Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

The P4 runs nice and cool @ 35C idle and 44C under heavy load. But the 92mm ball bearing fan bugs me. It only ranges between 1690-1710RPM no matter the load. The noise bugs me a bit so I'm going to splice a molex connector inline with the 12V and ground wires of the CPU fan to run the fan at a fixed 5V. This way It should be quieter but I can still use the 4 pin header later on if I want to. I figured since it's running so cool, it can handle the slower RPMs.

Just curious - is it a 4-pin fan or 3-pin?

I don't really care if the CPU averages 10C higher. Pentium 4s are some of the toughest CPUs out there.

Indeed. Not to mention how plentiful they are right now. You can buy them in buckets for just whatever they are worth as scrap - or at least the socket 775 ones. I just did a search on eBay, and it seems the price for the socket 478 CPUs has gone up quite a bit. About a year ago, you could grab s478 CPUs for less than $1 each if you were to buy a lot of 5 or more.

Are you talking about those low profile ones? I love those cards but hate how they have that dumb DMS-59 connector or whatever it's called. They must be fairly silent at that fan speed? Amazing what just a little bit of air movement can do!

Yup, those are it (two of them did have normal profile brackets, though). The DMS-59 connector is annoying indeed if you don't have one. One time, I bought a video card lot on eBay only because it came with 3 DMS-59 to dual VGA adapters. Other than that, these video cards are not that noisy. At 13%, you *will* hear the fan with an open case, but barely anything when it is closed. That said, the newer drivers for these cards will throttle the clocks back. If you room is cool enough (under 68F) so that the card idles around 40C or lower, the fan might get turned off too. But if you were to place a larger fan (>80 mm) near yours and run it at 5V, it will make worlds of a difference and there will be no noise at all.

captain capacitance

Good one!

The only ones who seem to do better on VRM at least from this era is MSI.

Oh yes, MSI. I've never seen a hot VRM on any of their socket AM2 and older boards. Not sure about the newer ones, though. I'm not a fan of those gazillion-phase VRMs on new boards these days, though.

That's interesting though, does the Intel 945 chipset support their extreme edition processors?? I thought you had to have the 955X or 975X chipset.

According to the P5GC-MX manual, no. But I did a bit of research online before to check CPU support (was trying to see if I can make the board run a modded s771 Xeon CPU), and both the 3.73 GHz P4 Extreme edition and Core 2 Extreme X6800 are supported. Also, all C2Ds are supported, but you can only run them at a maximum of 800 MHz FSB.

I hope you're getting good use out of that Pentium D and board

Sadly, not yet. Don't have any (good) cases left at the moment. I've also been meaning to finish recapping it for a while now, but I got short on good caps. Two of the 820 uF KZGs scattered on the board already bulged just sitting in storage, so I definitely want to get each and every one of them replaced (thus, I have to say it was a good riddance when you replaced the ones on your board).

i always have a 140mm fan above the expansion slot area blowing air down on it. i found a 140mm fan covers the entire width of the expansion slot area in a full size atx board. for a micro atx board, two 80mm fans side by side should cover the entire expansion slot area.

I do something similar here with (usually) 120 mm fans. I don't mount the fan anywhere, though. Instead, I just let it sit at the bottom of the case and angle it about 45-80 degrees relative to the board. That way, air moves across the lower sections of the case in all sorts of bizarre patterns - which makes things run surprisingly cool.

When I was saying "classic momaka" I was referring to him having 12 of those video cards

Wait, did I really say 12?
I think my brain is definitely rotting. Should have been 7. I think the number 12 came from the price I paid for these video cards (about $2 per card, since I bought in a big lot).

I may try and get another fan in there. But, if it fails, it fails. I'll try and up the cooling a little. But, silence is my main goal here...

Yeah, we hear ya! It is not an overly-expensive card after all. And moreover, I understand that silence is golden sometimes. So I wouldn't sweat it either. But I think if you put a 80 mm or larger fan near the card (doesn't have to be blowing directly at it at all) and run it at a low speed, it will still make a mile of a difference.

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

I listened to that video 3 times with the volume CRANKED up Cool song for bass. The sub even hit those really low notes pretty well. Lots of things rattling in the house...I wonder what my neighbors thought

Nice!
Same here. I have a bunch of video cards on the wall (serving both as art "decor" and as testing equipment ), and they like to rattle quite a bit with that song - even though my speakers are powered by an amp powered by a measly 40 Watt adapter.

It even woke up my deaf cat! She can't hear anything but she came downstairs to "see what was up" She must have felt it

Haha!
See, even your cat understands that loud bass is not about hearing, but rather about feeling/experience .

Speaking of a loud bass experience, I think this is as ridiculous as it gets:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CewacsP6TSY

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

That's why I upped the specs of the caps in those spots. The upper one to the left of the RAM slots, I replaced with a 1000uF 6.3V nichicon HZ. The lower one by the southbridge chipset was replaced with a 1500uF 6.3V nichicon HZ.

just a question to momaka, do the caps in those two spots require ultra low esr caps being used? cuz im thinking ultra low esr caps dont like heat either since they are rated for only 2k-3k hrs. would using a normal low-esr 10k hour psu grade cap be better for such a hot position? and would the ram and southbridge work fine with a low-esr psu grade cap or would the ram/chip complain and malfunction?

Lots of things rattling in the house...I wonder what my neighbors thought

as your "neighbour" half a world away, ima say u were having great speaker sex with your speaker system! better keep it down! i think your neighbours heard all your oooh-aaah moaning from how good your speaker system sounds!

It even woke up my deaf cat! She can't hear anything but she came downstairs to "see what was up" She must have felt it

Haha!
See, even your cat understands that loud bass is not about hearing, but rather about feeling/experience .

there's this superstition that cats can detect vibrations and thus earthquakes. there's this superstitious belief that cats get restless and start scratching walls and things before an earthquake happens. so i guess this is a cat related thing related to their sense of touch and not sense of hearing...

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

just a question to momaka, do the caps in those two spots require ultra low esr caps being used?

Not necessarily.

It depends on the buck regulator design, though - in particular, on the switching frequency. High-frequency buck regulators usually have smaller inductors and thus require lower ESR caps, whereas low-frequency ones usually have bigger inductors (or ones with more turns) and so the ESR is not as important as is the capacitance of the caps. It sort of like linear vs. switching power adapters.

But to put it more simply: you can usually get away with using lower-tier low ESR caps. However, the ripple and noise on the output may be higher. This may or may not cause instability issues, depending on how over-designed the regulator circuit was. If you really must use lower-tier low ESR caps, then it might be a good idea to use caps with higher capacitance and voltage rating, as this usually means the capacitor will be physically bigger and thus have better ESR and ripple current specs. That's actually one reason why cheap motherboards back in the day (of badcaps) used many high-capacitance caps. It also helps with heat dissipation - bigger caps have bigger surface area, and thus can dissipate more heat.

So yes, if you have a motherboard with hot-running buck regulators, then using lower-tier low ESR caps with higher endurance ratings might actually be a good idea, provided you also try to get the total ESR and ripple current rating of the caps close to the originals.

[Wester547]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

Nah, you guys should call me "Captain who knows it when he needs to know it." Were it not for this site, I wouldn't know half of what I know.

Re loud fans, I'm not irked by the noise as I need my airflow fix and the roar of case fans starting up every time I power cycle my computers. I think it's empowering. I also prefer my cases closed so as to keep contaminants out as well as preserving airflow by way of convection (though it's nothing ghetto modding can't fix).

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

I listened to that video 3 times with the volume CRANKED up Cool song for bass. The sub even hit those really low notes pretty well. Lots of things rattling in the house...I wonder what my neighbors thought

It even woke up my deaf cat! She can't hear anything but she came downstairs to "see what was up" She must have felt it

How 'bout some Halo CE with the bigass map and the sub cranked!

[Pentium4]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

Here is the heatsink that came with the motherboard in 04. It is good sized! Definitely big enough to cool a 65W TDP CPU. The fan always spins at 1700RPM no matter the load. At 100% usage the CPU hit 53C highest, which is fine by me.

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

^ Those older stock Intel heatsinks are quite decent. No, scratch that - they are actually VERY good.
I also see that one has screws rather than plastic push pins and probably a good bracket for the board. I hate retention mechanisms that warp the board.

[Pentium4]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

I knew you'd catch that it's the bracket style I too don't like the push pin heatsinks. I noticed that even after over 11 years there is no warping whatsoever in the processor area which is really nice. Even though it says Asus on the fan, I think it's a Delta just because it's so loud at 1700RPM

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

Even though it says Asus on the fan, I think it's a Delta just because it's so loud at 1700RPM

Or Nidec. Both make really loud fans.

I myself prefer Panaflo, Sanyo Denki, and PowerLogic.

[Pentium4]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

I think you should to put a fan under the video card or blowing to the side of it... or something. I've seen many modern passively-cooled GPUs die, even these low-end one. A 60-80 mm fan running at 5V should be both quiet and provide enough airflow to keep it cool.

Thanks for your advice momaka! I did this, and it made a huge difference. The thing has been running hot, idling at around 67C since Christmas. I put an old low amperage ball bearing 80mm fan slightly under and close to the video card. It is absolutely 100% silent. I'd be surprised if it's 600RPM. It is now idling at 49/50C!!! Massive difference. And 53/54C under load instead of 73C. Amazing!

[ChaosLegionnaire]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

lol! nice... your video card will be thanking you for making it last longer!!

[momaka]

Re: Recapping Asus PTGD1-LA

Thanks for your advice momaka! I did this, and it made a huge difference. The thing has been running hot, idling at around 67C since Christmas. I put an old low amperage ball bearing 80mm fan slightly under and close to the video card. It is absolutely 100% silent. I'd be surprised if it's 600RPM. It is now idling at 49/50C!!! Massive difference. And 53/54C under load instead of 73C. Amazing!

You're welcome!

Yes, you don't need a wind tunnel to get good temperatures in your PC . Just properly-sized heatsinks with the a bit of air will do the job. Most heatsinks also have a saturation point, no matter how much airflow you have, the temperature won't improve much. When you get to that point and whatever you have still runs too hot, then you know the heatsink isn't adequate for that application.