P4SD - case J7X

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

hey, thanks.

the Ltec were put by me, yup, those are my replacement caps -so far-... i know they suck big time but i cant get better ones -yet-.

As for your second question, all the caps ive changed they all say 105C, ive only changed those advised by other members here. and looking at the rest of the caps, they all say 105C. even the small ones.

Any idea is welcome,

Thanks.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

By small I meant tiny,,, 4mm, 5mm.

You've never actually told us all the brands installed.

If those A0410 are Nichicon HN or HM series then they are defective.
A0412 -> "0412" = year 2004, week 12
Any of those with year codes from 01 thru 04 are bad.

.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

You said no POST.
Does it 'kick' the fan?

[PCBONEZ]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

Oops. - Wrong thread.......

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

hello, thanks.

i am not very experienced with the info on caps. aamof i dont know how to interpret em.

all the 1000uf/6.3v are Rubycon and they seem to be real Rubs and ok (imo) they read:

A0412; 105°C; rubycon; 6.3v1000uf; Y X G; negative band.

ive been told the yellow caps close to the processor are fujitsu polys, they read:

M; 4451U; upper and under lined F; 105°C; 2.5v 820uf; neg band.

then i recapped some wendell 1500uf/25v -originally 1200/16 teapo- i know wendell sucks but i do not have a better choice yet. -i tested em before installing and they at least gave me the capacitance value on the fluke.- they are close to the display output and para port.

the others close to the cpu are brand unknown to me, they are black, and the letters and band is like a dark golden color, they appear on my pics. 1800/6.3 not recapped since they look fine (imo) this is what they read:

1800uf; 6.3v; neg band; +105°C FL; a logo i cant recognize, looks like a M inside a rounded square... imagine the honda logo but instead of the H put a M ; and then a little further with pinkish letters says 41WW.

the smallest caps are a group of four besides the agp port, i dont know for sure what type of caps they are, they are about 4mm diameter, 10uf/25v not recapped...theres other one like those right besides the cpu fan connector, this is what they all read:

10uf/25v; S5105°C; A3; 05/04; like a double semi continious white stripes; and then the negative band.

theres other 3 close to the GMCH black and golden that read:

LZ 105°C; 405B (M) ; G LUXON; 100uf 16v; neg band.

and in that same area theres this one i thought it was rubycon -is not- haha it reads:

SM105°C; 405D (M); G LUXON 470uf 6.3v; neg band.

it appears to have other two caps like the one stated above, they are one behind the usb ports and the other behind the other usb ports with the rj45 connector.

theres another fujitsu poly, as i been told on this site, besides the agp port it reads:

M, 45527, upper and under lined F; -55°C~+105°C; 4v 560uf; band.

besides the audio connector i see these two:

LZ105°C;405B(M); G LUXON; 100uf 16v; band.

close to the battery i found these two: one rubycon like the rest (100uf) and one ive been told is also a poly cap, it reads, (its purple and white):

105°C 64; SANYO; 680 ; white line; 6.3; OS CON; and inside the neg bad it reads G; line; SP.

then the caps around the DIMMs slots:

two of these between XMM2 and XMM3 one on each side:

GSC; 105°C; T44G; 330uf; 6.3V; band.

then theres the rubycon close to the first DIMM slot, reads:

T0345; 105°C; rubycon; 3.6v 3300uf; MBZ; band.

then theres this two ltec i recapped, dont have other choice, they read:

1500uf; 6.3v; LZP 105°C(M); PET; 7923D and the other says 7030D; the ltec logo; band.

then theres other ruby 1000uf like the rest and two small ones that read:

47uf 16v; SS 105°C; A3; 05/04; TEAPO wow, cheapo, the only ones i found, ill try to find suitable replacement fot these.

each ; is new line :P

and wel thats it i think i looked all over, if i didnt provide the necessary info please advise, i tried to give as much as i could see. as for recapping im up to hear any direction, they seem ok to me but then again i am not very experienced on this.

Thank you all again for the time and replies.

Peace.

[Scenic]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

1800uf; 6.3v; neg band; +105°C FL; a logo i cant recognize, looks like a M inside a rounded square... imagine the honda logo but instead of the H put a M ; and then a little further with pinkish letters says 41WW.

Panasonic FL (Panasonic = Matsushita = Logo)

GSC; 105°C; T44G; 330uf; 6.3V; band.

those will be 100% bad. GSC = Sacon = Evercon = craaaaap ...

those G-Luxons you mentioned are most likely baked dry too.. [/QUOTE]

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

i will start looking replacement for those, i have already replaced the two cheapo I found.


Thanks again. Will update asap.

[Scenic]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

where the hell did that [/quote] at the end come from? lol

[PCBONEZ]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

>> the others close to the cpu are brand unknown to me, they are black, and the letters and band is like a dark golden color, they appear on my pics.
>> 1800/6.3 not recapped since they look fine (imo) this is what they read:
-- These might be Nichicon HN series which are bad if dated from 2001 thru 2004.

>> 1800uf; 6.3v; neg band; +105°C FL; a logo i cant recognize, looks like a M inside a rounded square...
-- These are Panasonic [aka Matsushita] FL series. - They are good caps like Rubycon.

>> 10uf/25v; S5105°C; A3; 05/04; like a double semi continious white stripes; and then the negative band.
-- I think I'll need a pic of this one.

>> theres other 3 close to the GMCH black and golden that read: LZ 105°C; 405B (M) ; G LUXON; 100uf 16v; neg band.
-- I replace those, most people don't bother if that small. Given your problems I would try replacing them.

>> SM105°C; 405D (M); G LUXON 470uf 6.3v; neg band.
-- Replace this one and any like it.

>> theres another fujitsu poly, as i been told on this site, besides the agp port it reads:
>> M, 45527, upper and under lined F; -55°C~+105°C; 4v 560uf; band.
-- underlined F says your ID is correct. Treat the same as the Fujitsu mentioned earlier.

>> besides the audio connector i see these two:
>> LZ105°C;405B(M); G LUXON; 100uf 16v; band.
-- Treat the same as the other G LUXON; 100uf 16v;

>> close to the battery i found these two: one rubycon like the rest (100uf) and one ive been told is also a poly cap, it reads, (its purple and white):
>> 105°C 64; SANYO; 680 ; white line; 6.3; OS CON; and inside the neg bad it reads G; line; SP.
-- These are okay. They Sanyo is an SP series OS-CON Polymer. [Great caps.]

>> two of these between XMM2 and XMM3 one on each side:
>> GSC; 105°C; T44G; 330uf; 6.3V; band.
-- Replace GSC on-sight. [100uF or less it's optional but these are so -crap- it's better to get rid of all of them.]

>> then theres this two ltec i recapped, dont have other choice, they read:
>> 1500uf; 6.3v; LZP 105°C(M); PET; 7923D and the other says 7030D; the ltec logo; band.
-- Replace

>> 47uf 16v; SS 105°C; A3; 05/04; TEAPO wow, cheapo, the only ones i found, ill try to find suitable replacement fot these.
-- If not bloated this one is optional to replace. Maybe do it if nothing else works.

.
.

[PCBONEZ]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

where the hell did that "/quote" at the end come from? lol

It was just floating around the internet and had nothing better to do today.

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

UPDATE: Hello all. This pics are from today, this is how the board looks.

I think I have run out of ideas, the board used to at least respond when it had no CPU fan on with the 5 red flases, now on today it does not. It does reacts if I leave the CPU without cooler+fan with the 2 red flash, but not with the cooler on (cooler on, fan off), and if I add those elements and no DIMM it does not show the memory missing red flashed neither.

I havent done a complete manual resoldering, if someone advises it i will.

I have recapped almost all the board, the only bad about is that some caps I had to get em from other dead boards, but I tested em before using em again and at least they gave me the capacitance value...















Any idea is very welcome.

Thank you all

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

THANK YOU FOR ALL THESE ADVISES, as I type, am writting a more elaborated reply. Thanks.

>> the others close to the cpu are brand unknown to me, they are black, and the letters and band is like a dark golden color, they appear on my pics.
>> 1800/6.3 not recapped since they look fine (imo) this is what they read:
-- These might be Nichicon HN series which are bad if dated from 2001 thru 2004.

>> 1800uf; 6.3v; neg band; +105°C FL; a logo i cant recognize, looks like a M inside a rounded square...
-- These are Panasonic [aka Matsushita] FL series. - They are good caps like Rubycon.

>> 10uf/25v; S5105°C; A3; 05/04; like a double semi continious white stripes; and then the negative band.
-- I think I'll need a pic of this one.

>> theres other 3 close to the GMCH black and golden that read: LZ 105°C; 405B (M) ; G LUXON; 100uf 16v; neg band.
-- I replace those, most people don't bother if that small. Given your problems I would try replacing them.

>> SM105°C; 405D (M); G LUXON 470uf 6.3v; neg band.
-- Replace this one and any like it.

>> theres another fujitsu poly, as i been told on this site, besides the agp port it reads:
>> M, 45527, upper and under lined F; -55°C~+105°C; 4v 560uf; band.
-- underlined F says your ID is correct. Treat the same as the Fujitsu mentioned earlier.

>> besides the audio connector i see these two:
>> LZ105°C;405B(M); G LUXON; 100uf 16v; band.
-- Treat the same as the other G LUXON; 100uf 16v;

>> close to the battery i found these two: one rubycon like the rest (100uf) and one ive been told is also a poly cap, it reads, (its purple and white):
>> 105°C 64; SANYO; 680 ; white line; 6.3; OS CON; and inside the neg bad it reads G; line; SP.
-- These are okay. They Sanyo is an SP series OS-CON Polymer. [Great caps.]

>> two of these between XMM2 and XMM3 one on each side:
>> GSC; 105°C; T44G; 330uf; 6.3V; band.
-- Replace GSC on-sight. [100uF or less it's optional but these are so -crap- it's better to get rid of all of them.]

>> then theres this two ltec i recapped, dont have other choice, they read:
>> 1500uf; 6.3v; LZP 105°C(M); PET; 7923D and the other says 7030D; the ltec logo; band.
-- Replace

>> 47uf 16v; SS 105°C; A3; 05/04; TEAPO wow, cheapo, the only ones i found, ill try to find suitable replacement fot these.
-- If not bloated this one is optional to replace. Maybe do it if nothing else works.

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

>> the others close to the cpu are brand unknown to me, they are black, and the letters and band is like a dark golden color, they appear on my pics.
>> 1800/6.3 not recapped since they look fine (imo) this is what they read:
-- These might be Nichicon HN series which are bad if dated from 2001 thru 2004.

I think they are the [M] brand , heres the pic:



and i think they are the same as this:

>> 1800uf; 6.3v; neg band; +105°C FL; a logo i cant recognize, looks like a M inside a rounded square...
-- These are Panasonic [aka Matsushita] FL series. - They are good caps like Rubycon.

then i left em alone

>> 10uf/25v; S5105°C; A3; 05/04; like a double semi continious white stripes; and then the negative band.
-- I think I'll need a pic of this one.

here it is:



i recapped it with this: the board has like 5 of these, total (extracted from another board tested for capacitance value on a fluke)

>> theres other 3 close to the GMCH black and golden that read: LZ 105°C; 405B (M) ; G LUXON; 100uf 16v; neg band.
-- I replace those, most people don't bother if that small. Given your problems I would try replacing them.

I have also recapped those, same as the one before, i took em from another board:



actually all the caps appearing in the above pic are recapped, and it includes:

>> SM105°C; 405D (M); G LUXON 470uf 6.3v; neg band.
-- Replace this one and any like it.

i replaced every of these type since i had brand new one.

>> theres another fujitsu poly, as i been told on this site, besides the agp port it reads:
>> M, 45527, upper and under lined F; -55°C~+105°C; 4v 560uf; band.
-- underlined F says your ID is correct. Treat the same as the Fujitsu mentioned earlier.

sweeeeeeet

>> besides the audio connector i see these two:
>> LZ105°C;405B(M); G LUXON; 100uf 16v; band.
-- Treat the same as the other G LUXON; 100uf 16v;

recapped, again from others pulled from another board but they were all tested at least for the capacitance value:

>> close to the battery i found these two: one rubycon like the rest (100uf) and one ive been told is also a poly cap, it reads, (its purple and white):
>> 105°C 64; SANYO; 680 ; white line; 6.3; OS CON; and inside the neg bad it reads G; line; SP.
-- These are okay. They Sanyo is an SP series OS-CON Polymer. [Great caps.]

>> two of these between XMM2 and XMM3 one on each side:
>> GSC; 105°C; T44G; 330uf; 6.3V; band.
-- Replace GSC on-sight. [100uF or less it's optional but these are so -crap- it's better to get rid of all of them.]

i replaced em for other caps, i think they are the same crappy brand, again, i took em from another board and tested, i am sorry i cant find some of these caps on my local stores heres how it is:

>> then theres this two ltec i recapped, dont have other choice, they read:
>> 1500uf; 6.3v; LZP 105°C(M); PET; 7923D and the other says 7030D; the ltec logo; band.
-- Replace

The best I could find was this 1800/6.3 of the [M] brand, I did the recap, if you think I should use other caps please advise.

shit i forgot to take a pic of this but u believe dont u

>> 47uf 16v; SS 105°C; A3; 05/04; TEAPO wow, cheapo, the only ones i found, ill try to find suitable replacement fot these.
-- If not bloated this one is optional to replace. Maybe do it if nothing else works.

.
.

i replaced em for this 47uf/50v closest value available:



.... and wel, the board still doesn't respond, no POST.

Any idea, tip, suggestion, link, manual, doc, on these boards is very welcome.

Thanks to all.

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

UPDATE: I applied a little hot air, after letting it cool off i tested it and it booted and showed POST -after many days of nothing-

so i mounted the board to its base and attached the cpu cooler as it has to, and also added the second DIMM....

tested again, and nothing back. This has become a pattern on certain cases...

Any idea is welcome,

Thanks.

[Scenic]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

i'm starting to think it's the surface mount CPU Socket or the Northbridge..

especially because it works when it's outside of the case, but not when it's mounted in the case (stress from bending the PCB)

[c_hegge]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

I agree. probably a bad joint.

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

Thank you both for the advise, only thing is that if i take the board back out of its mounting case it keep not responding again... u think after the stretch elements stay misfunctioning? do you mean a bad solder joint? would u advise me to do a complete manual resoldering?? last time i tried to resolder the cpu pins underneath the socket base turned out not so good, so maybe i'll do that area just with the hot air and some flux?.

[Scenic]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

wait.. is your CPU socket surface mount (no pins on the backside) or through hole like the caps?

if it's through hole, carefully resoldering/reflowing it with flux and hot air from the backside of the board would be worth a try..

if it's surface mount, you could try to heat it up from the backside while the board is laying flat.. otherwise the socket will just fall off once the solder starts to melt.
surface mount sockets are a pain in the ass in general.. not much you can do except to try the above..

oh and try not to pop the caps due to extreme heat

edit: this thread has turned into an inline-image-nightmare.. takes forever to load..

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

yeah man i dont know what is wrong. i thought it was my internet service haha u dont know the issues i had to post and upload and stuff... any ways,

Thanks for the advise.

I am gonna try the heating up with the board laying flat, i was wondering if you think is a good idea to drop some flux to the pins from the top, and whats your thoughts on trying to remove the socket base? u think is not neccessary? not worth? or a must? -ive done that with both results, success and fail, please dont advise me this haha- and what about a complete manual resoldering of the board?? u think i should go for it??

thanks for the ideas.

EDIT: My bad, I answered without answering, I believe they are surface since i see no pins on the back. thanks

[MXM]

Re: P4SD - case J7X

UPDATE: Hey, wel I followed the procedure as adviced and here are some pics/results.

this is before heating it up, but after the manual resoldering. have to be honest, i limited the manual resoldering to the areas close to cpu socket and mem controller:














*Before heating it up I added some flux from the top of the socket.
this is right after the blood bath:







this is after cleaning with ISO:









After all this, I Mounted it to its base, didnt feel like having false positives baseless so I mounted it, IT HAS BEEN WORKING, so far, its been running mtest+ for a 51mins walltime, only one DIMM installed with 6 complete passes and 0 errors.

I have a question, why does that area needed some heat, Ive always avoided applying such heat into that specific area given the fact that my common sense tells me that's the area most exposed to heat and high temps on the board while working....... ???

I do not know if its too soon to call it a success but hey, at least it has not failed. I havent done much more testing other than letting it run, I am planning on adding to it its second DIMM and see what happens all afternoon testing.

THANK YOU ALL FOR THE TIME AND IDEAS.