn the basics in 3 days. And that's in assembly language not BASIC or C. Their limited instruction set makes them really trivial to code for. It also means that you have to use a lot of tricks however, but you can make subroutines that you call to make those tricks... Once you've written all your subroutines the code pretty much becomes "call this, call that".

I'll be getting two 28-pin PICs along with two 16x2 LCD displays today. 5 output pins really aren't enough for anything more than dimming/blinking/spinning a few LEDs.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Oh yeah, nice find! When I looked for ESR testers, I saw the page @ http://members.shaw.ca/swstuff/esrmeter.html. At the time, I wasn't sure (and still a bit so) I would be capable of such a project. And though analog readouts are nice for certain applications, I like digital in this instance for size and precision (c & c welcome). I see a couple of road blocks in this endeavor, mainly PIC programming (uhh, Th3_uN1Qu3???) and/or calibration. I do however feel fortunate to live in a town (albeit a small one) that just so happens to have a PCB manufacturer in it
Perhaps some more reading and info digging are in order.

I put together a possible build on Mouser, and with the best possible parts I could fine, the cost of the ESR meter is a whopping $30. If you went with cheaper film capacitors, carbon film resistors etc., you could probably get the price down to around $20-25.

I don't have a PIC programmer, though I suppose it would be a good thing to have. He has all of the files for the PIC as well. He provides the board layout, schematic files, and how to calibrate it. Pretty sweet honestly.

[Digital Technophile]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

http://kaspars.id.lv/?menu_id=32

This guy makes some really neat stuff...especially with power related things.

When I get the nerve , I definitley want to try this thing. It looks like one of the best DIY ESR testers I've ever seen...though I can't be sure.

Oh yeah, nice find! When I looked for ESR testers, I saw the page @ http://members.shaw.ca/swstuff/esrmeter.html. At the time, I wasn't sure (and still a bit so) I would be capable of such a project. And though analog readouts are nice for certain applications, I like digital in this instance for size and precision (c & c welcome). I see a couple of road blocks in this endeavor, mainly PIC programming (uhh, Th3_uN1Qu3???) and/or calibration. I do however feel fortunate to live in a town (albeit a small one) that just so happens to have a PCB manufacturer in it
Perhaps some more reading and info digging are in order.

[lti]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Well that site's a start, only I'm not so great at Japanese and apparently, neither is Google.

It could be worse. IE8's built-in translator thought the site was written in French.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

http://kaspars.id.lv/?menu_id=32

This guy makes some really neat stuff...especially with power related things.

When I get the nerve , I definitley want to try this thing. It looks like one of the best DIY ESR testers I've ever seen...though I can't be sure.

[Digital Technophile]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

http://capacitor.web.fc2.com/



Well, now that i've got a PIC programmer i can do lots of funky things that would otherwise require a crapload of trimmers to get right. The basic schematic of the meter has been finished quite a while ago, but the micro will make it simpler and more efficient. Now i just need to buy an LCD display.

Well that site's a start, only I'm not so great at Japanese and apparently, neither is Google. BUt looking at the site, it seems as though people across the world are pissed off at bad caps! Just looking upon the sheer number of cap manufacturers, makes me wonder...maybe I can make caps too

Seriously, I'd like to see what you come up with the tester. What kind of LCD do you seek? Something like this:
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...001_2118660_-1
I'd really like an ESR meter, but more so building one to increase my knowledge of electronics would be even better. Make sure to keep us posted, sounds like you're close!

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I really think that we could provide a great service to the WWW by creating a Wiki with a comprehensive listing of ALL cap manufacturers as well as listing PSU's, MoBo's, and any manner of electronic devices made past and present with caps in them

http://capacitor.web.fc2.com/

I would like to see this tester Th3_uN1Qu3, perhaps I can build it now that my soldering confidence is building back up!

Well, now that i've got a PIC programmer i can do lots of funky things that would otherwise require a crapload of trimmers to get right. The basic schematic of the meter has been finished quite a while ago, but the micro will make it simpler and more efficient. Now i just need to buy an LCD display.

[Digital Technophile]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I think that Capxon should do a corporate restructure and re-brand themselves as Crapxon, 'cause if you buy anything with them in it, well you get...

CRAPPED ON!

You know I'm almost at the point now where I say screw the warranty, let's pop this [*insert capacitor laden electronic device here*] open and see what's inside. And on that note, I really think that we could provide a great service to the WWW by creating a Wiki with a comprehensive listing of ALL cap manufacturers as well as listing PSU's, MoBo's, and any manner of electronic devices made past and present with caps in them. I mean, as this board grows bigger and older and wiser I think that you may find good information getting lost, old threads dug up (guilty). If cap master sees the wisdom in this, I can and will assist in creating and maintaining said Wiki. Just throwing it out there for consideration

I posted about a capacitor load tester a while back. I'll probably build it in a month or so.

I would like to see this tester Th3_uN1Qu3, perhaps I can build it now that my soldering confidence is building back up!

[Th3_uN1Qu3]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Fuhjyyu worse than CapXon, yes. Su'scon is better.

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Fuhjyuu and Suscon are lesser quality than Capxon.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Capxon. I can take a low esr Capxon which maybe has a superior ripple ratign and use it for general purpose applications. Lelon low-esr caps are few and in-between.

Hmmph. I'm stumped. I was sure that nothing could be as bad as CapXon (on this tier).

[mockingbird]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

Capxon. I can take a low esr Capxon which maybe has a superior ripple ratign and use it for general purpose applications. Lelon low-esr caps are few and in-between.

[TheLaw]

Re: Are bad-cap brands getting better?

I would use old stock Xicon, but I would not touch anything Lelon.

Okay then.

Quick! CapXon vs Lelon? ...Lelon,right?