AMD or Intel??....

[grss1982]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

If DDR2 800 is going to do a lot better at low cost it may be best to buy and sell off the 553 sticks, get something for them.
I can clock my 800 up to 960 without problem. Guess that depends on the memory quality.

Sorry about that. I failed to mention that the Intel processor I'm going to get is the one with an 800FSB.

IIRC:

FSB: 800/4=200

AND

DDR2 533Mhz = can actually be used on processors with a 266FSB which is 266x4 = 1066 FSB or even lower like my choice e2xxx series which are all 800FSB.

[grss1982]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

I also read this article: EXTERNAL LINK BROKEN

DDR2 memory has been known for rather long already — from the first models of DDR2-400 and DDR2-533 that appeared approximately two years ago and possessed quite high latencies (both dynamic, which have to do with properties of memory chips, and system ones, which have to do with initially slow timings — 3-3-3 and 4-4-4 correspondingly) and up to its modern modifications offering high performance (DDR2-667, DDR2-800, and unofficial DDR2-1000/1066) as well as relatively low latencies (up to 4-4-4 for DDR2-800). Nevertheless, the real potential of this memory type in dual channel mode is still unrevealed (using relatively expensive high-speed DDR2 memory in single-channel mode is not expedient at least for economic reasons, as much cheaper DDR-400 memory in dual-channel mode offers no worse results at minimum, very often - even higher results). The reason is that DDR2 memory has been supported, actually was intended only for one platform — Intel Pentium 4/Pentium D with Intel chipsets - from the 915 series to the modern 975 series (or NVIDIA nForce 4 Intel Edition, but it does not essentially change status quo). The main stumbling block to revealing the full potential of DDR2 memory on this platform lies in its traditional bus architecture, when a processor uses a Front-Side Bus (FSB) to connect to the Northbridge, which important component is a memory controller proper, which can operate in a dual-channel mode. Even though this memory controller can provide the internal memory bus bandwidth on the level with the theoretical memory bandwidth of dual-channel DDR2 (from 6.4 GB/s for DDR2-400 to 12.8 GB/s for DDR2-800), the real data exchange rate between a processor and memory is limited to the bandwidth of FSB, which operates either at 200 MHz or at 266 MHz (in case of "extreme" CPU modifications). Its throughput is just 6.4 GB/s or 8.53 GB/s — which does not exceed the theoretical bandwidth of dual-channel DDR2-533 memory at best. Proceeding from this simple mathematics, we draw the main conclusion time and again that dual-channel DDR2-533 memory for Intel platforms is still more than enough even these days. Of course, in practice faster memory (DDR2-667 or DDR2-800) still has an advantage on this class of platforms as well - it consists solely in reducing latencies for random memory access. But you must agree that constant random memory access is hardly a typical mode for most real tasks.

[bgavin]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

I just took a backward step down Memory Lane... back to AMD-land.

Yesterday I won several XP-3200+ Barton processors at 0.99 cents each from an eBay auction. I remember when these used to be a couple hunnert bux... yesterday's hot rods at today's firesale prices.

I also picked up a few more MSI Delta2 K7N2* boards that offer 400 FSB for the above processors. These will provide new homes for the 3200 Bartons.

[davmax]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

I hope those Barton processors are working ones.

[kc8adu]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

I hope those Barton processors are working ones.

+1
untested=fried on ebay.
i need a few good ones myself.

[zandrax]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

+1
untested=fried on ebay.
i need a few good ones myself.

Cheap prices and venerable processors never come together: you may get any working Athlon XP below 2800+ for few bucks, but Bartons, especially 3000 and 3200+, cost much more. The same with old P3 Tualatins, they never get cheap as they should do (not a real concern because the world seems full of cheap Coppermine 1000EB ).

Zandrax

[bgavin]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

Generalities are simply that. With patience, I have scored a number of fantastic buys that I still own. I have accumulated several PLX power amps, numerous musical instruments, camera equipment, and computer stuff at firesale prices by being patient.

There are always sellers in distress, or estate sellers, etc, that move stuff below "market" value. This seller was moving literally dozens of Barton 3200 processors over several auctions. He made the mistake of offering 30 at a single Dutch auction, and there simply was not enough buyers to drive up the price.

He does offer a DOA warranty on them, also.

[zandrax]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

This seller was moving literally dozens of Barton 3200 processors over several auctions. He made the mistake of offering 30 at a single Dutch auction, and there simply was not enough buyers to drive up the price.

He does offer a DOA warranty on them, also.

I found analog auctions on ebay in past, but sellers always sold them as untested. A friend of mine, who was repairing some old socket A based computers last year, took a dozen of XP 1700 and 1800+ for something like 30 euros with shipping ($45), but none of them worked; since then I'm suspicious about stock sellings.
Yours Athlons are covered, so they should work: it seems a good purchase.

Zandrax

[shadow]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

not a real concern because the world seems full of cheap Coppermine 1000EB

Amen to that, I got a pair of those in my dual CPU server. I got the second CPU from Ebay. It was being sold as working, so I did not have the dreaded 'untested' issue and I got a CPU and a 256mb stick of RAM for AU$40 including postage.

[grss1982]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

Just to add to the Intel v. AMD discussion......

EXTERNAL LINK BROKEN

Wisconsin team sues Intel over Core 2 tech

The Wisconsin Alumni Research Foundation (WARF) today filed a lawsuit against Intel, charging the company with violating a key patent for its Core 2 Duo processor design. WARF claims that the Core 2's code prediction technology infringes on a similar 1998 invention from the University of Wisconsin-Madison. By using the technology to increase the amount of parallel work accomplished by its processors, Intel is effectively stealing the University's intellectual property, according to the complaint.

WARF also explains that it had discussed the licensing the concept to Intel as early as 2001 but that Intel did not appear to react until the Core 2 began using the disputed technology without permission. As a result, the researchers are asking a Western District of Wisconsin court to issue an injunction blocking Intel from selling Core 2 Duo processors in addition to paying damages.

Intel has not publicly responded to the claims but would be heavily impacted by a WARF victory in the suit. The Core 2 line, which includes the Core 2 Extreme and Core 2 Quad, forms the backbone of Intel's semiconductor business.

More Stories here:
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ne...22&btnG=Search

[bgavin]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

Yours Athlons are covered, so they should work: it seems a good purchase.

As it turned out, all were counterfeit. I advised the seller, and he did a full refund on all three. I think he's a crook, and refunds are a cost of doing business. I did a Positive Feedback for him, giving him the benefit of the doubt, and mentioned they were counterfeit and I got a full refund. This will alert the eBay buyers who read feedback ratings.

I still had a need, so I bought a brand new Sempron Barton 3300+ OEM which is 100% identical to the Athlon Barton 3200+. This is as good as it gets on Socket 462 boards.

On a more interesting note, I picked up a 3.4 GHz Pentium4 Northwood, 800 FSB to go on an Intel D875PBZ board. This seems to be the final evolution of single core P4 in Northwood cores before they went to the overheating Prescott cores. The board has a long standing reputation for stability. I do not OC.

After reading all the BIOS problems, etc, in the latest Intel boards, I decided to pass on them all. The floppy controller is missing from most of the new boards as well. Stupid. WinXP/F6 driver installation requires a genuine floppy, or slipstream of new storage drivers into the install CD.

A quick check of www.cpu-world.com shows a lot of CPU information. It looks like Intel is back as Performance King, and doing it with less power consumption than any of the AMD models. All the new games appear to be written for Dual Core only. Single core need not apply.

[zandrax]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

As it turned out, all were counterfeit. I advised the seller, and he did a full refund on all three. I think he's a crook, and refunds are a cost of doing business. I did a Positive Feedback for him, giving him the benefit of the doubt, and mentioned they were counterfeit and I got a full refund. This will alert the eBay buyers who read feedback ratings.

I still had a need, so I bought a brand new Sempron Barton 3300+ OEM which is 100% identical to the Athlon Barton 3200+. This is as good as it gets on Socket 462 boards.

I'm sorry for you: I read about counterfeited Semprons at fab51.com or about remarked Geodes (those base on downclocked XP cores), but never connected them to your purchase.
Do you suspect he knowed his cpus were fakes? It's hard to prove, moreover he fully refunded you so you can say he is a dishonest seller unless you find some evdence against him; however you should contact Amd and explain the situation.

On a more interesting note, I picked up a 3.4 GHz Pentium4 Northwood, 800 FSB to go on an Intel D875PBZ board. This seems to be the final evolution of single core P4 in Northwood cores before they went to the overheating Prescott cores. The board has a long standing reputation for stability. I do not OC.

After reading all the BIOS problems, etc, in the latest Intel boards, I decided to pass on them all. The floppy controller is missing from most of the new boards as well. Stupid. WinXP/F6 driver installation requires a genuine floppy, or slipstream of new storage drivers into the install CD.

A quick check of www.cpu-world.com shows a lot of CPU information. It looks like Intel is back as Performance King, and doing it with less power consumption than any of the AMD models. All the new games appear to be written for Dual Core only. Single core need not apply.

That's true, but your Northwood isn't a real dual core: HyperThreading fakes a smp processor through a dedicated but limited part of the whole die.
I hope you have enough DDR400 sticks at home becuase they aren't cheap even when bought used.

Zandrax

[willawake]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

On a more interesting note, I picked up a 3.4 GHz Pentium4 Northwood, 800 FSB to go on an Intel D875PBZ board.

ooh i love the D875PBZLK, best board i owned after the cusl2, still use it every day. what revision do you have?

[bgavin]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

I know the P4 is single core. It looked like a modest purchase to go with the D875PBZ board. I have a business client who needs a stable, but faster business machine, so this is for her. I don't have the board version yet, because it hasn't arrived.

I also have a bid on a Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3 in the U.K. It seems that USA sellers don't offer the non-raid version, so I will try and score this one. It is NIB, and I have a high enough bid that I should pick it up. It has the Gigabyte SATA2 supplement to ICH9, and not the junk JMicron chip.

Newegg is selling Corsair XMS DDR400 sticks for $59/1gb which is a normal price for 1gb sticks. The GA-P35-DS3 requires DDR2-800, which sells for the same price.

[grss1982]

Re: AMD or Intel??....

Bump!!!!

Holy cow a 90% OC of a Dual Core Celeron 1200!!!!

EXTERNAL LINK BROKEN

This would really be perfect for bgavin's GA-P35-DS3.

This kind of OCing must really remind some of the old timers of the Celeron 300A.