FSP PSU and Capxon caps

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  • envoid
    Member
    • Dec 2009
    • 26
    • USA
    #1

    FSP PSU and Capxon caps

    Hello again everyone.

    I'm trying to find a replacement cap for a Capxon KF 2200uf 6.3v cap that is/was in a FSP 600w PSU. What makes it so special is that it is 8mm in diameter and where it is sitting in the PSU it needs to have a heatshrink sleeve on it, making it 10mm. Anything larger than that will not fit due to two 45v rectifiers on either side.

    The FSP PSU model is FSX600-GLN.

    I looked up the specs for the KF series but they don't list an 8x20mm diameter cap for above 1000uf at 6.3v (which kinda leads me to believe it isn't even 2200uf). The closest replacement I found with the size constraints was a Nichicon HM.

    I'm thinking the HM will work as the ESR for the 8x20mm Capxon KF (~.15-.20Ohm) seems higher than the Nichicon HM (.16Ohm) but want to make sure I'm thinking this right.

    I had tried searching as I saw someone mentioning working on FSP PSUs before with the Capxon issues but wasn't finding anything more than that.

    Any help is soooooo appreciated! Thanks!!
    Tags: None
    • PCBONEZ
      Grumpy Old Fart
      • Aug 2005
      • 10661
      • USA
      #2
      Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

      The HM is .016 ohms.

      I had an FSP 700W a while ago that had those and the HM were are the only thing I could find to fit.
      Ordered the caps but I haven't needed it yet so it's still sitting waiting to be rebuilt.
      .
      These are a custom ordered size so not in data sheet.
      I think the 2200uF is probably right.
      .
      In general KF cross-reference to about Chemicon KY and Nichicon HE.
      Using the KY 8x20mm I'd say this KF's ESR/Ripple is -around- .069/1050.
      HM is serious over-kill but I couldn't find any alternates for that one at the time.
      .
      Mann-Made Global Warming.
      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
      -
      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
      - Dr Seuss
      -
      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
      -

        Comment

        • momaka
          master hoarder
          • May 2008
          • 12175
          • Bulgaria
          #3
          Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

          Originally posted by envoid
          What makes it so special is that it is 8mm in diameter and where it is sitting in the PSU it needs to have a heatshrink sleeve on it, making it 10mm. Anything larger than that will not fit due to two 45v rectifiers on either side.
          Go with a 10mm cap and forget about the heatshrink sleeve - it's completely useless and does nothing for the cap.
          I've looked at the KF data sheets several times before when I was replacing caps in a monitor, and it seems that they are actually closer in ESR (at least for the sizes I looked at) to United Chemicon KZE and Rubycon ZL. I replaced mine with Panasonic FM, which are slightly better than Chemicon KZE and Rubyocn ZL, and I haven't had any problems.
          But I think that even Chemicon KY and Nichicon HE would also work.

          *** EDIT ***
          It seems that the data sheet for KF on CapXon's website must be newer than what I was looking at when I replaced mine. PCBONEZ is right - CapXon KF is closer in specs to United Chemicon KY and Nichicon HE.
          Last edited by momaka; 06-25-2011, 08:06 PM.

            Comment

            • PCBONEZ
              Grumpy Old Fart
              • Aug 2005
              • 10661
              • USA
              #4
              Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

              Nice try but in some positions 10mm are a no-way no-go in this one and the heat-shrink IS needed because some of the caps are right up against energized heatsinks.
              .
              Mann-Made Global Warming.
              - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
              -
              Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
              - Dr Seuss
              -
              You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
              -

                Comment

                • PCBONEZ
                  Grumpy Old Fart
                  • Aug 2005
                  • 10661
                  • USA
                  #5
                  Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                  Originally posted by momaka
                  *** EDIT ***
                  It seems that the data sheet for KF on CapXon's website must be newer than what I was looking at when I replaced mine. PCBONEZ is right - CapXon KF is closer in specs to United Chemicon KY and Nichicon HE.
                  Capxon KF can be hard to cross reference because the can sizes for what ever uF are just plain weird in some cases.
                  Not too unusual to have to go up a grade or two just to find one with will work in a good brand.
                  .
                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
                  -
                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
                  - Dr Seuss
                  -
                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                  -

                    Comment

                    • c_hegge
                      Badcaps Legend
                      • Sep 2009
                      • 5219
                      • Australia
                      #6
                      Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                      If there is absoloutely nothing else that will fit, then I would use the HM. It may not be an ideal replacment, but it will probably work, although it may make the ripple a bit higher.
                      I love putting bad caps and flat batteries in fire and watching them explode!!

                      No wonder it doesn't work! You installed the jumper wires backwards

                      Main PC: Core i7 3770K 3.5GHz, Gigabyte GA-Z77M-D3H-MVP, 8GB Kingston HyperX DDR3 1600, 240GB Intel 335 Series SSD, 750GB WD HDD, Sony Optiarc DVD RW, Palit nVidia GTX660 Ti, CoolerMaster N200 Case, Delta DPS-600MB 600W PSU, Hauppauge TV Tuner, Windows 7 Home Premium

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                        Comment

                        • envoid
                          Member
                          • Dec 2009
                          • 26
                          • USA
                          #7
                          Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                          Thanks everyone for the input. And sorry, I'm always off with my decimal places.

                          The heatsink isn't charged, it actually gets screwed to the outer shell of the PSU. These rectifiers have pin 2 connected to the back but there is a very thin membrane between the heatsink and rect. The outer pins are grounded so the cap sits next to grounded pins on it, and a grounded heatsink. I wonder though if it is the coils it was being insulated from.

                          The pic is from my BB so I apologize in advance. On the left I already replaced one of the KFs with a Panny FM I had. Little bigger and wider wire offset (forgetting the proper word) but it works (i want to add some hot glue on the side to help sturdy it though).

                          I just wish they didn't cram that area and I could fit the FM in there with a little insulation...
                          Attached Files

                            Comment

                            • PCBONEZ
                              Grumpy Old Fart
                              • Aug 2005
                              • 10661
                              • USA
                              #8
                              Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                              Mine has one that actually touches a heatsink and another that's so close to an xfmr that a 10mm would touch it's coils.
                              .
                              Mann-Made Global Warming.
                              - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
                              -
                              Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
                              - Dr Seuss
                              -
                              You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                              -

                                Comment

                                • momaka
                                  master hoarder
                                  • May 2008
                                  • 12175
                                  • Bulgaria
                                  #9
                                  Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                  Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                  Nice try but in some positions 10mm are a no-way no-go in this one and the heat-shrink IS needed because some of the caps are right up against energized heatsinks.
                                  .
                                  Even so, couldn't this be done by putting a piece of insulating plastic on the heat sink (the same kind that is used under the power supply PCB)? I've seen it done on other power supplies.

                                  Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                  Capxon KF can be hard to cross reference because the can sizes for what ever uF are just plain weird in some cases.
                                  Yes, it seems CapXon likes to do that a lot and not just with the KF series. I've seen identical size and voltage KM caps that had different capacitance rating. Also seen it with GL. Really makes me wonder what CapXon did with those. Would be nice to have a capacitance and ESR meter in one of those cases.

                                    Comment

                                    • PCBONEZ
                                      Grumpy Old Fart
                                      • Aug 2005
                                      • 10661
                                      • USA
                                      #10
                                      Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                      Originally posted by momaka
                                      Even so, couldn't this be done by putting a piece of insulating plastic on the heat sink (the same kind that is used under the power supply PCB)? I've seen it done on other power supplies.
                                      If I thought that would work I wouldn't have bought HM, and you know how picky I am about matching specs.
                                      .
                                      Last edited by PCBONEZ; 06-29-2011, 12:30 AM.
                                      Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
                                      -
                                      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
                                      - Dr Seuss
                                      -
                                      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                      -

                                        Comment

                                        • envoid
                                          Member
                                          • Dec 2009
                                          • 26
                                          • USA
                                          #11
                                          Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                          Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                          If I thought that would work I wouldn't have bought HM, and you know how picky I am about matching specs.
                                          .
                                          Thats funny, I was contemplating it also, just hadn't had the time to see if anything would work. I was pondering maybe electrical tape placed strategically, though I'm also not sure it is insulating from the heatsink but the coils. Or its for nothing at all and just to make it die faster.

                                            Comment

                                            • momaka
                                              master hoarder
                                              • May 2008
                                              • 12175
                                              • Bulgaria
                                              #12
                                              Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                              Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                              If I thought that would work I wouldn't have bought HM, and you know how picky I am about matching specs.
                                              .
                                              Good point .

                                              But still, if this is true:
                                              Originally posted by envoid
                                              The heatsink isn't charged, it actually gets screwed to the outer shell of the PSU.
                                              ... then you don't need to isolate cap from the heatsink.
                                              Probably a good idea to isolate it from the inductor/toroid, though (just in case).

                                              Personally, I don't think it matters all that much (not for the caps on the secondary side, anyways). The cap has its own insulating sleeve, and if the inductor and/or capacitor should become so hot that the insulating sleeve on the cap burns, then I think you got bigger problems in the PSU to worry about.

                                                Comment

                                                • PCBONEZ
                                                  Grumpy Old Fart
                                                  • Aug 2005
                                                  • 10661
                                                  • USA
                                                  #13
                                                  Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                  That's fine for him. - Doesn't help mine.

                                                  Sleeves are not electrical insulation.
                                                  A number of cap manufacturers warn against using it as such.
                                                  .
                                                  Last edited by PCBONEZ; 06-29-2011, 11:04 PM.
                                                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
                                                  -
                                                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
                                                  - Dr Seuss
                                                  -
                                                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                                  -

                                                    Comment

                                                    • yyonline
                                                      Badcaps Veteran
                                                      • Jul 2009
                                                      • 692
                                                      • USA
                                                      #14
                                                      Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                      Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                                      Sleeves are not electrical insulation.
                                                      A number of cap manufacturers warn against using it as such.
                                                      I'll second that. I'm actually fixing an amplifier at the moment that somehow had arcing through the sleeve of a capacitor to a nearby component, as it melted a little hole through the sleeve.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • momaka
                                                          master hoarder
                                                          • May 2008
                                                          • 12175
                                                          • Bulgaria
                                                          #15
                                                          Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                          Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                                          Sleeves are not electrical insulation.
                                                          A number of cap manufacturers warn against using it as such.
                                                          .
                                                          Interesting, didn't know that.

                                                          I guess electrical tape will have to do then.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • envoid
                                                              Member
                                                              • Dec 2009
                                                              • 26
                                                              • USA
                                                              #16
                                                              Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                              Tried fitting the 10mm Panny FM last night and it won't go in at all. It got half way and then it was too tight. And this is without any insulating materials around it. So the HM it is. That should get ordered in a few months lol.

                                                              This thing also has some teapo caps, should I just replace them while I'm in this thing? I read some conflicting threads on here about them. They are 5yrs old? One shows "12/06" on the wrapping.

                                                              Thanks again everyone!!

                                                                Comment

                                                                • PCBONEZ
                                                                  Grumpy Old Fart
                                                                  • Aug 2005
                                                                  • 10661
                                                                  • USA
                                                                  #17
                                                                  Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                                  I wouldn't tear down a PSU just because it has Teapo, but if I have to tear it down and has Teapo I'll replace them while I'm in there.
                                                                  .
                                                                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                                                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
                                                                  -
                                                                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
                                                                  - Dr Seuss
                                                                  -
                                                                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                                                  -

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • envoid
                                                                      Member
                                                                      • Dec 2009
                                                                      • 26
                                                                      • USA
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                                      I might do it anyway then. Better now than do this again later anyway. =)

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • delaware74b
                                                                          Badcaps Veteran
                                                                          • Apr 2009
                                                                          • 628
                                                                          • USA
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                                          momaka - heat shrink tubing might be a better choice than electrical tape. It won't leave adhesive goo all over everything.
                                                                          Stupidity should be a crime, especially for drivers. I have NO patience for them.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • momaka
                                                                              master hoarder
                                                                              • May 2008
                                                                              • 12175
                                                                              • Bulgaria
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Re: FSP PSU and Capxon caps

                                                                              Originally posted by delaware74b
                                                                              momaka - heat shrink tubing might be a better choice than electrical tape. It won't leave adhesive goo all over everything.
                                                                              Yeah, that's one thing I don't like about electrical tape, too. Cleaning that sticky stuff isn't a lot of fun either. But if you apply it on something that doesn't move a lot and where the tape won't undo itself, then it's okay.
                                                                              Sometimes, I even burn it with a lighter to make it hard so that it won't undo itself. Helps a little bit, but not that much.

                                                                                Comment

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