Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

[ben7]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

And now some other for which I would kindly ask for help in determining if they seem to be genuine or fake.
This is fist time I see Panasonic in black-and-white markings instead of those usual gold/yellowish ones.
The other ones are supposedly Rubycon 1000uF 6.3V MBZ.
I'll test their actual capacity as soon as I get my hands on cap. meter.
Thank you in advance

They all look real to me. The panasonics have that sort of bung, and the rubycons have that bung too. The vents are stamped with the right shape too. Old rubycon MBZs were blue with gold lettering, but newer ones are just black with white lettering. Not sure why they changed it, but I know nippon chemi-con changed the sleeve color of their KZE caps from green to brown.

[k1b0]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

And now some other for which I would kindly ask for help in determining if they seem to be genuine or fake.
This is fist time I see Panasonic in black-and-white markings instead of those usual gold/yellowish ones.
The other ones are supposedly Rubycon 1000uF 6.3V MBZ.
I'll test their actual capacity as soon as I get my hands on cap. meter.
Thank you in advance

[k1b0]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Here are the vents of those supposedly Panasonic 1800uF ones from this post https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...4&postcount=19 (again, on the left are those questionable and at the right the ones from dead mb's):

Is it possible that those are some ugly looking but after all real Panasonic caps, though I doubt it?

[momaka]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Look at the bungs there ^ ! Pretty good fakes. Do their vents look like they do on real Panasonic caps as well?
I wonder if they are just re-sleeved real Panasonic caps.

[k1b0]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Well, I made couple of orders on ebay from unknown sellers, since there was some problem with ordering from egekecu.
Soon I'll have capacitance meter so I will update posts with info on real capacity measurement.
And here they are(some of them; I will post others latter):

1800uF 6.3V supposedly Panasonic on the left and on the right I've put some genuine used ones from dead motherboards
User janeh2100 - 20pcs $3.80

[kc8adu]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

maybe the ebay fakers ran into a huge qty of 470uf 35v ncc and resleeved them for whatever they had demand for?would explain the bung looking ok.
the font is a bit off on those supposed 1000uf.check leakage at 35v and see if in spec for a 470@35

Maybe it's just that I haven't worked with lytics for a few years, but there's something about the lettering of the date/lot code and the tolerance and temperature rating that doesn't look quite right.

[momaka]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Perhaps try reforming them... i.e. slowly bring up the voltage on them through a resistor up until full rated voltage is reached, and leave there for 24 hour or longer. Then see if that has improved the capacitance.
These look way too good to be fakes IMO (if they are, I give my applause to the Chinese who made these).

[Jooo]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Just dissected one. It was all nice and wet.
I was thinking too that they may be old and stored wrongly, but even then I dont think they all would have failed like this.
I have ten of these caps and every single one of them measure something between 494 - 501uF and ESR 0.02 - 0.04 ohms.

[ben7]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

It might just happen to be that you got ones that were sitting for a while, maybe in a hot and/or humid environment, and they just went bad for no reason. If they are new, (I don't know how to read NCC date codes) then maybe you could take one apart to see inside. If the insides look OK, then, well.., you could try seeing if NCC will take a look at them for you!

[Jooo]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Have you checked the esr meter batteries? Did you calibrate it recently?

Just to rule out that my esr meter was bad, I checked the capacitors with a capacitance meter I also have. The results are same.

I also took a better shot of the datecode. The upper cap is the KY, lower cap is very old but genuine 470uF 25V LXF-series capacitor.

(I trimmed the lead on the KY myself so it would fit the capacitance meter, that wasn't like that when I received it.)

[ben7]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Maybe it's just that I haven't worked with lytics for a few years, but there's something about the lettering of the date/lot code and the tolerance and temperature rating that doesn't look quite right.

Yeah, I noticed that too, especially the temperature markings, the font just looks wrong. It seems too tall and not wide enough like the real NCC caps.

[Rambo]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Look fairly fake to me.

[mockingbird]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Even _legit_ caps soemtimes have poor or inconsistent lettering, so unless the lettering is an obvious giveaway, like if the font is wrong or if it's really fuzzy then it's not a sure way in itself to identify fakes. The lettering on these is pretty darn good. I wouldn't be surprised if the sleeving and bungs were sourced from UCC themselves. Remember, Japan is undergoing an economic recession and a massive nuclear problem in Fukushima. I wouldn't put it past certain elements of their corporations to start selling a little on the side to make a few extra bucks.

[PeteS in CA]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Maybe it's just that I haven't worked with lytics for a few years, but there's something about the lettering of the date/lot code and the tolerance and temperature rating that doesn't look quite right.

[goodpsusearch]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Have you checked the esr meter batteries? Did you calibrate it recently?

[mockingbird]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Excellent fakes, if I say so myself.

[Topcat]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

sound like more ebay wonders.

[c_hegge]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Where did you get those caps from?

[lexwalker]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

These are 10mm width capacitors, and according to KY datasheet, the bung is correct: 10mm and smaller capacitors have this type bung.
Only 12.5mm and wider capacitors have the T-style bung.

Many fake Nippon Chemicons especially from China market, do not match the datasheet specifications especially when it comes to case size/dimensions. Many were shorter than what's printed in the datasheet...

[Jooo]

Re: Fake / counterfeit capacitors are getting better

Bung is not correct.

United Chemicon bung as far as i know has channels in the form of a T:

These are 10mm width capacitors, and according to KY datasheet, the bung is correct: 10mm and smaller capacitors have this type bung.
Only 12.5mm and wider capacitors have the T-style bung.