MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

[wfsdno]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

I did take the battery out any time I was soldering. I will try to start up without a battery and I'll go by a new battery tomorrow. It uses CR2032 watch battery.

I'll report back soon. Roger

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Yes, you should pull the battery when replacing caps.
I wasn't sure you did.
If you had the battery out then the CMOS already reset.
.

[wfsdno]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Well, I think I'm giving up. Tried again, removed battery, nothing. Put in new battery, nothing, not even the blinking a light. Checked all my settings and plugs.......
I tried, had fun, learned a little.

What parts can I sell? I know RAM is worth a couple dollars on ebay. Anything else valuable or boat anchor it???

Thanks for all your help, input and patience. Roger

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Hello. I have 2 of these boards with bad caps. But they are version 2.0. Can someone tell me if the kit sold here will also work for ver 2.0?
https://www.badcaps.net/store/produc...products_id=86

Thank you

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Why don't you count the caps of each size on the motherboard and then check if that is what is in the kit?

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Wow, what a blond moment. I will do just that when I get home.

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

So I have both V2.0 boards in front of me.
I hijacked a pic.

My actual bad caps are KZG and are rated at 3300uF/6.3v.
Also a solitary TEAPO 470uF/6.3v is domed, the other 2 identical rated caps are not.



I have Nichions. That are part of the kit 1500uF/16V. they are fine, should I replace them out of principle?
Also the kit includes an 1800uF/6.3v cap. mine is not blown and has a stylized [M] on it with a (T) vent and C.FL on the side. Is that a Panasonic.
Also the 10 1000uF/6.3v on one board bare the same Panasonic markings, and not blown.

But on the other board they resemble the branding on the branding of KZG.

So, should I replace the caps that resemble Panasonic C.FL. though not blown
Also should I replace the Nichicons even though they are not blown?

I did read the stickies. there just is a lot to comprehend.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

My actual bad caps are KZG and are rated at 3300uF/6.3v.
Also a solitary TEAPO 470uF/6.3v is domed, the other 2 identical rated caps are not.

Those should be replaced along with any other KZG and/or Teapo at least from 470uF and up.
- KZG are Chemicon [the shield shaped logo]. Chemicon are normally okay caps except for the KZG and KZJ series' which seem to have issues with heat. I just replace them [KZG/KZJ] because I don't like recapping the same board twice.
- When Teapo go it's pretty safe to assume the whole batch is bad. In other words if one goes get rid of all of them.
- Saying 470uF and up reflects the 'current wisdom' or 'accepted practice' amoung most techs now days. I however am a perfectionist with paranoia issues [or maybe it's OCD] and I often replace 220uF and up if I don't trust the brand or if I see bad larger size caps of the same brand on a particular board.

I have Nichions. That are part of the kit 1500uF/16V. they are fine, should I replace them out of principle?

If they are Nichicon HN or HM series and the date codes from 2001 thru 2004 then yes, replace them. Any other 105C rated Nichicon should be fine unless some outside influence killed them. [Date code is like H0244, the "02" in that string indicates year 2002, the "44" indicates week 44, the meaning of the H is top secret and we would have to send some guy with a black tie from the CIA [Capacitor Intel Agency].]
- I specified 105C because some manufacturers use 85C Temp rated caps for the small caps and sometimes those die young. When manufacturers do that Nichicon 85C caps are a common choice.

Also the kit includes an 1800uF/6.3v cap. mine is not blown and has a stylized [M] on it with a (T) vent and C.FL on the side. Is that a Panasonic. Also the 10 1000uF/6.3v on one board bare the same Panasonic markings, and not blown.

Those are Panasonic FL series. The stylized [M] is for Matsushita who is their parent company. The (T) vent with the bowed top bar is their trademark. Any Panasonic/Matsushita cap should be fine unless some outside influence killed them.

But on the other board they resemble the branding on the branding of KZG.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'resemble'.
KZG or KZJ will be marked as such somewhere on them. If they have the Chemicon sheild logo and are series marked something other than KZG or KZJ then they should be fine.

-
If you just want to blanket recap the whole boards then the kits might be the way to go for you.

If you are just going to replace known problem caps then buying individually [or one kit plus some individually] might work out cheaper because you won't be buying replacements for caps you aren't going to replace.

.

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Wow. This has been very informative! Thank you much sir. It helps to gain
an understanding when It applies to hardware in your hands.
My Nichicons are H0532, so ok on that. And I'll leave the Panasonic's alone.

On the same board
I also have Chemicon (nologo) KZE 470uF 10v, All 3 are apper ok.Also there is 6 1 X (3) printed on the can. Is that series generally ok?

Also, what can I replace a 0470uF/6.3V with? There are no 6.3v for that capacity for sale here.
only Rubycon 470uF 16v 8mm MBZ Series.

Also a KMG 100uF 16v. Not domed, Should I replace that one too? is so whith what? only 100uF 25v 6mm GK Series from Samxon is avialbe in forum store.


Again, thank you much for your assistance,

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Also the 1000/6.3 are KZE caps on my other board. Replace them?

[momaka]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

KZE series are good.
As for KMG series - that's just general purpose caps but with 105C temperature rating, so just about any cap with a 105C rating can be used as replacement. I don't think you need to replace them, though (unless of course PZBONEZ or someone else here with more experience on recapping motherboards thinks otherwise).
Both KZE and KMG are from United Chemicon. Like PCBONEZ said, they make good caps but have problems with KZG and KZJ series.

[Topcat]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

I do have a kit for this board, I've seen a lot of them.

https://www.badcaps.net/store/produc...products_id=86

I would replace the 1000uF caps, I've seen a lot of these boards with them failed.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

KZE series are good.
As for KMG series - that's just general purpose caps but with 105C temperature rating, so just about any cap with a 105C rating can be used as replacement. I don't think you need to replace them, though (unless of course PZBONEZ or someone else here with more experience on recapping motherboards thinks otherwise).
Both KZE and KMG are from United Chemicon. Like PCBONEZ said, they make good caps but have problems with KZG and KZJ series.

You called that right momaka

Topcat says he sees the 1000uF fail on that board which means the KZE may be a motherboard designer screw-up.
Good caps but not good enough for where they got put.
He sees a lot more MSI boards than I do so I'd take his advice.

470uF 16v will work if they aren't to big around.
The voltage marked on a cap is the max it can handle.

ON MOTHERBOARDS 6.3v and 10v caps are interchangeable.
This is because the actual voltages ON MOTHERBOARDS are 12v, 5v, and 3.3v or less.
- Both 6.3v and 10v caps are more than 5v actual.
- Neither 6.3v nor 10v caps would be found on 12v actual.

.

[Topcat]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

^
UCC's in general are good lytics, they just don't respond well when they're ran at or close to their max temp rating, and fail sooner than other brands such as Panasonic or Rubycon. Many of these boards I've seen, the 1000uF caps didn't fail, but there were more than a few that did....and I'm sure it was poor cooling conditions, not the quality of the caps. Other top-end brands will fail under the same conditions.

As Bonez mentioned, it is ALWAYS safe to substitute a 6.3v in place of a 10v, and visa-versa, there's never more than 5v present on them. However, a 16v, you want to measure the voltage on it before scaling down the capacitor's rated voltage just to be sure. Many 16v caps on mainboards are the VRM inputs filters (usually 1000uF all the way up to 1800uF typically) and the voltage on the inputs is 12v right off the PSU secondary. FYI, many boards will use 16v caps on the 5v and 3.3v rails (usually the 470uF and 220uF values), which is why you want to check them if you question it.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

I've seen KZE do fine in too many hot spots to think they have heat issues.
[PC and LCD TV PSU's, Intel Server boards, Tyan server boards.]
The Intel boards tend to use them with 3 or 4 per cpu or have two paralleled with a poly so individually the KZE aren't handling that much ripple. They are often bellied right up to the MOSFETs on those boards so they do get a lot of outside heat and they do fine there.

I have seen/heard of lots of some -select boards- [mostly Asus A7xxx series] having issues with KZE which makes me think Asus used caps with too low a ripple rating for the application. [Design error.] - Asus seems to like to spread their design errors around so more people can enjoy them.

That's just my conclusion from what I've seen.

-

UCC KZG and KZJ definitely have heat issues. [And don't always bloat.]
- This next is for the new guy. - I'm sure the rest of ya'll have heard it.
The first box of dead boards I did when I decided to get into recapping boards as a regular thing had two MSI P4 that ran but just quit booting for no apparent reason. [Worked fine one day, wouldn't boot the next day.] They had no bloated caps but they had KZG right next to the P4 CPU socket. I replaced -just- the KZG as an experiment and ta-da, they both booted and ran fine again. [My first experience with un-bloated bad caps so it's more or less burned into my brain.]

.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Umm, My point is the 1000uF KZE are good caps but according to Topcat they have problems on THAT board so replace them.
MSI was probably cheaping-out and better rated caps should have been used.
-
Rubycon MBZ, Sanyo WG, Panasonic FJ, FL, or maybe FM would be my choices there.


.

[goodpsusearch]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

-

UCC KZG and KZJ definitely have heat issues. [And don't always bloat.]

.

And why they do nothing about that? Nichicon has fixed the problem with the HM/HN.

Why a good cap company allows 2 bad series spoil its reputation?

[thesavo]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

OK. Well, just to be safe, I;ll replace the 10 KZG's on Board (B). but leave the Panasonic's on the Board A. Strange how they would change them mid run. (I bought my board B, after buddy bought his Board A. Also how do you all keep this info straight in your heads?

So many 3 letter arrangements. For brands and Series desiccations. I do plan on practicing on my K7S5A.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

And why they do nothing about that? Nichicon has fixed the problem with the HM/HN.

Why a good cap company allows 2 bad series spoil its reputation?

You got me. I dunno why they don't fix it.

I do know that KZG and KZJ use essentially the same [if not identical] electrolyte.
I know from reading an old chem-icon ad announcing the new [new at that time] KZJ series.

.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: MSI-7207 (K8NGM2-L) version 1.0

Strange how they would change them mid run.

Actually fairly common.
I've seen same model and revision boards have different caps fairly often.

I had a box of ~28 Gigabyte boards a while ago.
All the same model and revision.
Between them by cap brands there were at least 5 different capacitor layout combinations.