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I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

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    #21
    Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

    @ PCBONEZ: if you want to keep files safe when you reinstall Windows, then you need a backup more than a NAS
    Why not buying an external hard disk big enough for all you important data? It's cheaper, nothing to configure and works reasonably well for the job: a NAS is better suited for a lan environment in which clients need to access files stored in a single server, so the NAS is slightly more than a dedicated file server.

    IMHO both FreeNAS and OpenFiler are too complex for your job (backup): they'll give you headaches in configuring them. But if you really want a NAS or you like the idea of a centralized storage, then look for FreeNAS: OpenFiler increased requirements with the last version (release 2.3) while previous 2.2 could run on a 500 MHz cpu with 256 MB of ram; OTOH FreeNAS still runs on a 12 years old pc with 96 MB of ram.

    File and partition thing: you can't access directly to files as they were in your pc's hard disk, instead the operating system installed in the NAS shows them to you.
    Let me show an example: you want to buy some some screws from an hardware store. You can't enter the rear depot: the clerk enters the depot, reach section 7, shelf 19, box A03 and takes the screws. You can ask the clerk if you speak the same language. Replace store with NAS, screws with files, clerck with OS, depot/shelf/box ... with partitions, directories and subdirectories and language with protocol (NFS, CIFS/SMB, AFP, ...).
    So it's pointless if not disadvantageous to choose a Windows file system for a Linux or BSD based NAS: the protocol hides these details allowing different OSes, computers and architectures to communicate with themselves as long as they speak a common language.

    Zandrax
    Have an happy life.

    Comment


      #22
      Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

      Nope, USB drives aren't going to cut it even for backups.
      First, I don't like USB drives and don't 'do' huge drives for anything. 250GB max.
      Second, backups will be to another building via LAN.
      [And backups for systems in the other building will be to this building via LAN.]

      Files need to be accessible from 5 different work areas in two different buildings need to be identical 24/7. Some files need to accessible to BOTH Windows and Linux as workstations will be dual boot.

      If all I cared about was Windows I'd just put a W2k machine with mirrored RAID drives on the lan and share all the directories. That's what I have now and what I'm trying to get away from. Viruses love open shares.

      Windows is going away here but I need something that can handle both Windows and Linux (and use the same files with both) during the transition.

      So, centralization is the real reason for the NAS.

      I know it gets confusing trying to follow what I'm doing.
      I'm trying to accomplish several things at the same time.
      I'm not surprised if you get confused because I get confused.

      MS Office is being replaced with Open Office (as wife and I get use to it) which takes care of most of that, but I have MS Access Databases I need to transition to something that's both Linux and Windows friendly. MySQL maybe?

      We are adding TiVo like PVR functions to (probably) 2 of the machines on the LAN.
      Want to use MythTV but I'm afraid wife's learning curve means W2k for a while.

      I am learning to code MySQL, PHP, relearning CSS & HTML, and learning Apache which is part of the reason things need to be standardized. (File versions all the same.)
      Same same with my old databases. Don't want multiple versions.

      I was thinking setting up the NAS first was the best plan so I could dump all my files to one place while I work out the LTS but now I'm thinking I should dump everything to a temporary W2k machine, build the LTS first, and then dump the files to the LTS.
      Later I'll build a NAS for the remote backups using the drives in the temp W2k machine.

      It will be about a week before I start. Just ordered faster CPU's for the LTS last night and they obviously aren't here yet.

      .
      Mann-Made Global Warming.
      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

      -
      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

      - Dr Seuss
      -
      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
      -

      Comment


        #23
        Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

        Oh, I understand what you are telling me about the file systems now.

        ~ THANKS GUYS ~
        Mann-Made Global Warming.
        - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

        -
        Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

        - Dr Seuss
        -
        You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
        -

        Comment


          #24
          Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

          If you want to share files over a network, in a multi-OS environment, then maybe you need to set up a NFS share.

          http://kb.iu.edu/data/adux.html

          http://learnlinux.tsf.org.za/courses...dmin/ch12.html

          Comment


            #25
            Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

            So many new terms.

            NFS is apparently the file system used by LTS (Linux Terminal Server) so I will be using that anyway. - How convenient!
            -
            I ~think~ that means I can use the LTS for the local NAS functions too and then I only need a 'straight' NAS for the remote backups.

            .
            Mann-Made Global Warming.
            - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

            -
            Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

            - Dr Seuss
            -
            You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
            -

            Comment


              #26
              Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

              @ PCBONEZ: understood. You're migrating from WIndows to Linux and you want a NAS which connects with both OSes and it's not a pain to configure.
              I agree with Paul_S: NFS is the default network file system for Unix and Linux like SMB/CIFS is for Windows and, since you're migrating from Win to Linux, it makes sense to build a NAS you can enjoy in future.
              Linux includes everything you need for NFS shares, in Windows 2000 and XP Pro you need a free collections of command line programs and drivers, provided by Microsoft itself and called Windows Services for Unix: I never installed it but AFAIK the package contain a minimal NFS client which should be enough to move files to and from the NAS.
              If getting NFS work on Windows proves to be unpraticable, then you can install a ftp server on your NAS and use a ftp client such as Filezilla on Windows: it isn't as integrated in Linux as NFS but it works.

              Other questions: OpenOffice has a small database named Base (what an original name ), but I don't know if it can import all Acces databases; I'm not into HTPC so I can't help with MythTV, better asking help in dedicated wiki.
              Anyway better walking step by step: first set up a working NAS (it'll take you some time), then move on other tasks.

              Zandrax
              Have an happy life.

              Comment


                #27
                Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                For an easy MythTV system, I recommend using the Mythbuntu distro. It is Ubuntu with MythTV pre-installed, and almost pre-configured. The only thing that I disliked about it was the use of the XFCE desktop environment. That can be easily changed by installing the Gnome or KDE desktop from the Ubuntu repositories.

                Mythbuntu is completely compatable with Ubuntu, and uses the same repositories. In fact you can also install the Mythbuntu packages on a regular Ubuntu install.


                http://www.mythbuntu.org/

                Comment


                  #28
                  Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                  On the MythTV.
                  I don't understand the 'front end' vs 'back end' I keep seeing.
                  What are they talking about?
                  Is that inside one system or two systems? (or either/or?)

                  I have both a DVIco Fusion RT5 Gold and a Silicon Dust HD Homerun to figure out where to put.
                  The DVIco card will kick on the system to record which I like but I'm not sure yet which box I want kicking on all the time. Was thinking the wife's machine but she's a long way from Linux. I'm afraid if she's using it in Windows and something is supposed to get recorded (by say Ubuntu) she'll miss it so if I use that card in her system I'll set that up in W2k.
                  Then I can use mythTV for the HD Homerun through the LAN.
                  That thing has two inputs and something I want to experiment with is recording to two systems (one from each input) at the same time.
                  If I can make that work I don't think I'll need the DVIco card anymore.

                  .
                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                  -
                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                  - Dr Seuss
                  -
                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                  -

                  Comment


                    #29
                    Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                    I've used Ubuntu a few times via the Live CD version.
                    Good way to figure out if a problem is hardware or Windows and drivers.

                    .
                    Mann-Made Global Warming.
                    - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                    -
                    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                    - Dr Seuss
                    -
                    You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                    -

                    Comment


                      #30
                      Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                      I've never used MythTV, but in computer lingo, frontend and backend refer to a system with two separate programs: one working in the background doing the real work (backend) and another dealing with the user interface and presentation issues (frontend). An example is the MatLAB system, where you have a backend doing the calculations, and a frontend the users work with to tell the backend what to calculate.
                      There's usually a client - server relationship between frontend and backend. They can run on the same PC or in different machines.

                      I would guess MythTV has a backend dealing with the TV capture card issues, and a frontend dealing with the playback issues.

                      Comment


                        #31
                        Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                        What you first said is what I've always thought.
                        The way they talk they make it seem like it's always two separate systems.
                        That got me wondering if that's a 'requirement' or just how most of them are set up.
                        I suspect that's just how most of them are set up, but I thought I'd ask to be sure.

                        .
                        Mann-Made Global Warming.
                        - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                        -
                        Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                        - Dr Seuss
                        -
                        You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                        -

                        Comment


                          #32
                          Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                          That's right the frontend/backend is like a client/server.

                          The MythTV backend contains the database. It also would contain the capture card(s), or in the HD Homerun case, the setup of the card. So, then this is where all of the recorded programs are stored. Any post processing like marking for commercial skip, or transcoding, are also done on the backend.

                          The frontend is mainly the "GUI" for MythTV. It is used to watch "live" TV or the recordings. This is where you can schedule TV recordings using the program guide, which is stored on the backend. You can also play stored or streaming music and watch DVD's through the frontend.

                          The backend and frontend can be on seperate PCs, or on the same one (combined). You can have one combined sytem and one frontend only, connecting to the backend on the combined system. You can have as many frontends as you want. Just remember that you can only watch/record as many concurrent shows as you have tuners.

                          As for system specs. The only thing stressing the backend would be commercial skip marking and transcoding. If you plan on doing a lot of transcoding, then a larger CPU would be good. Otherwise a small CPU can be used for a backend only PC. The frontend needs a good video card, nVidia is really the only choice for Linux. This will offload some of the video processing from the CPU. A combined system should have both a decent processor and a good video card.

                          The last system that I built used an Asus Pundit P1-AH2 barebones. It isn't readily available anymore, but here's a link.
                          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16856110057

                          It has nVidia 6150 graphics, which works great for HDTV. I put in a AMD Athlon 64 X2 4600+ Windsor 2.4GHz Dual Core CPU, and a 500GB SATA drive. It is nice and small, so I put it in my kitchen.

                          Oh, I almost forgot. The best remote to use is the Windows Media Center remote/receiver. It also has a IR blaster to change channels on an external box.
                          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16880100851
                          Last edited by Paul S; 10-30-2008, 03:53 PM.

                          Comment


                            #33
                            Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                            That remote seems to be hard to find. i did find it at Tiger Direct.
                            http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...4435&CatId=358

                            Comment


                              #34
                              Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                              Remote work with Linux okay?
                              Mann-Made Global Warming.
                              - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                              -
                              Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                              - Dr Seuss
                              -
                              You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                              -

                              Comment


                                #35
                                Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                                Here's a site with many LIRC (Linux Infra-red Remote Control) config files.

                                http://lirc.sourceforge.net/remotes/

                                Comment


                                  #36
                                  Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                                  Think of the singing talent of alfalfa from little rascals.

                                  OHhhh WheRE oh WHeRE is my Cpu aaaaaat?
                                  Oh WHERE oh WherE cAN it BEeeEEeEEEeE?
                                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                                  -
                                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                                  - Dr Seuss
                                  -
                                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                  -

                                  Comment


                                    #37
                                    Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                                    Originally posted by PCBONEZ
                                    Think of the singing talent of alfalfa from little rascals.

                                    OHhhh WheRE oh WHeRE is my Cpu aaaaaat?
                                    Oh WHERE oh WherE cAN it BEeeEEeEEEeE?
                                    What's the matter? I remember Alfalfa and his squeaky, ouf of tune voice but I can't help you in looking for a cpu "lost" in your house ...

                                    Zandrax
                                    Have an happy life.

                                    Comment


                                      #38
                                      Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                                      Are you guys drunk or high? Have you been soldering a lot in an unventilated area?

                                      Comment


                                        #39
                                        Re: I wanna build a NAS - Peanuts in the gallery invited to comment.

                                        No,
                                        As previously mentioned I ordered a faster CPUs for the LTS.
                                        Not here yet.

                                        Not much faster actually but double the cache.

                                        ~

                                        You're supposed to have ventilation when you solder?

                                        .
                                        Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                        - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                                        -
                                        Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                                        - Dr Seuss
                                        -
                                        You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                        -

                                        Comment

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