Polymer caps and retro video games

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Paranoid_Andy
    New Member
    • May 2021
    • 9
    • us

    #1

    Polymer caps and retro video games

    Hello everyone!

    I've been doing my best to educate myself on poly caps and when you should/shouldn't use them however my limited knowledge and experience makes me nervous about moving forward without asking the community. I know the ripple effect exists, but have no idea if it would apply to what I'm doing.

    I'm aware electrolytic capacitors can last a very long time but I'm looking for a 1 and done solution rather than recapping all my stuff when I'm old and cranky :P

    I would like to know if it's possible to cap any of the following items with poly caps.

    1. Game consoles:
    NES, SNES, Genesis, Sega CD, PC-Engine
    Playstation 1/Saturn(have built in power supplies)
    This site lists the capacitors used for each console. It may be helpful so I'm providing a link to it:
    https://console5.com/wiki/Category:Console

    2. Game carts:
    NES and SNES often use one or two 22uF 6.3v caps and Genesis/MD often use a 47uf 16v

    3. Arcade boards

    I would place my electronics ability at around 4/10 so feel free to simplify things for me. I won't be offended.

    Thank you for any help at all as I'm very interested in this.
    Last edited by Paranoid_Andy; 05-14-2021, 06:11 AM.
  • stj
    Great Sage 齊天大聖
    • Dec 2009
    • 31044
    • Albion

    #2
    Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

    arcade boards should not use polymer because most of the caps are in the audio circuits.

    playstation can use tantalum instead of electrolytics on the system board - the psu needs electrolytics.
    infact unless your dealing with over 470uf there is no point looking at polymers at all.

    Comment

    • rugger
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2005
      • 55

      #3
      Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

      There are modern equivalents of electrolytic capacitors from good brands for ANY capacitor you would find in any of the consoles you mentioned above.

      Only time I would suggest using polymer capacitors would be to replace the very low ESR caps that appeared on some later motherboards (Pentium 4 and Athlon XP motherboards) that are no longer manufactured.

      Otherwise there is always an equivalent to what you are looking for on the standard electrolytic market.

      Comment

      • Paranoid_Andy
        New Member
        • May 2021
        • 9
        • us

        #4
        Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

        Hey thanks for the reply Stj.

        That makes sense about the audio circuits and the PSU needing electrolytics.

        Is there an explanation somewhere about why over 470uF doesn't need polymers? I ask because I've seen a few posts from people that have done recap jobs using polymers for caps with much lower ratings so I'm wondering why.
        Here and here:
        https://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=20230

        https://www.arcade-projects.com/thre...acement.12296/

        Hi Rugger,

        I'm wondering, do you mean there are other types of solid state caps besides polymer that can do what I need?

        My main goal is to find a solution that will be permanent or at least last the rest of my life. I don't want to have to recap my consoles/games ever again, if that's even possible.

        Thank you for the replies!

        Comment

        • stj
          Great Sage 齊天大聖
          • Dec 2009
          • 31044
          • Albion

          #5
          Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

          i meant under 470 doesnt need polymers - mostly because you can use tantalum.

          Comment

          • rugger
            Senior Member
            • Feb 2005
            • 55

            #6
            Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

            Originally posted by Paranoid_Andy

            Hi Rugger,

            I'm wondering, do you mean there are other types of solid state caps besides polymer that can do what I need?

            My main goal is to find a solution that will be permanent or at least last the rest of my life. I don't want to have to recap my consoles/games ever again, if that's even possible.

            Thank you for the replies!
            Nah, I mean that you shouldn't be changing from standard electrolytic caps to different types ... in virtually all cases.

            In fact, if you were to pull the vast majority of the capacitors out of things in your collection, you are likely to find that they are all still good, with few exceptions (to the specs of the original capacitors of course, modern electrolytic caps tend to be higher performance than those of the 80's and 90's) It would only be devices with particularly poorly made capacitors, or those under high stress where you actually see these capacitors dying.

            Just definitely note that solid polymer electrolytic capacitors are not the answer either. They can age and die just like aluminum electrolytic capacitors. Same with tantalums ... they like to randomly short and brilliantly explode.

            Comment

            • Paranoid_Andy
              New Member
              • May 2021
              • 9
              • us

              #7
              Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

              Thanks for the update guys.

              I've heard on several occasions about retro capacitors leaking and drying up on these 30-40 year old consoles but from what your saying it sounds as though that only should be happening if the capacitor is of a lower build quality.

              I think my final question is, if you were in my position and you were looking to replace old faulty caps with ones that you felt would last a very long time, what type and brand would you personally go with for the games and consoles?

              Thank you again for all the help!

              Comment

              • stj
                Great Sage 齊天大聖
                • Dec 2009
                • 31044
                • Albion

                #8
                Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

                well after 40 years any cap will fail - the rubber bung will rot even if nothing else happens.

                Comment

                • rugger
                  Senior Member
                  • Feb 2005
                  • 55

                  #9
                  Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

                  Originally posted by Paranoid_Andy
                  I think my final question is, if you were in my position and you were looking to replace old faulty caps with ones that you felt would last a very long time, what type and brand would you personally go with for the games and consoles?
                  Panasonic FR and FS series capacitors will do just fine. Inexpensive and good range and availability.

                  What is available in your local market may be different.

                  I'd replace general purpose filtering capacitors with low ESR capacitors where ever I find them.

                  I would also check and test capacitors before replacing them. Capacitors that look and test fine on circuits that are still working shouldn't be messed with. Changing things on any board with a soldering iron is not risk free. Always a risk of burning things and lifting traces, or putting a capacitor in the wrong way, or making a capacitor change that upsets the circuit.

                  Comment

                  • rugger
                    Senior Member
                    • Feb 2005
                    • 55

                    #10
                    Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

                    Originally posted by stj
                    well after 40 years any cap will fail - the rubber bung will rot even if nothing else happens.
                    Yet, there are plenty of electrolytic capacitors out there, 40 years old, in good working condition.

                    Comment

                    • brethin
                      Badcaps Legend
                      • Dec 2008
                      • 1907
                      • USA

                      #11
                      Re: Polymer caps and retro video games

                      It all depends on the item was stored and used, I have a few of the first game consoles that still use tubes for gods sakes and they work fine, or caps don't die they get killed.

                      Comment

                      Related Topics

                      Collapse

                      • eryjus
                        Heathkit IO-4205 Power Supply Caps
                        by eryjus
                        Hello,

                        First, I am a complete noob with high voltage stuff. I'm learning, but I need help by someone looking over my shoulder.

                        I recently came into posession of a Heathkit IO-4205 5MHz Dual Trace Oscilloscope. The documentation is copyright 1978. I'm told it works.

                        I opened it up to check the caps before I applied power, and found the following black caps and wanted to know what they were. They are on the power supply board. I was able to read the name and model and came up with, "Nytronics 162J-1, 0.1uF, 20% tolerance, 2000VDC."
                        ...
                        05-10-2023, 11:21 AM
                      • EFritz20
                        [Retro] Asus A7N8X Deluxe Rev2.0 Power issue related to caps?
                        by EFritz20
                        Hello all,

                        I have had this motherboard for a long time and started trying to use it again.
                        As alot of you know its a Socket A(462) motherboard from the bad caps era.
                        Mine contains Rubycon MBZ 3300uf as VRM in and output. The caps look fine from the outside but the board itself has this problem;

                        If i turn the power off (completely unplugged for >30min) and then turn it on, the board will post just fine and i'm able to go into BIOS, modify it, save it and actually boot from it. Earlier I was able to install Windows on it, but now, just before it goes into...
                        08-14-2021, 07:10 AM
                      • momaka
                        Casing Power MPT-301 [PCB ATX9806b-p REV: A3]
                        by momaka
                        This one should make @Pentium4 smile (if he is still reading BCN forums) – I got a new old stock / open box Casing Power MPT-301 PSU on eBay for $4 total.


                        Yes, it’s a very generic-looking box, but the manufacturer isn’t (at least not back in the days), which is…

                        Macron Power Technology Co. LTD.

                        Let’s look at the PSU itself.



                        The shell/case also appears quite generic, like many “sold-with-the-PC-case” units. However, the shell is well-formed and has decent steel thickness. In terms of...
                        06-02-2021, 10:05 PM
                      • SwedishDiesel
                        Dell Optiplex GX260 - Advice Needed for Polymodding Motherboard
                        by SwedishDiesel
                        Howdy folks,

                        I have an Optiplex GX260 that blew a couple of those troublesome Nichicon HM series (ultra low ESR) electrolytic capacitors. Because said caps are obsolete, they are pretty much impossible to find on the market; I did find a listing for some but I believe they are counterfeit. I feel the easiest thing to do would be to replace all the blown caps with polymer ones. I am by no means an expert in electronics, and I've found a fair bit of conflicting information, so any guidance or confirmation would be greatly appreciated. While from a practical standpoint it's not worth...
                        10-30-2021, 12:47 AM
                      • rewease
                        Replacement for the Siemens Bakelite caps in an early 1980s SMPS
                        by rewease
                        Hi everyone,

                        There actually was a time when early SMPS and late bakelite housed electrolytic caps coexisted in high end industrial gear. A friend of mine just got himself a CNC milling machine form that time with its first set of now 41 year old caps still installed in the PSU... and it's malfunctioning.

                        Two of the caps have already leaked slightly onto the board. I have not desoldered or measured any so far but they should qualify for replacement.

                        Now I'm wondering what to put in there as a replacement. First idea was state of the art low-ESR Nippon KY,...
                        09-17-2023, 12:53 AM
                      • Loading...
                      • No more items.
                      Working...