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    ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

    I'm working on a ViewSonic n2750w with this weird image distortion. The best way I can describe it is the image has artifacts, but these artifacts fall into a very uniform grid pattern. But the interesting thing is, if you pull up the TVs on screen display, the OSD is crystal clear with no distortion. I've attached two pictures showing the TV with and without the OSD. I've tried almost every input on this TV; coax, S-Video, composite, VGA, and DVI. The distortion occurs on every input I tried.

    I opened the TV to have a look. I included is a picture of the back of the TV. In the center is the video processing board. To the right is the power board, and lower right is an audio board. This TV does have CCFLs, the inverter board is not visible in this picture, it's located underneath the piece of metal holding all these circuit boards.

    I know the power and the backlights aren't the problem, so I'm ruling out the power and inverter boards. Also, since the OSD has no distortion issues, I'm ruling out the panel itself as well as the LVDS connector. So I believe the problem to be somewhere on the video board.

    The service manual for this TV included a helpful block diagram on the video board circuitry (also attached). The various inputs (in purple) are not displaying correctly. The OSD comes from the MCU and that's working (marked in green). Also, the LVDS to the panel is fine (blue). So I believe the problem is in the scaler/de-interlacer area of the circuit (red).

    The video board has something like 50 caps on it. I tested the ESR of every cap. Attached is a table of every cap on the video board. The ones in green are good. The ones in red are too high, and the ones in orange are right at where most charts consider the cap to be bad. I did my best when identifying the cap number; sometimes it's hard to tell if the printing on the circuit board is for the electrolytic or a nearby surface mount cap.


    I've ordered replacement caps for all the ones I marked orange and red, although they haven't arrived yet. But my question is, has anyone run into a video problem like this before? Any thoughts if changing a few caps will solve this problem? Some other ideas I had include reflowing the solder on some of the ICs on the video board, also checking and, if necessary, replacing the oscillators on the video board.
    Attached Files

    #2
    Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

    Originally posted by Freezer View Post
    The video board has something like 50 caps on it. I tested the ESR of every cap.
    Wow, personally I would have never went through all that effort to desolder and test every cap.

    I count 7 voltage regulators. My standard test procedure.

    To test a voltage regulator (circled in yellow),

    1) Set your multimeter (if manual range) to 20V DC.

    2) Put your black probe on a ground screw (circled in black). Leave it there the entire time. This is your ground.

    3) Put your red probe on each of the pins including the "cut" pin, but ignore the "fat" tab. The fat tab is "up" or "north". Number the pins left to right.

    4) You should have 3 readings per regulator.

    5) Report them like so along with the part number of the IC.

    U100
    part # AS1117-33
    part # 0707
    pin 1 = 0.0
    pin 2 = 3.3
    pin 3 = 5.0
    Attached Files
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    Comment


      #3
      Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

      Did you try to push little bit or knock with screwdriver handle the one IC with black heatsink? It looks like some BGA chip underneath and it might need reflow.

      When TV is displaying a picture, knock on black heatsink with (plastic) screwdriver handle, try on other chips and memory as well and see if it makes any difference on TV screen. Press on it little bit, press on the board itself, try to bend it slightly (not too much, and do not touch leads) and see if it makes any difference. If not, you can 99% rule out cold solders or BGA problem.

      Cheers,

      Suad
      Attached Files

      Comment


        #4
        Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

        Originally posted by retiredcaps View Post
        Wow, personally I would have never went through all that effort to desolder and test every cap.
        Yeah, I wouldn't go through that much effort either. I tested the ESR of the caps without removing them which, as I understand, is fine except for caps in parallel.

        When I get a chance I'll report the voltage readings of the regulators you pointed out.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

          Sorry it took so long to reply on this thread, I was on vacation.

          retiredcaps - I've had a chance to get the voltage readings you requested. I have the service manual, so instead of trying to read part numbers off of chips I grabbed the part number from the service manual.

          Chip: I101
          Part: SI-8050SD 5V/3A
          pin1: 12.073
          pin2: 5.097
          pin3: 0
          pin4: 4.964
          pin5: 2.370

          Chip: I103
          Part: SI-8050SD 5V/3A
          pin1: 12.081
          pin2: 5.033
          pin3: 0
          pin4: 4.982
          pin5: 2.377

          Chip: I104
          Part: AIC1084-33CM
          pin1: 0
          pin2: 3.297
          pin3: 4.856

          Chip: I127
          Part: AIC1084-25CM
          pin1: 0
          pin2: 2.484
          pin3: 4.790

          Chip: I107
          Part: CM1117SCM-3.3V
          pin1: 0
          pin2: 3.283
          pin3: 4.947

          Chip: I117
          Part: AP1117E-3.3V
          pin1: 0
          pin2: 3.276
          pin3: 4.919

          Chip: I139
          Part: L78M08CDT
          pin1: 8.72
          pin2: 0
          pin3: 12.05

          I'm no expert on this stuff, but these voltages look correct to me.


          scokljat - I tried pushing on the various larger chips on the board while the TV was on. It did not correct the video image. I guess it could still be cracked solder joints, and I plan to try reflowing the solder eventually.


          My original idea was to replace the caps with high ESR values. But I'm not sure how realistic that is. I received the new caps and I went to change out the bad ones. So far I've done one cap, and it took me close to 30 minutes. Getting the old cap out was difficult. The cap was out in less than a minute, but the negative lead hole was plugged with solder and I could not get it cleared. I tried everything at my disposal. In the end I had to hold my iron on the joint as I pushed the new cap through. There is so much copper on this board I can't wick it up. Even cranking up the heat to close to 800 on my Hakko solder station didn't work. I'm afraid to continue for fear of toasting the board. If anyone has a suggestion on how to desolder caps on difficult boards like this please let me know.

          Comment


            #6
            Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

            I've had up and down success pre heating the board with a heat gun. I still have to plunge a needle through the hole after i remove the cap. It's a royal pain as you've seen with the one cap you've done.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

              Originally posted by Freezer View Post
              Chip: I139
              Part: L78M08CDT
              pin1: 8.72
              pin2: 0
              pin3: 12.05

              but these voltages look correct to me
              1) Check pin 1 and 3 again. I think you mis-numbered them (see page 3 of datasheet). Pin 1 is input, 2 is ground, 3 is output.

              2) Regardless, the part number and datasheet

              http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datashe...8M08CDT-1.html

              suggest the correct output is 8V (see page 6). The minimum is 7.7V and the maximum is 8.3V or roughly a +/- 3% variation. I normally use a +/- 1% guideline.

              3) At 8.72, if not a typo or mis-reading, then it is 9% ((8.72-8)/8) out. So this voltage regulator is likely bad and could be causing your distortion because too much voltage is being output.

              4) 54 cents + digikey shipping price to find out if I'm right

              http://www.digikey.com/product-detai...06-1-ND/586206

              5) Mr Bill knows what I'm talking about regarding "but these voltages look correct to me".
              Last edited by retiredcaps; 07-22-2012, 11:55 PM.
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                #8
                Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                Originally posted by Freezer View Post
                Chip: I101
                Part: SI-8050SD 5V/3A
                pin1: 12.073
                BTW, how the heck are you getting a reading of 12.073 from your BK Precision 2709B? It is a 6,600 count multimeter so I'm confused how you are getting 12,000 count?

                Are you using a Fluke 87V in 20,000 count mode?
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                  #9
                  Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                  Originally posted by Freezer View Post

                  I have the service manual, so instead of trying to read part numbers off of chips I grabbed the part number from the service manual.
                  They dont always use the same parts as it says in the manual?
                  Please upload pictures using attachment function when ask for help on the repair
                  http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=39740

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                    Originally posted by retiredcaps View Post
                    BTW, how the heck are you getting a reading of 12.073 from your BK Precision 2709B? It is a 6,600 count multimeter so I'm confused how you are getting 12,000 count?
                    No I didn't get a new meter, I guess the problem is I have an old brain. I looked at the piece of paper where I jotted down the numbers and I can totally see how I thought some scribbles were numbers. Since I made that mistake, I went back and took all new set of readings. Everything was the same as what I reported above. For the 12.XXX readings, just drop the last digit.

                    As for I139, I'm definitely getting 8.7V from pin 1 and 12V from pin 3, which doesn't make sense when you look at the datasheet. So the part on my set must be slightly different. The exact lettering on that part is "78M08 6K1DL508" I think I agree, 8.7V is a bit high for 8V. I think I'm going to try and locate the correct part and try replacing that regulator. Unfortunately that chip is attached to a rather large piece of copper. But I'll try my heat gun to get it off.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                      Originally posted by Freezer View Post
                      But I'll try my heat gun to get it off.
                      I use a heat gun on low heat to remove these types and I use Kapton tape to cover all the surrounding components so they are not damaged by the heat from the heat gun. With this method, it takes about 30 seconds to remove.
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                        #12
                        Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                        I ordered a replacement voltage regulator from digikey. Every replacement part had the input and output pins reversed from the one in this TV. So I ended up soldering in the part backwards and connected the pins with wires (see picture). Now the voltage is down to 7.9 which is much better. However, the TV still has the image distortion.

                        I decided to replace more of the bad caps. The first cap I replaced was connected to a huge ground plane which made it difficult to remove. So I replaced all the bad caps that were easy to work on. But still the image problem. So I tried reflowing the solder on the surface mount chips, but still has image problems.

                        If anyone has an idea I'm definitely open to suggestions. But I think I may stop working on this board and see if I can find a cheap replacement. A few weeks ago a replacement board sold on eBay for $25.
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                          Assume AD board is good after you change the cap & regulator.

                          then you need check the panel T-con board regulator voltage and measure the Gamma voltage

                          like

                          http://www.shopjimmy.com/cmo-35-d003791-t-con-board.htm

                          Maybe just the one of gamma voltage error cause this problem.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: ViewSonic n2750w - weird image distortion

                            Originally posted by Duncanbest View Post
                            Assume AD board is good after you change the cap & regulator.

                            then you need check the panel T-con board regulator voltage and measure the Gamma voltage
                            I guess it could be the T-con board, but since the on-screen display has absolutely no image distortion, I'm assuming the problem is somewhere on the main video board. But I am out of ideas on the main video board so it never hurts to check the T-con board.

                            Comment

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