Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

[joeeye]

Hi everybody glad to be here, first time posting... If I may can someone shed some light on what I have going on?

I diagnosed my problem to the motherboard, its an MSI MS-7093 Ver.1.0

I don't know much about caps, but I really would like to start learning so I'm happy I found this forum. I'm just a home enthusiast who has more running and non-running computers one should have in a small home.

This is the first mobo I came across that I don't see the caps are obviously blown or bad. everything points to the board is the problem.

In general when I do have a bad board with blown caps it gets tossed out, it seem to be such a shame if there is a fairly decent fix to be had.

But now with this very nice unit I have a problem with I wondered how are caps checked if no sign of failure? with an olhm meter? or do they have to come out to be checked?

thank you for any insight you would like to share.

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

There are many caps of all sizes and many of the same type, each group that are all the same kind of cap all measured the same reading with an olhm meter.

But there are 8 caps which are the KZE 6.3 v 1000uF, there are something like 4 of them out of the 8 that read the same resistance, and the rest of the other 4 have all different numbers of resistance. I feel like these few caps I found are not doing well.

Any help is welcome...

[Per Hansson]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

Caps can fail without any sign

It is more common for the lower farad units to fail with no sign at all

But some brands are known to usually not fail with any signs, like TEAPO

To test a cap you must use an ESR meter, see the "Test Equipment Usage, Techniques, and Reviews" forum section for more info

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

Thank you my friend, you don't know how much I appreciate appreciate this help very much.

I'm going to look into what you mentioned, the Techniques, and Reviews" forum section for more info.

I want to buy the ESR meter as well, I just have a simple meter that does DC V, AC V, Diode, Ohm, DCmA.

I thought I seen a section that sold items??

best wishes, Joe

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

why dont you give more info about your board problems so we can assist?

[Topcat]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

^
Yes. In particular, the brand of caps you have. Many crap cap brands are notorious for failure without showing any physical signs.

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

and use this thread, not another one....

[gdement]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

There are many caps of all sizes and many of the same type, each group that are all the same kind of cap all measured the same reading with an olhm meter.

But there are 8 caps which are the KZE 6.3 v 1000uF, there are something like 4 of them out of the 8 that read the same resistance, and the rest of the other 4 have all different numbers of resistance. I feel like these few caps I found are not doing well.

Any help is welcome...

The caps that have the same resistance reading are connected to each other in parallel, while the others are not. The only way they'd lose connection to each other is PCB damage or bad joints, not bad caps. They're probably not supposed to be connected.

KZE's are United Chemicon caps, they're very unlikely to fail. Have you tried alternate PSU's?

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

why dont you give more info about your board problems so we can assist?

Sorry, I'm doing 6 things at once here and I'm forgetting what I did, plus would you believe I never sent pictures to a forum before.. so I need to learn how to do that now.

Give me a moment, I'm trying this picture thing... thanks...

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

picture thing is here

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

Okay, here is some info, plus I understand what was said about different readings with the same cap, this is all great stuff I'm learning, thank you very much.

Please let me know what other info you would like to know, like do you want the specs on all the rest of the other caps? like their size, etc...

The mobo is a MSI (MS7093) also it says N1996 near the memory, the chip set is ATI IPX 400.... 939 socket with a 2.4 CPU.

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

caps look ok.
what is your issue exactly?
test your ram and report back

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

I'm sorry for coming across as a moron, let me tell you a little about me, I'm sometimes a little slow, but I'm am not retarded, I've been thru a liver transplant because of Wilsons Disease, I use to work in the insurance industries for many years, then I went into a coma because Wilsons Disease grabbed hold, etc... blah blah... So at times my meds I take for my back slow me down, this is why there are different posts all over the place...lol... and the sometimes dumb questions..lol..

But at least I still have all my marbles, I enjoy computers and have made it a very enjoyable hobby, I have more junk PC's to practice on, but with this one your are working on with me is my best one thats only about 1.5 years old.

So I really appreciate your help more than you may know, you guys are life savors, otherwise I'd toss out half of my items.

Well... enough of that...

Please let me know what other info you would like to know while I wait for my ESR meter, thanks, Joe

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

Let me ask this about ram, even if it was bad ram would I still get a responce as if its not plugged in? I thought with bad ram I'd at least hear beeps, or at least the power unit would come on? this is the first time I'm getting a unit acting like its not plugged in and I've tried a few other working power units. humm??

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

so your board is dead? no POST?

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

yeah, complelety stone cold dead, like not plugged in...

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

I by pass the turn on switch as well as checked it, everything checked out good.

Like I mentioned I have 3 good brand new power units I hooked up with no help.

I really feel like I covered all corners leading me to the mobo being the problem, I say mobo because I think the power unit gives a voltage signal to the mobo, then in turn other things kick in and start to work, like CPU fan, power unit fans turn, etc.... but I dont get any of that.

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

can you try cpu in a known working board?

[joeeye]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

I'll put my old 1.8 CPU 939 socket back in, because about 4 or 5 months ago I bought a used 2.4... good point there, thats the only thing I didn't try yet.

It will take a while because its all apart right now and the boards out....

[willawake]

Re: Can a Cap be bad and not look like it?

check the voltage across one of the caps near the cpu before you do. basically you want to see vcore output for the cpu is appropriate and not excessive in case the board is bad and kill your other cpu.