Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

[bokecan]

Hello,

Been reading and researching on ways to improve the questionable caps used in the Silverstone SX600-G power supply. The issues with these power supplies tend to stem from a lack of airflow and cooling on the secondary side, along with the use of Teapo caps for the secondary. From my understanding (and please correct me if I'm wrong) the Teapo caps are at best, average quality, and when subjected to higher heat (like in this instance) they don't have the best reliability record.

Because of packaging constraints I need to use the SFX form factor. From a power requirement standpoint I also need a unit of around 550-600 watts. This Silverstone is the only SFX based power supply that is gold rated that meets those two requirements. The small size of the unit make cooling more a challenge, and the tight constraints have forced the secondary caps into a spot where there is not any airflow.

I believe this unit would perform well and be durable with a couple of modifications. The first being modifying the housing to get additional airflow over the secondary caps. This part I can do without too much trouble.

The second modification I think that is needed is swapping out the cheap Teapo caps for much better caps. This is where I need to gather more information from those more experienced and knowledgeable. I'm fairly proficient at soldering and desoldering, and I have a solder rework station. So that part I don't think I'll have any issues with. Where I could use some guidance would be the capacitors themselves, as well any kind of pertinent information relative to work like this. I would gladly take additional suggestions as well.

If I get some pictures of the two Teapo caps, along with their part numbers and so forth, and post them here, would it be possible for someone to advise me on replacement options? From my reading the following brands seem to be the best options

1) Rubycon
2) Sanyo/Nippon
3) Nichicon
4) Mallory
5) Panasonic

From my research I've also found that some brands and types of caps are better at handling heat than others, is this true?

My goal is to source premium caps to replace the ones that came with the PSU. I don't mind paying for the top tier, best available caps (I'll choose a $10 cap over a $3 cap if it's that much better). In regards to the work itself I've worked with capacitors a little before, and am somewhat familiar with discharging them, checking them with my meter, and in general, being safe around this stuff as I know it's deadly. But I'm again very open to any suggestions from those in the know about how they would go about this procedurally.

I'm here to learn, so any information people are willing to share would be very appreciated.

Thanks

[robert]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Look for capacitors with long load life, as this is what matters. So KY*/KZM/KZN series for example with 10k hours@105° for some of the best.
Polymer capacitors have lower rated load life, but use a higher temperature exponent due to a different degradation mechanism, so at realistic temperatures, a 3kh polymer will exceed a 10kh electrolytic. However, replacing electrolytic with polymer usually requires redesign of the control loop for stability under all conditions.

Quality wise similar specd parts of the major Mfrs (Rubycon/NCC/Suncon/nichicon) are pretty much equal, we cant see any difference in failure rate (we=major industrial PSU company), except nichicon being a little above average in therms of failures. We dont use Panasonic, so i cant comment on those, and data on suncon is based on only relatively few parts)
Mallory: Not really. Used to be rebranded Jamicon, no idea what its now.

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Look for capacitors with long load life, as this is what matters. So KY*/KZM/KZN series for example with 10k hours@105° for some of the best.
Polymer capacitors have lower rated load life, but use a higher temperature exponent due to a different degradation mechanism, so at realistic temperatures, a 3kh polymer will exceed a 10kh electrolytic. However, replacing electrolytic with polymer usually requires redesign of the control loop for stability under all conditions.

Quality wise similar specd parts of the major Mfrs (Rubycon/NCC/Suncon/nichicon) are pretty much equal, we cant see any difference in failure rate (we=major industrial PSU company), except nichicon being a little above average in therms of failures. We dont use Panasonic, so i cant comment on those, and data on suncon is based on only relatively few parts)
Mallory: Not really. Used to be rebranded Jamicon, no idea what its now.

Thanks for the excellent information, Robert!

I'm going to get some pictures and part numbers of the off the Teapo in the unit and post them. I'll lookup in the mean time some of those series that you mentioned and see what I can find. I'll focus the search on the Rubycon/NCC/Suncon/nichicon that you mentioned.

Thanks

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

The first being modifying the housing to get additional airflow over the secondary caps. This part I can do without too much trouble.

besides that, u can also try ghetto mounting an additional 40mm or 50mm fan at the secondary caps to give them some airflow. another alternative is getting a very high static pressure 80mm fan and replacing the stock psu fan with like a delta afb shb or a gentle typhoon/nidec servo 80mm fan. the high static pressure should force air into every nook and cranny of the psu case and ventilate the whole psu. the downside is more noise. if noise is not a factor then upgrade the psu fan as well. otherwise, u will be fighting with one hand tied since cooling and noise are mutually exclusive. u cant improve cooling much without more noise.

for panasonic caps, they only have one ultra-long life series. that is the FR series, rated for between 5k-10k hrs.

you will also need a recommendation for a replacement primary cap series. i think silverstone always uses a teapo 85°C cap for the primary. an 85°C cap is NOT going to last in an sfx psu at those temps! there is a reason why there is a demand for 105°C primary caps even tho primary caps dont get stressed much electrically! they do thermally in an sfx psu. a popped primary cap is also hazardous not least to the pc but also a nightmare to repair as it can take out other nearby components as well. so i suggest u not neglect the primary cap as well. the idea of this exercise is to prempt any possible failures is it not?

also, where is the primary cap located in the psu and what case will u be using? beware, there are some sfx pc casings with shitty psu placement whereby the psu intake fan is almost nearly completely blocked off by the mainboard, cpu fan, hard drive or other things. so even if the primary cap is in an area that is well cooled by the psu fan, it can get blocked off inside the case and the primary cap ends up being cooked...

looking at other psu designs around the web, fsp, superflower and seasonic sometimes use NCC/UCC KM* series as their primary 105°C cap. u can try that as well.

anyway, keep up the good work. its nice to see ppl improving rare items like this sfx 80+ gold 600w psu. i like silverstone's sfx psus as they use fsp designs and fsp make nice psus! cant say much about the choice of teapo junk caps tho. i consider teapo junk caps for sfx usage as they are completely unsuitable for the high temp environments in sfx pcs. nothing but planned obsolescence stunts. the manufacturer wants to make up excuses that the high temps cant be avoided and thus causing early failure and want u to keep paying and paying for a new psu. bullshit i say. that 600w sfx psu costs quite a lot u'd think they could have thrown in good jap caps for good measure but nooo... we must cost cut even an overpriced 600w psu...

anyway, i still like sfx psus for ladies' mini pc builds where everything must be small, cute and pretty or else get a laptop! or a lapdesk in this case of a laptop that doesnt get moved but sits only on a desk the entire time...

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

There are only about three caps to be repalced there, the rest is already mciture of japanese caps or at least polymers.

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Thanks Behemot and ChaosLegionnaire!

It just so happens that I plan to add a 40mm fan to the secondary side to get more airflow over there and help the cooling. I totally agree that it's kind of ridiculous that Silverstone would cheap out on the caps in a unit like this. If I was in the market for a cheapo solution than I wouldn't be buying a $130 PSU. I would gladly have paid a premium for quality caps from the OEM.

The case that the PSU will be going in will be a small custom, with the PSU having it's own fresh air inlet, and own exhaust, with additional fans on the exhaust side to help with flow.

You are right that this is an exercise to preempt future failures and try and make the unit as durable as reasonably possible by upgrading components. If you think I should replace the primary cap as well than I will definitely also do that.

I've attached some pictures that I took of the board. I've marked off what I believe to be the primary, and secondary caps. Here is what I have

1. Primary Cap (White Circle)
2. Secondary Cap (White Circle)
3. Secondary Cap (White Circle)

Beyond that there are a bunch of caps I'm unsure that I've marked in various colors to see if they could be identified, and if they should be replaced. Wish I knew this stuff better, but I'm still learning.

Other Caps

Yellow- ?
Blue- ?
Red- ?
Green- ?
Purple- ?
Orange- ?

Additionally there is the plug connection, with a small circuit board, and a couple x and y caps in it. This is seen in the lower left corner, but not opened up. Wasn't sure if I needed to do anything in there or not.

There are some other pictures attached as well to give a better look at the various caps. Once they've been identified and I know which ones need to be replaced, I'll get the part numbers and ratings of them and post that info to narrow down what replacement caps to get.

Thanks for everyone's help so far!

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

OK, this is different than about 3 reviews I have ckeched yesterday. The only good cap of those you circled is the big input one, that is Chemi-Con, you can leave that be. The rest seems to be Teapo, the green ones are SC series. Can you list their parameters (capacity, voltage, series)?

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Here is the information off the various caps on the board.

[2]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[3]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c


[Yellow Circle]
Taicon
1425A(m)
2200uf
16v
105c(pw)p

[Blue Circle]
A3TC
2200uf
16v
SC105c

[Red Circle]
470uf
25v
SH105c

[Green Circle]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[Purple Circle]
3M1508

[Orange Circle]
10uf
50v
SS105c


The purple and orange circled capacitors are placed so that I could only read the numbers listed, the purple circled one (a little black cap) is partially covered in elastomer glue so I can only get one number off of it.

With exception of the yellow circled capacitor being a Taicon, all the rest seem to be Teapo.

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Yeah, three Teapo SC 1500/6.3, those will be for +3.3/+5 V rails. The SH 470/25 is for -12 V. SC 2200/16 and Taicon for +12 V.

SC is very obsolete low-ESR series but cheap so still used very often. The small SS is general purpose. Purple circle you will have to remove, that is only time code (possibly 8th of march 2015). Are you sure with the red and blue positions? There will be some caps of these parameters but the blue one seems to be 8x20 mm, too small for 2200/16. Maybe the other way around

I can supply you with replacements much cheaper than those big-ass distributors like digikey, but I do not have all types on stock, for example the shorter but wider caps. Usually there is room enough for caps as tall as 30 mms (or even more) in ordinary ATX units, so I always focus on diameter. How is it in this SFX unit? Is there room enough to go higher?

[Stefan Payne]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Oh dear...
What the hell did they do?!

Teapo SH series is a general purpose one oO
And also the Teapo SC should be replaced..

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

I did not understand this either. The 450W SFX unit is very good and quality unit. Now they squeeze even more power (=heat) in there and use much worse caps? And it seems that gradually - first versions had more japanese caps than just the bulk one, than later this came up.

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Okay, that all makes sense. Sounds like I should be replacing basically all the caps circled, with exception of the big Chemi-Con one?

I'll have to double check when I get home later the red and blue circles, it's possible I goofed them up in getting the information written down before work. I'll double check on those and let you know.

In terms of replacements and height, I would say there is some room for taller caps in places, the fan resides above most of the components, and the plug and inout board sit above the other portion of the board. I can take measurements and see what kind of height I have to work with and let you know.

I guess you'll know best in terms of what brand/series caps to recommend for replacements. I plan to push the PSU fairly hard at times, and want it to hold up to longer gaming sessions. The hardware it will be powering is a Intel 6700k and a GTX 980 Ti, both overclocked. So stability is very important.

I will double check on the red and blue positions, and I'll remove the purple circle as well to get the numbers off of it. Is there anything special in terms of tips or tricks as far as removal goes? I usually just heat up joint, remove the mechanical pin from the hole, use a solder sucker and some solder wick and remove the remaining solder, then clean the hole to make sure it's clean and clear.

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Yep.

I have caps among the best currently available and even some custom. Chemi-Con KZH, KZN, KYA, KYB series.

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Yep.

I have caps aming the best currently available and even some custom. Chemi-Con KZH, KZN, KYA, KYB series.

Excellent!

[stj]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

I did not understand this either. The 450W SFX unit is very good and quality unit. Now they squeeze even more power (=heat) in there and use much worse caps? And it seems that gradually - first versions had more japanese caps than just the bulk one, than later this came up.

makes perfect sense,
make it good until it's been torn down in some reviews and gets high marks.
then switch to shit to reduce production costs.

i have a SeaSonic SS-301HT here filled with OST and JPce-tur crap.

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

yes u can leave the primary cap be. its an ncc kmr 105°C cap. seasonic and fsp sometimes use it in their jap cap units. at least, silverstone had the redeeming quality of not using an 85°C cap in there as large can high voltage caps are expensive and cost several dollars each. so u saved some cash in not having to replace the expensive primary cap. i also notice a suncon japcap on one of the daughterboards in the psu. is that the modular panel of the psu?

all those caps with the mercedes benz vent with three additional notches in the center of the vent are teapo. teapo uses that vent as their "signature". i found that makes it easier to recognise teapo crap in psus so i wont buy them! hahaha

also, this bait and switch sheet used by manufacturers is really pissing me off. this means that u cannot trust retail off the shelf items these days. well at least stuff coming from seasonic and silverstone. a real pity silverstone has no real competition in the sfx market. some competition from a japcap sfx psu will surely wake them up.

wish something can be done about this bait and switch fraud. class action lawsuit?

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

I think that Chieftec has some of such units with good caps.

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Just got home and went through and double checked the caps. You were right on the blue circle, I added an extra zero, it's 200uf, not 2200uf.

Also was able to remove the white silicone from the purple circle cap and found it's a Rubycon YXF, 50v 47uf. So I assume that one can stay? I'll just need to re-silicone it.

Here is an updated list of the caps

[2]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[3]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c


[Yellow Circle]
Taicon
1425A(m)
2200uf
16v
105c(pw)p

[Blue Circle]
A3TC
220uf
16v
SC105c

[Red Circle]
470uf
25v
SH105c

[Green Circle]
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[Purple Circle]
Rubycon
YXF
50v
47uf
3M1508

[Orange Circle]
10uf
50v
SS105c


Which caps would you like me to measure the height on? I can see what kind of extra room I have vertically.

Thanks

[Behemot]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

Yeah Rubycon's OK. Whaddaya exactly want to do with that?

Just have a look if there is room enough in the PSU itself, if it does not collide with something (fan for example).

[bokecan]

Re: Upgrading Silverstone SX600-G PSU Caps

So I'll leave the Rubycon cap in place and just re-silicone it.

As for the rest of the caps (besides the Chemi-con) I'll replace them all.

I've added the heights to the caps list of ones that are getting swapped

Here is an updated list of the caps

[2]
Height= 16.5mm (Can be a little taller if need be)
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[3]
Height= 16.5mm (Can be a little taller if need be)
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c


[Yellow Circle]
Height= 26.6mm (Can't be taller)
Taicon
1425A(m)
2200uf
16v
105c(pw)p

[Blue Circle]
Height= 10mm (Really close to coil, could maybe be taller)
A3TC
220uf
16v
SC105c

[Red Circle]
Height= 14.6mm (Real close to coil, could maybe be taller)
470uf
25v
SH105c

[Green Circle]
Height= 16.5mm (Can be a little taller if need be)
A3TC
1500uf
6.3v
SC105c

[Orange Circle]
Height= 10mm (Can be taller)
10uf
50v
SS105c

Thanks