Replacing BGA components with hot air.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

Anyone here real smart with infrared type heaters? I'm thinking of replacing all the ceramic heating elements with the Elstein heating elements. They're a much higher end name.

The ones I have in there now are very cheap! I contacted Elstein, they suggested the SHTS series. The problem is I have four 600 watt units and two 150 watt units. For the SHTS series, they make the 600 watt units that I need but they don't make any 150 watt. The smallest they make for that series would be the 300 watt.

Can I just knock out my two 150 watt ceramic heaters and drop two 300 watt ones in there? Or would that cause problems? There's also the HTS series. The HTS/4 would be the one I'd need for the 150 watt and then the HTS/1 I'd get for the 600 watt ones. Besides colour, I can't see much of a difference between the two. What do you guys think?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

what is that photo, the rework unit?
i'm surprised it's using u.s. colourcodes on the cable!

Yes, that's the inside of the rework unit. Keep in mind, it normally doesn't come wired. So the blue and brown I think came with the unit. The black, white and green 12-gauge was installed by a certified US electrician. I'm pretty sure if the yellow came with the unit as well. From my understanding, the blue and brown (and possibly yellow) came with the unit, the white, black and green were installed by the certified electrician.

I've never seen blue and brown and yellow being used for AC before. Once again though, I don't play with AC a lot. As far as I can remember, all the AC lines I've ever seen where green, black and white. Usually, in place of the green wire, there was just bare copper. Wouldn't the blue / brown / yellow be non-USA colourcodes?

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

what is that photo, the rework unit?
i'm surprised it's using u.s. colourcodes on the cable!

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

Ahh! I know what you're talking about. Here, I'd call that x/2 (where x would be the gauge). If that was 10 gauge, I'd call it 10 / 2. If it had three wires plus the unshielded earth conductor and it was 10 gauge wire, I'd call it 10 / 3.

Because I'm planning on running it over the rafters and not drilling holes through each of the rafter's 2/4's (or whatever they are up there), I believe I need to use what's called MC (metal-clad). The metal-clad I don't think has the bare wire. It needs to all be shielded because, well, it's metal-cladded. Here's what 10/2 MC looks like:

http://images.lowes.com/product/conv...2886347894.jpg

The green would be equivalent to the bare wire. The black and white wires would be 120v hot, each. I could go for 10/3 MC but the way my unit is wired, I don't think it'd do any good.

Here's some wires. Because it's a bit hard to see what's what, I've uploaded a little table showing what's what. The wire that the previous owner's electrician wired up is 12-gauge but the wires that go from the unit's built in breaker seem to be 14 or maybe even 16-gauge. They're definitely skinner. I was thinking of replacing them with 12-gauge, although, with shorter distances, I think using a smaller gauge (higher number) might be okay...

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

standard in europe for building wiring,
you have 2 shielded conductors, with an unshielded earth conductor between them in a rectangular outer insulation that is LSF rated.
(low smoke fume)
looks like this
http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/maplin-25m...er-metre-l27bq

pay no mind to the stupid new colour-code - it used to be red & black

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

it's a safety thing a lot of the flat-contact NEMA connectors are known to have issues when they age.

those coloured ones are locking, use round pins, and are rain-proof - not that i expect you to burst a pipe!!
they are rated for use outdoors in truck loading bays and on construction sites

I'm almost thinking of going for those locking round pin ones you showed but if I go for a different connector, I can get everything locally today. I think I'm probably going to do that. Just go to Home Depot and purchase what's needed.

cable-wise a 2.5mm "twin & earth" flat conductor can do 30A
you should be using solid copper wire for that voltage & current in the wall.

You're speaking a different language here! Twin & earth?

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

it's a safety thing a lot of the flat-contact NEMA connectors are known to have issues when they age.

those coloured ones are locking, use round pins, and are rain-proof - not that i expect you to burst a pipe!!
they are rated for use outdoors in truck loading bays and on construction sites

cable-wise a 2.5mm "twin & earth" flat conductor can do 30A
you should be using solid copper wire for that voltage & current in the wall.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I was thinking something like this:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/30-Amp-25...CCV3/100117946

And just running 10/2 metal-clad wiring. There's so many different connectors though. Does it matter? Is it just personal preference and so long as the outlet meets my requirements, I can pick what I want, or is there some reason the dryers use a certain type of connecter, the stoves use a different type of connector, etc?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I'm not saying they don't have them here, I've just never seen a 240v connector like that in my life. Here's what one of the local hardware store sells:

http://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrica...Boutlet?NCNI-5

I'd like to keep it in the wall, like our normal outlets. You know, with one of those receptacle covers and all that jazz.

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

those connectors are overpriced junk, cant you get 32A industrial connectors cheap?
like these:
http://www.rapidonline.com/bals-indu...nnectors-63569
http://www.rapidonline.com/bals-surf...-sockets-63572

your looking for 32A 2pole + earth, blue. (colourcode for 240v)

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I figured out what I'm going to do. I'm going to replace the double pole 30-amp breaker with a double pole 20 amp. I'm going to replace the 14 or (hopefully not) 16 gauge wire inside the BGA machine with 12 gauge. I'm going to purchase that 20-amp 240v recital I linked to earlier (or something similar).

http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-5842-I...amp+receptacle

I'll try finding one locally and if I can't, I'll order one.

Now, all I need to know is if I need to run the metal-clad 12/2 or if I could run just normal 12/2. Perhaps I shouldn't even be running 12 because it's a bit of a distance. Maybe I should be running 10 gauge wire.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I got a free two-pole 30-amp breaker so I think I'll just use that. Just gotta pick the right wire now...

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

Also, I figure I'm going to remove the double 50 amp breaker and replace it with a double 20-amp. Would flipping the main switch to the breaker be safe enough to run the wire and all that jazz? Or should I call the electric company and have them kill the entire power coming to the house? I'm thinking just flipping the main breaker would be enough. Watching a video on how to do this, it doesn't seem that hard. It looks kind of easy like. I might even just go with the 30 amp double breaker and run wire strong enough for 30-amp. If I do that, should I go for 10-gauge or 12-gauge you think? I was under the impression if it's a short enough distance, 12-gauge would be fine. But because I'm going a good ways, I should probably run 10-gauge, right?

Nothing special to the wire either, right? Any 10-gauge would work, wouldn't it? Just instead of having the white as neutral, I have the white as hot and the black is still hot. Right? I wonder if I should look into that MC-12-2 or whatever it's called. I'm just going to be running it probably over the rafters, instead of drilling through all of them. I'd like to keep everything up to code.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

Would this be a good one?

http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-5842-I...0+volt+outlets

It's even made by the same company that made the plug itself...

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

20A should handle 5000w
the wires rating is for continuous use - so no problems.

This really got me worried a good bit. The 20A wire that plugs into the wall, the one where they had an electrician come in and install it, that's thick enough (from what you just told me Stj). But the wires they hook to inside, they're much skinner wires. I think the actual wires in my wall, the 120v ones, are thicker than the ones in this unit.

If you think that's safe, could you help me pick out a good outlet? Also, what size breaker should I hook it up to?

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

20A should handle 5000w
the wires rating is for continuous use - so no problems.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I'm going to go directly to the box. We have two 50 amp breakers that are free but I'm not going to use them. I'd like some suggestions on how to wire this up. My wife went to Corning Building Company and they said they have a dryer outlet that's 30 amp. Our current dryer is hooked up to two 30 amp breakers. Is that what we want?

Something's a bit odd here. I was looking at the connector on the BGA unit. It's a 6-20P (I think that's what they're called). This is the exact one:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...WY4MXJEDBMY2V5

It's only rated for 20A. The wire going to the connector says 12 gauge. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the maximum 240v 20amp wire / connector only capable of handling 4,800 watts?

240v * 20a = 4,800 watts...

This unit's supposed to use 4,800 watts. Isn't that kind of dumb? Should the wire be a higher gauge and the connector be rated for a higher amperage? Or is it safe to use a wire rated for exactly the same amperage / wattage I'm going to be using?

Also, if the unit is going to be using 20 amp, I guess I could just wire up two 15-amp breakers, right? I'd rather do this the proper way though. Maybe it's best if I replace that 12-gauge with something a little thicker and put a different connector on it. I'm going to be going directly from the box to the work room. I'm going to be tearing down sheet rock. Any suggestions?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

I tried doing my best here. I thought if I went out and bought the real nice IR heating elements, I could use them later in another project. For example, I purchase the nice ones, hook them up to this machine, then I have these cheap ones to experience with while I'm trying to work out my PID controller. Once I get the bugs ironed out, I can switch the nice ones over to my new unit. You know?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

You should most definitely get it. The seller got what he wanted for a working unit. You got screwed. As far as better parts, I think you should look at the other parts. If the whole thing is cheap and likely to fail go with the cheaper. That also depends on the price difference too. On my stuff, I usually upgrade unless it's going to cost me $1000 instead of $25. I usually buy Nichicon because they're only 5 cents more.

Yeah, there's not really much to this. I'll send some pics before it gets put back together. But mostly, just connectors that connect wires together. And there is a ton of wires! Wires going to connectors that connect to more wires that go to other connectors. I mean, we got some fans to blow the heat to the top heating unit. We have the top heating element (which seems a bit cheap, at least compared to how my Weller did it). Then there's the IR units. Just a bunch of wires and a thermocouple, that I can't move, attached. I'm guessing the thermocouple just measures the temps of the preheater. I'd rather of had the ability to hook that to the bottom of the board and measure the IR temp that way.

Then there's the bottom heater. I haven't really looked at how that works. The top hot air hooks to the bottom unit via a 7-pin wire harness. The top is unscrewable and removeable. The other end is unscrewable but it just doesn't look removeable (wtf?). Only 4 of the pins are being used from what I can tell (maybe 5). Two for the fan, two for the heating element. The fan is just a PC fan, a small one. There's a side fan to cool the board down. I think that's pretty useless because I think they should cool down naturally, not be forced to cool down faster. The touch screen was built by a different company and is a complete module. I can remove it. There's a thermocouple built into the top hot air, the bottom hot air and the pre-heater. Then I get my own external k-type thermocouple. I can pull out the drawer that contains the electronics but there's no stop or anything. If I pull it out far enough, I'll rip wires off. If I push it back in, I have to watch to make sure I don't tear any wires. There's these plastic things, the stuff you hide ethernet cable in I think. Conduit or something. That covers most of the wire mess. There's maybe three actual electronic devices that all the wires go to.

I'd like to get an idea of how to properly control the infrared preheaters and build my own unit. I'd like to design the pid controller myself. I'm okay with using an IC but I don't want to use a pre-built unit, you know?

[stj]

Re: Replacing BGA components with hot air.

i wonder if he shipped it fucked - that stripped screws thing is a bit of a givaway!

i have heard of things like this before with people shipping tv's with a smashed panel so they can claim insurance!