Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Dannyx
    CertifiedAxhole
    • Aug 2016
    • 3912
    • Romania

    #1

    Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

    Good day folks. A former colleague of mine recommended me to a relative of his and I got to speak to this man today in person. He's a bit of a mad scientist/tinkerer sort-of guy - just my kind of weirdo Apparently this chap builds all sorts of generators and wind turbines in his little shop at home and sells them here and there. He even showed me some footage of some of his inventions in action out in the field. However, as he himself very kindly put it, he's not good with electronics - he just designs and builds the generators (from scratch, I might add) and turns to others for the electronic side. He doesn't have a regular guy for this task, which can be a red flag that people don't like working with him, despite him being very kind. There's only one way to find out and that is to give this guy a shot and humor him....for a while at least.

    Have a look at these two schematics he asked me to build for a small-scale turbine. Right away, although I have close to zilch experience with gennies of any kind, these look like nothing I would stick on the output of a generator. Apparently, someone else drew them for him, who in turn got them from....somewhere. Maybe I'm a noob and they're actually some really standard setups that just don't click with me, or maybe they're just complete baloney that would never work for this, or just go pop within seconds....

    There are WAY too many questions that need answering here, starting with the generator itself: he claims he can build any generator, in any shape and size, with any number of coils...which he showed me on his phone - told you the guy's nuts In the larger schematic, the outputs from the coils (2 coils in this case) are those 4 dots in the upper-left (that's the Romanian word for "coils" BTW ). Trouble is I'm not sure how the pairs are supposed to be arranged: is one coil the upper two dots and the other coil the bottom two, or are they the left/right ones instead ??? What sort of output are we expecting from them ??? Number of turns ??? Wire gauge ??? Poles, magnets ??? Not a single capacitor in this schematic. Neon lamp across the E-C junction of the 3055, why ??? It's been a while since I had to reverse-engineer something, so although this seems simple on paper, there are many things I don't get - not to be rude, but it's almost like someone threw random components together. The bar is set too high for this thing I can't see how it's expected to rectify the AC those coils SUPPOSEDLY spit out, regulate it and then stuff it into the batteries. The only thing that I CAN kinda see is D2 blocking B1 from attempting to turn the generator. The whole thing looks like it's trying to be some sort of regulator....which it isn't because there's no reference voltage set anywhere (zener anyone ???) and no series-pass element...unless one coil acts to limit the speed of the rotor and that's your regulation.... That 5K.....pot (?) is another thing that seems unfinished. No, it's not an error - the chap says that's how the other guy drew the schematic. Might as well be a fixed 5k there then.

    How I would do it, even with 0 knowledge, is stick a rectifier on the output (3 phase if necessary) smooth it out and feed it into a DC-DC converter - MUCH more efficient and LIKELY to work, at least at small scale....

    Is there even any point in building this ???
    Attached Files
    Wattevah...
  • redwire
    Badcaps Legend
    • Dec 2010
    • 3900
    • Canada

    #2
    Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

    The circuit is a "2N3055 joule thief" which is very common in the "free energy" crowd. Basically, just a primitive one transistor boost-converter.
    To sell a fake generator, it's common to show more volts out than in = aliens, unicorns, magic - helping generate more.
    When you actually measure power in and power out, usually one battery is being drained while the other appears to be charging. It seems to fool the mind.

    The neon acts like a gas-discharge tube and protects the transistor from over voltage if a battery is disconnected when it's running. These are really low tech, low efficiency and not worth building.
    Instead, why isn't the generator outputting more voltage? Add turns of wire or speed and get the voltage you want in the first place lol.

    Comment

    • Dannyx
      CertifiedAxhole
      • Aug 2016
      • 3912
      • Romania

      #3
      Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

      Ok, at least now I know what it is I guess it is not commonplace in the field of high-power wind turbines, since I see most projects involving friggin' AA batteries I'm not sure how it would get hooked up to the guy's generator though...

      Let's instead focus on how to ACTUALLY design a wind turbine and what the electronics that come after the genie should look like - I'm talking mostly OTS stuff. I'm fully aware that we're not about to compete with the factory-built stuff that already exists on the market, but at least for home use, mostly for fun and for learning stuff....
      Wattevah...

      Comment

      • eccerr0r
        Solder Sloth
        • Nov 2012
        • 8658
        • USA

        #4
        Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

        It's not hard to generate electricity from something moving, even better when it's just rotating - because things go back to their original state.

        Just going back to Maxwell, all you need is to move a magnet over a wire and you get some electrical energy. The faster you can move a larger magnetic field over a large amount of wire, the more energy you'll draw from mechanical energy and make electrical energy.

        The question is whether you make the magnetic field from electricity (alternator like in cars) or from magnets (generators). Doesn't really matter which way, just need to design it such that you come out ahead, not really a big deal.

        All you really need is to just get a permanent magnet motor and spin it. You get your electrical energy, don't need anything else. Just that it may not be the voltage/current/power/time consistency you need.

        For me, getting that motion/rotation costs me more money than just buying electricity from the power grid. Solar energy is better in this respect.

        Comment

        • petehall347
          Badcaps Legend
          • Jan 2015
          • 4422
          • United Kingdom

          #5
          Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

          http://www.mdpub.com/555Controller/

          Comment

          • Dannyx
            CertifiedAxhole
            • Aug 2016
            • 3912
            • Romania

            #6
            Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

            I agree with solar power being the best and also with the price-to-payoff ratio of DIY-ing wind turbines like this. The redeeming factor in this case is that the guy often sources stuff for free or from scrap yards, so it's not THAT expensive. Converting the dirty sh!tty output from the dirty and sh!tty generators he builds into actual usable energy for home use is my job in this deal

            Right now, I'm thinking of whether it'd be possible to just stick the awfully unstable output of the generator directly on the mains input of a SMPS to charge some batts with it, or will it get destroyed, or at least severely limit its lifespan doing it this way. The other idea is to use a FULL BRIDGE RECTIFIER to get my unregulated DC and stick THAT on the input instead. I'd still be all over the show, but not as much, due to the smoothing caps. Capacitor inrush current would be an issue and unless the wind is particularly strong, it might stall the blades and keep them from turning..only one way to find out and that's to actually build something.

            I'd then maybe design like a little circuit to toggle between the battery and the generator for powering an inverter which then runs the house or whatever....
            Wattevah...

            Comment

            • petehall347
              Badcaps Legend
              • Jan 2015
              • 4422
              • United Kingdom

              #7
              Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

              i have an unregulated wind generator here .. i still need a regulator . will eventually do something simple like a relay and a couple of transistors etc .. it will light an outside light when the voltage goes over a certain point at the battery like 14.4v or something like that . will have to try a 24v light for this or something with its own regulator .. the generator can go up to at least 18v open circuit ..it blows 12v car headlight bulbs
              i might even use the low battery voltage warning light circuit i built to switch the relay .

              Comment

              • Dannyx
                CertifiedAxhole
                • Aug 2016
                • 3912
                • Romania

                #8
                Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                Originally posted by petehall347
                This you ?
                Wattevah...

                Comment

                • petehall347
                  Badcaps Legend
                  • Jan 2015
                  • 4422
                  • United Kingdom

                  #9
                  Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                  Originally posted by Dannyx
                  This you ?
                  not me ...

                  Comment

                  • Dannyx
                    CertifiedAxhole
                    • Aug 2016
                    • 3912
                    • Romania

                    #10
                    Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                    Another thing I'm concerned about if I use a SMPS on the output of the generator, be it AC or DC, is the generator exceeding the input the SMPS is rated for....you know, due to TOO strong a wind. I'd need a way to slow it down and the crude and primitive way I'm thinking of is to simply load it some more using a dummy resistor that I'd engage as needed, automatically of course...a more complicated setup would probably involve an additional winding to mess with the fields somehow...I need to brush up on my motor theory
                    Wattevah...

                    Comment

                    • petehall347
                      Badcaps Legend
                      • Jan 2015
                      • 4422
                      • United Kingdom

                      #11
                      Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                      they just about stop if you short the output . like i said my dummy load is to be outside lighting . nice to have outside lights in high winds .
                      on another note i knew someone that designed and built wind generators very clever he was . he had one doing 240v 50 hz ..

                      Comment

                      • Dannyx
                        CertifiedAxhole
                        • Aug 2016
                        • 3912
                        • Romania

                        #12
                        Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                        Wonder if I could use a pre-made controller/charger/UPS thingy normally designed for solar panels. I'd stick the rectified wind turbine on the input for the solar panel and it apparently does the rest for me...no need to reinvent the wheel here...
                        Wattevah...

                        Comment

                        • petehall347
                          Badcaps Legend
                          • Jan 2015
                          • 4422
                          • United Kingdom

                          #13
                          Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                          should work .. mppt controller is best

                          Comment

                          • Dannyx
                            CertifiedAxhole
                            • Aug 2016
                            • 3912
                            • Romania

                            #14
                            Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                            Fairly expensive stuffs, but not nearly as expensive as what I was going to come up with Can't find any big-name brands though and they're all intended for solar panels, meaning I'm not sure if they can slow down the turbine with the dump load to keep it below the maximum input voltage....although the one I have my eyes on the moment claims it can do up to 500v on the input from the solar panels (which will be the generator in my case), which let's be honest, is unlikely this chap's gennie will reach I THINK the MPPT does just that, so I'm probably all set to go.
                            Wattevah...

                            Comment

                            • petehall347
                              Badcaps Legend
                              • Jan 2015
                              • 4422
                              • United Kingdom

                              #15
                              Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                              check out victron energy . everyone thats serious uses their stuff .others cheap out and buy mppt units that are actually pwm .and at best set on fire whilst you are home and can deal with it .

                              Comment

                              • Dannyx
                                CertifiedAxhole
                                • Aug 2016
                                • 3912
                                • Romania

                                #16
                                Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                                Yeah, I found some Victrons and the price difference between them and other random stuff is significant, possibly hinting to their quality in the industry. Even though the cheaper one I found also does MPPT....supposedly. The norm for the battery bank seems to be 48v for most of these systems.
                                Last edited by Dannyx; 09-17-2022, 02:42 PM.
                                Wattevah...

                                Comment

                                • petehall347
                                  Badcaps Legend
                                  • Jan 2015
                                  • 4422
                                  • United Kingdom

                                  #17
                                  Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                                  plenty of 12v stuff around i think

                                  Comment

                                  • Dannyx
                                    CertifiedAxhole
                                    • Aug 2016
                                    • 3912
                                    • Romania

                                    #18
                                    Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                                    Not a problem. I think it's better to have a higher input voltage anyway, since the closer you get to the output you're trying to achieve (230v in this case), the more efficient the system is, albeit more expensive with all those batteries...
                                    Wattevah...

                                    Comment

                                    • Dannyx
                                      CertifiedAxhole
                                      • Aug 2016
                                      • 3912
                                      • Romania

                                      #19
                                      Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                                      I ended up putting together the smaller circuit with the BD139 after all, just by soldering the components to one another because I couldn't get the guy out of my hair I'm actually kinda curious to see what happens once he hooks this up to whatever coils he put together at complete random, with no specs and no measurements like inductance and the likes. I'm no expert either when it comes to this advanced a topic, but I know for sure there's more to it than that. If I had to take an educated guess, I'd say the battery will immediately kill the transistor (assuming it's a 12v SLA he attempts to use), because once the C-E junction starts to conduct, that battery is capable of pushing WAY more than the 3A the BD139 is rated for, since it will just pass through coil 1-4 like a dead short, with only minimal resistance from the wire. The wire itself may melt and split at that point anyway...
                                      Wattevah...

                                      Comment

                                      • eccerr0r
                                        Solder Sloth
                                        • Nov 2012
                                        • 8658
                                        • USA

                                        #20
                                        Re: Wind generator charger schematics (or load of baloney ?)

                                        Need more details of how the electromechanical parts are made, what are the rotor windings, stator windingsl is he using magnets or electromagnets to generate the field, what commutator is being used, etc., etc. - without those details it's hard to tell what needs to be connected to what, and what kind of voltage output is to be expected?

                                        There is no standard, using a DC PM motor in reverse as a generator requires significantly different circuitry than using an alternator from a car to generate electricity...

                                        Comment

                                        Related Topics

                                        Collapse

                                        • motormayhem
                                          Lenovo T460 Only Charges on One Charger
                                          by motormayhem
                                          Laptop Question
                                          Hello,
                                          I'm working on a Lenovo T460 that has been having trouble charging as of late. Its worked well since I've owned it for a few years. When I went to use it the other day it was dead and wouldn't turn on (was sitting on an Anker 65W GaN charger). After some fiddling with the charger I got it to turn on and start charging, but seemed like the charger was not working as it should (took a few plug and unplug cycles to get it to start charging).

                                          A day later it was dead again and wouldn't boot/charge no matter what I did. No lights or anything when...
                                          05-12-2023, 01:46 PM
                                        • Johndill
                                          Dell Inspiron 7567 LA-D993P odd charger issue
                                          by Johndill
                                          Hi, I have a Dell Inspiron 7567 LA-D993P that I've just got running.
                                          There was corrosion around PU1503 which shorted PC1518 & blew PL1504. (Reference pictures attached)
                                          I've replaced PC1518 & PL1504 & the laptop is now running however I now have another issue.

                                          Here are the tested scenarios:

                                          1. With the laptop running on battery, I plug in the 150W charger & the charger shuts off (no LED, protection mode) but the laptop remains running on battery.

                                          2. With the laptop off, plug in charger (LED says on) & the front charging...
                                          11-16-2022, 10:55 PM
                                        • AJ847.63e
                                          Testing ATX PSUs under load - Does loading the ATX 24 pin also load EPS & PCIE?
                                          by AJ847.63e
                                          Hi Folks,

                                          Just wanted to clear up a misunderstanding of mine (or what I expect is one). Isn't the 12V rail from the 24 pin, EPS and PCIE separated? IE if I put a power resistor on the ATX 12V pin that is not going to load, thus tell me if the EPS or PCIE rails are fine?

                                          I was recently watching ArIs from Hardware Busters video on how to properly test ATX PSUs without using 5 figure Croma substations.

                                          The PCB adapter he used breaks out the 12, 5 and 3.3V pins from the 24 pin and gives you banana plugs to connect to. That is a bit useless is it not? Aren't...
                                          05-06-2025, 10:37 PM
                                        • Document Archive
                                          HP Elite Slice G2 + Image Load & Asset Tag Elite Slice i5-7500T Specification for Upgrade or Repair
                                          by Document Archive
                                          This specification for the HP Elite Slice G2 + Image Load & Asset Tag can be useful for upgrading or repairing a desktop PC that is not working. As a community we are working through our specifications to add valuable data like the Elite Slice G2 + Image Load & Asset Tag boardview and Elite Slice G2 + Image Load & Asset Tag schematic. Our users have donated over 1 million documents which are being added to the site. This page will be updated soon with additional information. Alternatively you can request additional help from our users directly on the relevant badcaps forum. Please...
                                          09-12-2024, 02:20 PM
                                        • Document Archive
                                          HP EliteBook 1050 G1 + Image Load & Asset Tag Notebook 1000 Specification for Upgrade or Repair
                                          by Document Archive
                                          This specification for the HP EliteBook 1050 G1 + Image Load & Asset Tag Notebook can be useful for upgrading or repairing a laptop that is not working. As a community we are working through our specifications to add valuable data like the 1050 G1 + Image Load & Asset Tag boardview and 1050 G1 + Image Load & Asset Tag schematic. Our users have donated over 1 million documents which are being added to the site. This page will be updated soon with additional information. Alternatively you can request additional help from our users directly on the relevant badcaps forum. Please note that...
                                          09-06-2024, 10:56 AM
                                        • Loading...
                                        • No more items.
                                        Working...