Ratdude's main rig V5.0

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Too bad it's an auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Supermicro-X...UAAOSwzb9ZnJCu

^That said, since I have the modular PSU option (thinner), based on pics I do have room for an enhanced EATX board like that. However, I would need to get coolers (unless I use my air duct and rear fans to cool it, which it seems like those are designed for), RAM, and a different RAID card. Put it on my watch list...


So far nothing else... still looking around.

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

She shat the bed again.

Lan is 100% dead. No lights. No detect. No option ROM screen (enabled in BIOS).

All I did was slide it 6 inches to support a 24 Port Gig switch I was installing in the back of the cart... I tried the old switch, still no luck.

Seems like it's gone flakey...

Back to USB3 LAN... and time to start looking for a cheap replacement/upgrade. This system doesn't have room for a decent Gig card (I'd have to get a skinnier GPU and axe the TV tuner, or axe USB 3.0 and my card reader, no thanks).

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Re-installed 7 and:



Fixed!

Something about swapping cards screwed up the last install. As for me thinking it was a hardware issue, I really dunno. Doh!

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Updates:

Today while cleaning it out (and looking into a quad gigabit card addition, which isn't possible without axing my GPU or USB 3.0 card), I did more troubleshooting on the dead LAN issue... and apparently it works!. Windows still wasn't seeing it though. Tried server 2012 R2, which did see it, but I didn't like it, so I'm going back to 7 (fresh install, now with RAID 10), with the hope that like with 2012 all will work since it's a fresh install.

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Scored a deal on the Aft Pro-77u I have been eyeing at for quite some time. Yeah, it's just a card reader, but I'll take any excuse for a picture show:

What I had to start with:



Look at that dinky 3.5" reader in a 5.25" adapter. Great reader, don't get me wrong, (I paid a pretty penny for it too), but it's time to take full use of the bay available.

Here's what came in the mail today:



Newegg's ebay page had it 33% off, so I was able to nab it for $40.

And before any of you post "you got ripped off, look at this cheapie from China!", do know that AFT makes high end card readers for professionals (and even higher end ones at $60 a pop for photo kiosks); this is no Chinese wonder guranteed to blow up and take my USB 3.0 card with it or some slow USB2.0 reader tied to a USB 3.0 cable. There's a reason all of my recent builds have AFT readers in them (minus Main rig V2.x, which started it all and also has an AFT case on top of it), and there are only a few exceptions I'll make (Mitsumi floppy + card reader, Sony internal readers, and OEM readers).

Anyway, here's some top and side shots showing the build quality:

Top:



This side is the USB Hub. The card reader is on the bottom; I did pull the board (should have taken a pic) and confirmed that the reader does use 3.0 as per the advertisments. Oddly, both chips are Realtek yet the hub shows up as Renesis in device manager

Also, note that the hub is one one cable (powered off of the SATA power port alone), while the card reader is on a separate USB 3.0 cable (powered from USB 3.0 bus).

Side:



Oddly, only their lower end (and older) stuff uses metal cases with enclosed backs. Their higher end stuff is plastic with threaded inserts like this, with the 3.5" ones being enclosed but the 5.25" models having an exposed board like this.

Anyway, while I had the side off, I figured I'd shoot a few pics:





Yes I know a GPU fan is hitting some SATA and SAS wiring. I fixed after the picture was shot.

While I was moving around MOLEX plugs (for the SATA adapter used to power the new hub, I found a disconnected SAS sideband connector. Even with the fans removed (not as shown), working on the backplane is a bit like building a ship in a bottle:



What was I posting about??? Oh right, card readers. Here it is after assembly (and 30 minutes of debugging only to find a loose power connection ):



Oddly, one of my sandisk USB 3.0 drives (a 32GB one for work) doesn't play nice with the hub. I have a red clone (also 32GB) that works fine. Also the fussy drive DOES work on USB 2.0 ports

All in all, I think its a nice upgrade. Sure, I lost an XD slot, but I do have a USB 2.0 reader for that that for now on I'll use if I ever use one of my fugifilm's again (I misplaced my nice one, it had a 2GB card in it too ). The upside is now I can mess with two USB 3.0 sticks at once w/o crawling under my desk (I keep two as USB music drives; one for the truck, one for work trips that has stuff I don't think my boss likes removed).

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

On what? The LAN?

Yes. That sux!! Just pressing the card down into the PCI-E slot or pulling the other one out of the PCI-E slot and it went dead?

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Sounds like a bad solder joint...

On what? The LAN?

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

^ I see the soldering issue... Hopefully the (presumably) overkill cooling makes up for that.

No comment on the other part of your post, we both know my thoughts on that.



That was my suspicion, until I tried it with no GPU installed and all the NIC lights (front panel and at the RJ45 connectors) were still dead. Normally they light up when it's in standby and a cable connected to either port. Nothing, absolutely dead. Even if it was a resource conflict, one would think that you'd at least get the connection speed lights in the rear, and especially with all cards (minus the RAID card) pulled. Even powered it on with the cards pulled (and cable connected), nothing.

Sounds like a bad solder joint...

[Topcat]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

...just because it's "server hardware".

Not quite...It's more workstation oriented, there's a big difference. Mine is no louder than any store bought 'big brand' system....but I digress, I won't hijack the thread.

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

^ I see the soldering issue... Hopefully the (presumably) overkill cooling makes up for that.

No comment on the other part of your post, we both know my thoughts on that.

I highly doubt the NIC fried....I'd think more along the lines of some kind of hardware/addressing conflict.

That was my suspicion, until I tried it with no GPU installed and all the NIC lights (front panel and at the RJ45 connectors) were still dead. Normally they light up when it's in standby and a cable connected to either port. Nothing, absolutely dead. Even if it was a resource conflict, one would think that you'd at least get the connection speed lights in the rear, and especially with all cards (minus the RAID card) pulled. Even powered it on with the cards pulled (and cable connected), nothing.

[mariushm]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Looks like the reflow profile wasn't quite the best when the card went through the machine.

Barely any solder on, and some components are even shifted from the normal positions (see cap just above the label in second picture)

I agree with the above, more likely it's some resource conflict, some pci-e slot may be disabled when other slots are populated or something like that

Other than that.. my thoughts would be the same .. lots of heat and wasted power and noise for little performance just because it's "server hardware".

[Topcat]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

I highly doubt the NIC fried....I'd think more along the lines of some kind of hardware/addressing conflict.

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Card came in:





There is a caveat (and a "trap for young players"): the card actually consumes 3 slots (or 2.5 at least). To make it fit, I had to rearrange my cards a bit:





Don't worry, there is plenty of fan clearance:



The system seems to like the card. However, this comes at an unexpected (and unrelated?) loss; it seems that my GLAN controller fried during the install as ever since, even with all the cards removed and CMOS cleared, my LAN is dead. No lights, no detection in windows. As a temporary (or permanent?) fix, I've obtained a USB 3.0 GLAN adapter to mitigate the issue. Not a perfect fix, but last I checked these boards cost a pretty penny ($269 shipped from china right now) and if I'm going to drop that kind of cash (not in the cards, truck blew a fuel pump ) I might consider going newer later.

Thoughts or comments? When I have time I'll try to get some sort of a benchmark run.

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Upon further inspection, it's the lowest of the 4 models, as the "HA" does actually mean something:

https://www.zotac.com/cn/product/gra...B3%E7%89%88-ha

Apparently the nicer ones had a steeper OC and/or a cosmetic backplate. Oh well. Still should be a nice card.

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

well... u'll have to see when it gets here. its like stj said, its like a bazaar market on tatooine. some of the best stuff in the universe found nowhere else but also some of the worst scum of the universe... keke~

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

Upgrade coming:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ZOTAC-GTX970...YAAOSw4CFYzgut

This one is a bit of a gamble... and I nearly passed on it, as I was under the impression that it was a fake as only sites like Aliexpress sold it (not listed on Zotac's US site).

However, I did some more research, and found out that Zotac makes an entirely different line of cards for the Chinese market. Sure enough, they have 4 different versions under that part number (different OC amounts and number of streaming cores):

https://www.zotac.com/cn/product/gra...rd/gtx-970/all

It's a nifty looking card, and looks like it would have pretty good cooling too. Besides, it's "special".

Performance from what I was seeing should be on par with a 1060.

Sweet score or fool's gold?

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

GTX970 eats up to 180 watts, RX 470 uses up to 145 watts. RX 460 is down to 110 watts.
In time, you'd save money on electricity and the RX 470 may also be less noisy.

With some tweaking (for example lowering the default voltage by 0.05v..0.1v because it's set high by almost all manufacturers) will get about 5-15 watts off the maximum power consumption and potentially give you even higher frequencies (it overclocks better with slightly lower voltage)

Also, the newer cards have more states, so the cards will go to lower power consumptions more often.. for example the RX 470 i have has 7 power states.

Oh .. and they also added Chill mode .. if you enable it, on games they tested and whitelisted, in some areas where there's no motion or you're looking at something static, the card detects that and reduces the framerate to 40-60fps (from 120-150fps) to reduce power consumption : http://www.anandtech.com/show/10894/...rofessionals/7

My particular card is the single fan XFX RX 470 because it was cheapest... so because it has only one fan they kinda use a more basic bios... for example there's only one power state for the memory and it runs all the time at 1750 mhz, on other cards it downclocks to save power based on what you do with the card (for example when watching movies i think it goes down to about 400 Mhz). It's not a big deal, the memory chips use about 14 watts.

I know the memory chips are the same hynix 2000 Mhz ones and I could manually overclock them to 2000 Mhz but just I don't see any point to it.

All games i try to play at 1920x1200 (main 24" lcd monitor) on high-ultra settings run at over 60fps so I'm happy.
I finally was able to enjoy The Vanishing of Ethan Carter Redux (really nice graphics) and next I'm going to play Witcher 3 probably (on the 7770 got maybe 10-15fps on average due to only 1 gb gddr5)

<-- click to zoom it , that's how my card looks ( wattman keeps the card running enough to keep the fan spinning), if I close the app the fan stops (it stops when temperature goes below 55c automatically)

IDK how long it would take to make it back on power savings alone. I pay $0.118 /kWH based on calculations from my current electricity bill...

As for noise, not a huge concern on this rig.

[mariushm]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

GTX970 eats up to 180 watts, RX 470 uses up to 145 watts. RX 460 is down to 110 watts.
In time, you'd save money on electricity and the RX 470 may also be less noisy.

With some tweaking (for example lowering the default voltage by 0.05v..0.1v because it's set high by almost all manufacturers) will get about 5-15 watts off the maximum power consumption and potentially give you even higher frequencies (it overclocks better with slightly lower voltage)

Also, the newer cards have more states, so the cards will go to lower power consumptions more often.. for example the RX 470 i have has 7 power states.

Oh .. and they also added Chill mode .. if you enable it, on games they tested and whitelisted, in some areas where there's no motion or you're looking at something static, the card detects that and reduces the framerate to 40-60fps (from 120-150fps) to reduce power consumption : http://www.anandtech.com/show/10894/...rofessionals/7

My particular card is the single fan XFX RX 470 because it was cheapest... so because it has only one fan they kinda use a more basic bios... for example there's only one power state for the memory and it runs all the time at 1750 mhz, on other cards it downclocks to save power based on what you do with the card (for example when watching movies i think it goes down to about 400 Mhz). It's not a big deal, the memory chips use about 14 watts.

I know the memory chips are the same hynix 2000 Mhz ones and I could manually overclock them to 2000 Mhz but just I don't see any point to it.

All games i try to play at 1920x1200 (main 24" lcd monitor) on high-ultra settings run at over 60fps so I'm happy.
I finally was able to enjoy The Vanishing of Ethan Carter Redux (really nice graphics) and next I'm going to play Witcher 3 probably (on the 7770 got maybe 10-15fps on average due to only 1 gb gddr5)

<-- click to zoom it , that's how my card looks ( wattman keeps the card running enough to keep the fan spinning), if I close the app the fan stops (it stops when temperature goes below 55c automatically)

[ratdude747]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

RX 460 is also quite a decent card for the price.

Worth it, if only for the hardware 4K h264 and HEVC decoders and encoders (hevc hardware encoder only on windows 10 sadly due to... reasons) and HDMI 2.0 support to connect to 4K 60 Hz monitors directly.

If 10 wasn't so "play our way or else", I would have taken the upgrade on this rig. It supports 10 (in fact only two of my five workstations don't, and that's only because of the NX bit). I was able to make 10 behave up and until every update would undo all of the pre-installed app removals I went through hell to undo. Not that they would have mattered on this rig (I have the space, and I'll have more next week with the array expansion)... but for me (and I imagine a lot of you) the issue was the attitude more than anything.

My monitors (twin HP L2245wg's, $10 score over a year ago) are DVI, although I have a pair of displayport adapters sitting for when I do swap cards. I currently don't have desk space for any more (or larger) LCDs, so HDMI 2.0 doesn't matter for this rig currently. Yeah 4K is nice, but I'm not in the market for that yet (and won't be any time soon).

That said I can get the RX 460 used for cheap, but the benchmarks show why (slower than the GTX 760/960, which I'm using for reference), so bang for buck is comparable. It's a thought.

The RX 470 is running where the GTX 970 was on ebay... but with somewhat lesser benchmarks. I'd rather have a 970 for that price.

[mariushm]

Re: Ratdude's main rig V5.0

I just sold my old Radeon 7770 Ghz edition (rebranded by AMD as R7 250x) for around 55$

Bought an XFX RX 470 for about 210$ in local currency (we have 20% vat and generally higher prices).. these days I think you can buy them for something like 150$.

RX 460 is also quite a decent card for the price.

Worth it, if only for the hardware 4K h264 and HEVC decoders and encoders (hevc hardware encoder only on windows 10 sadly due to... reasons) and HDMI 2.0 support to connect to 4K 60 Hz monitors directly.