EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

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  • sam_sam_sam
    Badcaps Legend
    • Jul 2011
    • 6026
    • USA

    #21
    Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

    Here are the testing results from the battery with a BMS protection board
    Attached Files

    Comment

    • sam_sam_sam
      Badcaps Legend
      • Jul 2011
      • 6026
      • USA

      #22
      Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

      This is the circuit symbol for this mosfets and how it is hookup X2
      Attached Files

      Comment

      • CapLeaker
        Leaking Member
        • Dec 2014
        • 8030
        • Canada

        #23
        Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

        O.k. Somehow the gate pins use three 10k ohm resistors… and where do they go from there?

        Comment

        • sam_sam_sam
          Badcaps Legend
          • Jul 2011
          • 6026
          • USA

          #24
          Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

          One resistor go from the positive side of the power supply one gate pin to the next resistor then to the next gate pin then to the negative side of the power supply in between the two resistors is the resistor that goes to the controller board which appears to go to one of the lm358 ic chip but I not quite sure exactly where it goes for sure because it has a pin connector on it

          (P)———-resistor——— gate pin ———> | <———gate pin ——— resistor——-(N)
          ><= resistor connection to the controller

          I have to check this to make sure I have this information correct I might have this a little bit wrong
          Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 05-29-2022, 04:14 PM.

          Comment

          • CapLeaker
            Leaking Member
            • Dec 2014
            • 8030
            • Canada

            #25
            Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

            While you’re at it, draw it out. You say the controller board is o.k.?

            Comment

            • sam_sam_sam
              Badcaps Legend
              • Jul 2011
              • 6026
              • USA

              #26
              Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

              Yes one of them works with out the mosfets not installed the volt and current meters work

              The other one does not work correctly on the current it will show 5.5 amps or it does not show anything but does not charge any more the voltage meter still works with out the mosfets not installed

              Comment

              • CapLeaker
                Leaking Member
                • Dec 2014
                • 8030
                • Canada

                #27
                Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                I don't think the Mosfets turn on while charging. I think the Mosfets must have some weird configuration, where the large heat sink is on the bottom of the board and the Mosfets mounted to them, cooled by a fan. So I think this section is your "load". The Mosfets should be turned off during charging.
                I can't imagine it being any other way. If the Mosfets would be sticking out on top, the N channel Mosets would be facing each other and cooling of them is a headache. So this doesn't make any sense, as it couldn't handle any load at all.
                To me the Mosfets are mounted laying upside down to the board (the Mosfets back facing away from the bottom of the board), so a large heat sink can be mounted. So no... those suckers do Jack while charging. The resistors are placed to prevent an accidental turn on of the Mosfets each side. Plus don't forget protection for being hooked up backwards!

                Comment

                • sam_sam_sam
                  Badcaps Legend
                  • Jul 2011
                  • 6026
                  • USA

                  #28
                  Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                  I will have to try this on one that still works correctly that is not new and see if the mosfets are used while in the charging mode but what I can tell you is that the voltage regulator is not controlling the current this much I can tell you because the on/off sensing pin is not hooked up to the controller board but is at the connector but no wire is in this slot

                  The regulator seems to be configured for current limiting mode because the resistors and capacitors the configuration that is on this board does not match what is in the data sheet
                  Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 05-30-2022, 04:57 AM.

                  Comment

                  • sam_sam_sam
                    Badcaps Legend
                    • Jul 2011
                    • 6026
                    • USA

                    #29
                    Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                    Originally posted by CapLeaker
                    I don't think the Mosfets turn on while charging. I think the Mosfets must have some weird configuration, where the large heat sink is on the bottom of the board and the Mosfets mounted to them, cooled by a fan. So I think this section is your "load". The Mosfets should be turned off during charging.
                    I can't imagine it being any other way. If the Mosfets would be sticking out on top, the N channel Mosets would be facing each other and cooling of them is a headache. So this doesn't make any sense, as it couldn't handle any load at all.
                    To me the Mosfets are mounted laying upside down to the board (the Mosfets back facing away from the bottom of the board), so a large heat sink can be mounted. So no... those suckers do Jack while charging. The resistors are placed to prevent an accidental turn on of the Mosfets each side. Plus don't forget protection for being hooked up backwards!
                    Well I have some answers to these questions that you asked about and I was wondering about my self the pictures will tell the story the green wire that you see on left side of the battery testing machine is from the mosfet gate pin and that is where the other meter lead is you will notice where the meter lead is on the battery when on charging and where it is discharging

                    So it seems that the mosfets are used when charging and discharging this would explain why it would sometimes act up on charging mode and would work on discharging mode and sometimes it would be reversed and it would act the other way but now it does not work correctly in either mode on one controller

                    Maybe you might have an idea how this is done I am at a loss of how this works

                    The only thing that I can come up with when it is charging the current is one direction and when it is discharging the current is in other direction because I once had a car that had an analog current meter and in the center was “0” current and to the right of the gauge was charging and to the left side of the gauge was discharging so that might be case that in one it done one way in charging mode and in discharging mode it done a different way this just a guess to what might be going on in this circuit

                    I might do an forensic autopsy on the controller board but I have not been willing to this yet because I was hoping to get a replacement controller and mosfet board but I have not gotten a response from the company that made this battery testing machine

                    When I buy another new battery testing machine I will probably do the controller board and I will post some pictures of it when I decide to undertake this when I have some more time
                    Attached Files
                    Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 05-30-2022, 11:48 AM.

                    Comment

                    • sam_sam_sam
                      Badcaps Legend
                      • Jul 2011
                      • 6026
                      • USA

                      #30
                      Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                      Well I bought another battery testing machine but this one is the EBC-A20 but this one seems to act differently than the EBC-A10H in that when charging it seems to check the voltage every so often or it is not functioning correctly and I have not figured out which case it is but everything else seems to work ok

                      But I have understand why this one does that every so often and it does not seem to have a certain pattern to it from what I can see so far

                      In the discharge mode it works just like the other one so I guess I will have to see if it keeps working or not
                      Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 07-10-2022, 09:54 AM.

                      Comment

                      • CapLeaker
                        Leaking Member
                        • Dec 2014
                        • 8030
                        • Canada

                        #31
                        Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                        Are you using the same battery chemistry?
                        Some chargers stop for a fracture of a second, take a measure then continue changing. That’s with NICD, NIMH.
                        Lithium Ions are different and the charger constantly monitors CC and CV.

                        Comment

                        • sam_sam_sam
                          Badcaps Legend
                          • Jul 2011
                          • 6026
                          • USA

                          #32
                          Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                          Originally posted by CapLeaker
                          Are you using the same battery chemistry?
                          Some chargers stop for a fracture of a second, take a measure then continue changing. That’s with NICD, NIMH.
                          Lithium Ions are different and the charger constantly monitors CC and CV.
                          This is weird thing about this charger it does have have those options and I was charging a battery with out the BMS protection board hooked up and it did this that why I am a little confused about what was happening when I saw that it going 200 milliamperes to 1.0 amp which it did this quite a few times and went back to normal then a few minutes later it dose the same thing again I had it set to now if I set it for 500 milliamperes it so far has not done this so I do not know what going on with this

                          Comment

                          • sam_sam_sam
                            Badcaps Legend
                            • Jul 2011
                            • 6026
                            • USA

                            #33
                            Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                            EBC-A10H

                            I just realized that the ribbon cable can be plugged in wrong way and it will power up but it this is when it shows nearly 6 amp even though it’s not really there but this is when if you hook up a battery to the load then it does pull nearly 6 amps

                            But this does not change what I going to do with the ones that I thought had this issue

                            On one of the mosfet board I removed the buck converter but left the capacitor for the output side of the buck converter to the relay that turns on the charging circuit I also left the diode that is across the input positive and negative power supply rails and just hook up the buck converter that has the voltage/current adjustable power supply and see how well this setup actually works

                            Hopefully I will be able to charge BMS protection board with out tripping the battery testing machine or the BMS protection board

                            Comment

                            • sam_sam_sam
                              Badcaps Legend
                              • Jul 2011
                              • 6026
                              • USA

                              #34
                              Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                              Well I had some time yesterday and finally found out how the charging circuit works they do not use the mosfets like it appears to at first instead they use the TTL mode on the buck converter ic chip but what I do not completely understand is how they are controlling the current not the voltage like you would normally how you would use this ic chip

                              I going to buy some new XL4015 and reinstall them with a wire on the feedback pin and switching output pin and see how this is done

                              Because I have been very curious about this is done because I have not been able to find any examples of how this is done

                              Comment

                              • sam_sam_sam
                                Badcaps Legend
                                • Jul 2011
                                • 6026
                                • USA

                                #35
                                Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                “ Because I have been very curious about how this is done because I have not been able to find any examples of how this is done ” from the above post

                                Major update on the XL4015 buck converter that has voltage/current control capability but more importantly the current control that has a voltage/current module meter on top of the buck converter

                                The TenStar Robot does not work correctly on the current control the current light comes on very dim but does not control the current

                                The meter seems to be very accurate for the type of meter that it is but the current control circuit is crap and does not work at all
                                Attached Files
                                Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 09-30-2022, 06:29 PM.

                                Comment

                                • sam_sam_sam
                                  Badcaps Legend
                                  • Jul 2011
                                  • 6026
                                  • USA

                                  #36
                                  Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                  Now this module works correctly on the current but does not come with the voltage/current meters it just so happens that the board are very similar but I had to use the pots from the one that the current control does not work correctly

                                  Now I have a voltage/current controller that actually works correctly the way it should

                                  One note about this setup it is very difficult to get this setup to work correctly because the voltage ( going UP turns in one direction but to lower the current limit you have to go in the same —>

                                  ( which you think that lowering voltage/current would be in the same direction )

                                  <— direction for turning down the current which was a little confusing at first
                                  Attached Files
                                  Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 09-30-2022, 06:50 PM.

                                  Comment

                                  • sam_sam_sam
                                    Badcaps Legend
                                    • Jul 2011
                                    • 6026
                                    • USA

                                    #37
                                    Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                    I tried to use the controller output from the EBC-A10H will not work correctly in the configuration of the voltage/current controller module with the meters on not a big deal but it would have been nice if I could have gotten it to work

                                    I had removed the buck converter ic chip and it components completely because I want to see if I could have it controlled by the software but it does not work correctly the way it should
                                    Attached Files
                                    Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 09-30-2022, 06:36 PM.

                                    Comment

                                    • sam_sam_sam
                                      Badcaps Legend
                                      • Jul 2011
                                      • 6026
                                      • USA

                                      #38
                                      Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                      Now I have to put the XL4015 voltage/current module in an enclosure with a switching power supply so I can safely use this setup

                                      But now I can charge battery packs that have a BMS protection board the battery pack that refused to charge on the EBC-A10H plotting software which is a relief that I now have it working

                                      Which is the one that you see in the picture above

                                      I posted this update for the followers of this post and the interest in this project
                                      Last edited by sam_sam_sam; 09-30-2022, 06:31 PM.

                                      Comment

                                      • CapLeaker
                                        Leaking Member
                                        • Dec 2014
                                        • 8030
                                        • Canada

                                        #39
                                        Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                        Given I haven’t been around much lately, but I still follow this thread. Just so effing busy with tons of installs and repairs and a recent response, I already feel the need for another vacation. Lol

                                        Comment

                                        • sam_sam_sam
                                          Badcaps Legend
                                          • Jul 2011
                                          • 6026
                                          • USA

                                          #40
                                          Re: EBC-A10H BatteryTesting Machine Mosfet Failure when activate dose not turn off

                                          I really need to find the time to finish this project I have it mostly done but I have not finished putting the buck converter in the enclosure yet and modified the switching power for this project yet

                                          Comment

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