Am I overtaxing my PSU?

[dood]

I just added another hard drive to my system, and it got me thinking that maybe I should upgrade my PSU. I currently have a FSP Group 300w supply.

Here's what I'm running-

Intel P4 3.2ghz
Gateway mobo from an E-4300
Nvidia 6600GT PCIe video card
SATA DVD Burner
Western Digital Raptor 36gb 10000RPM SATA primary
Seagate 250gb 7200RPM SATA Secondary
Maxtor 200gb 7200RPM IDE Thirdary

The drive I just added is the Raptor. I have no other expansion cards beyond the video card. I'm also not having any problems with the system. No instability or anything like that (though I haven't fired up any games yet because I'm still in the process of reloading stuff).

Thoughts?

[Scenic]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

mhhh.. a 250W Fortron Source was not enough for this config:

P4 Northwood 2,8GHz
EPoX 4PCA3i (i875)
GF6800 (the one without letters)
one 20GB HDD and a DVD-ROM

it worked (sort of), but it was crashing now and then and sometimes even turning off (while surfing on the net.)...
when i touched the PSU after the box was running half an hour i got in panic...

the whole PSU case was almost too hot to the touch... fan was at full speed all the time and it was still that hot..

i tried to replace the GF6800 with an old GF4 MX460... worked much better.. but it still got quite hot...
bought a 350W FSP PSU (used) on ebay... recapped it (fuhuhuhuckyou caps ) and everything was running fine... until my 1999 20GB Seagate died

damn... this box is just cursed... everytime i put something "new" in there, something else dies ... crap

anyways... i'd upgrade that PSU... i bet you'll run into troubles as soon as you play 3d games..
and i'd upgrade it before it makes you have to buy a new one (along with a new board, proc, ram and everything) cause it blew up

i'm a bit envious about that raptor... :P
can't really afford one... around 100€ (~ 140US$)

[Newbie2]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

Upgrade it to a 400W PSU at least, but if there isn't any stability problems or anything else than you should be alright.

[dood]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817151033

This guy looks quite attractive, being $40 off right now.

I honestly didn't even realise I had a 300w supply... I just happened to glance at the label while I was elbows-deep in the case and thought :O!

PSU also doesn't get that hot... and the fan stays at it's lowest speed. I know the speed control works, because the last time I actually had games loaded, it would speed up a few minutes into playing. Guess that 6600gt does pull some juice.

[zandrax]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

The psu you picked should be good: according to the Overclock3D's photos, Seasonic used premium caps in its S12-II line.
I agree your 300W is a power limit at full load, but only because the highest draw is on the 12 V line. BTW Fortrons aren't bad: they simply use average caps.

Zandrax

[i4004]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

>PSU also doesn't get that hot... and the fan stays at it's lowest speed

which means you don't have to worry about it.

having a spare is not a bad idea, but i wouldn't change psu that's working ok.
i would have a spare ready to be deployed in case first one goes.
(i have identical fortron(to the one in machine) incase i need it..)

from that perspective seasonic seems like a good deal.
65$ is excellent price for such psu.

something else is weird when one looks at seasonic and corsair newegg reviews: you always have some doa(or simillar) cases.
how the hell you justify that on psus that are normally pretty expensive?
poor quality control?
damage in transport?
what's inside, jelly?

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

Look at the *combined* 3.3v+5v watt rating.
That's where you could get bit.
Some PSU's don't have squat there these days.
Labels make it look like you have plenty of amps on each but the combined rating doesn't support those numbers.
I've seen 500+ watt PSUs that have barely over 100 watts on 3.3v/5v combined.
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With 3.3v/5v powering: chipset, RAM, sound, LAN, Drives, PCI slots, ,,,, 100 watts runs out of room pretty fast.

.

[dood]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

Fired up Steam and played Trackmania Nations Forever for about 2 hours straight last night. No instability or issues at all (other than I need a better video card!). I think I'm going to hang with my "lowly" 300 watter for now, and think about upgrading if and when I get a new video card.

[kc8adu]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

i see new systems with less psu than that with more stuff inside.
at least the fsp is not overrated.
i have an aopen rebadged fsp300 in a server here stuffed with 10 and 15k scsi drives,a vp6,raid,several tape drives,abunch of fans,and a m.o
been running 5 years like that.i did a preventive recap when i installed it as it had fuhkyyu caps.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

If you don't buy into fancy video cards (which few people actually need) or go nuts with RAM then a newer system might need less power.
Depends on the CPU.
Some of the newer CPU's use less watts (some a lot less) than older chips.
If you use basic (or on-board) video and the same #drives and so on you probably won't need as much PSU as with a Prescott or similar in the same configuration.

FSP is one of the brands that doesn't lie on their label and they tend to be conservative in rating things. In other words that FSP300 is probably capable of more than 300 watts.

[Bear with me.]
I just got two same model FSP460's in. One was in a server and the other was bought as a ready spare for the same server. (That company required it.) It was tested on receipt and then stuffed back in the box and put in the store room. In other words one of them only has like 10 minutes run time on it. Server decommissioned now so I got my hands on both PSUs. Date codes (on the caps) indicate built in mid-late 2002 so they are just under 6 years old.
[Now here's the fun part]:
There is one Fuhjyyu in each PSU and BOTH Fuhjyyu's are bloated.
That's the second old but unused PSU with bloated Fuhjyyu's I've run into in the last year.

FUHJYYUs BLOAT ON THE SHELF!!!!!

FUHJYYU

.

[dood]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

I just realised something interesting about my power supply. I was looking over the rating label, and I noticed that it actually has 2 12v rails. 12v1 is rated for 8 amps, 12v2 is rated for 16 amps. As of right now, my entire computer is running on 12v1!

Let me explain... the reason I got this motherboard for free was that the auxiliary 12v connector had heated up, melted, and was no longer making contact. I took a 4 pin molex to 12vaux converter, lopped the aux end off, and soldered the wires directly to the board. After a good week of stress tests and monitoring, I deemed that there was nothing wrong with the board, and put it in my machine.

HOWEVER, the only thing that this power supply has 12v2 wired to is that 12v aux connector. By having it plugged into one of the standard "drive" connectors, effectively the entire machine is running on one 12v rail. The label says that 12v1 is yellow wires, 12v2 is yellow/black wires. The only yellow/black I've found is on that aux connector. None of the drive lines have the stripe.

Sooo, I guess I need to find another dead board and scavenge the real connector off of it, and redo my rigging job

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

Most PSU's have 12v1 jumpered to 12v2 on the PCB right before final output anyway.

It's all a bunch of foolishness to comply with (or rather appear to) some requirement in the UK where there has to be less than,,, umm,,, ummm?,,, 'some' amount of VA on each output.

Then the marketing jerks got a hold of it and try to make it look like it's a benefit to PC owners.

COME ON!
The motherboard and video card don't care where the 12v comes from as long as the amps they need are behind it.

One rail would be fine, if not better!
Would mean fewer parts in PSU if nothing else.
.

[dood]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

You know there's PSUs on Newegg with FOUR 12v rails? Guess those Quad SLI setups need some juice...

I think at that point it comes down to be able to power each rail with cheaper components instead of having to have one BEEFY set of components.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: Am I overtaxing my PSU?

Yes, I've even seen inside a few of those.
Most of those that 'supposedly' have 4 rails still have the jumpers.

I doubt it's cheaper and it definitely takes more room.
A lot of those units are much bigger than standard ATX to fit all the extra parts in.

As power goes up at some point you HAVE to have more transformer.
If you are using more rails that either means multiple transformers or a huge one with more output secondaries. Either way (more secondaries or more transformers) you have to have more parts to regulate and for protection on each rail you add.
NOW the problem is to keep them separate you must also have an output filter on each and every rail. If they are PI filters and you have 4 12v rails that means 8 output caps (and 4 coils) just for 12v.
[Enter jumpers. Rail separation departing. *ding*]

I think the law and reasoning that started all this is asinine anyway.
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You aren't in there (where the wires are) unless you are working on it.
That is a maintenance mode. Not an 'in use' mode.
But their thinking every light socket needs a fuse on it to be legal.
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You can't pull more power out of it than you put in and that plug to the wall is legal.
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Those 18-20 gage wires are in effect fusable links. Something like 5-10 amps max.
The only way you could get hit by 20 amps at 12v would be to do it with multiple wires. With one wire the wire itself is a fuse.
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