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Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

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    Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

    Hi, I'm a technician as hobby, I repaired several yamaha keyboards in the keyboard unit (some key doesn't sound or sound too much, etc.).

    I'm in trouble with a never seen case regarding a Yamaha tyros 2 61 keys. The problem is that all the couple the D# - A keys sound only the first time I press them. The second time I press them they don't sound anymore. The first time, they sound with a sustain too. The D# and A are on the same wires in the matrix scan as you can see from the attached schematics. I found a video in which the problem is as similar as in my case.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKascHbPazA&t=707s
    (from 4:05 couple of keys F#-C)

    In the past I repaired several keyboards with a persistent couple of keys on the same scan wire (eg D#-A or C#-G and so on) that didn't sound. The fault was persistent, they didn't sound the first time I pressed them. In that case the solution was to check continuity on the circuit scan, from the flat connectors to the single PCB traces related to that keys.

    Now the things are a bit different, there is no true interruption in the circuit (the first time they sound) because the first time they sound. Anyway I checked the entire D#-A circuit up to the matrix scan board connector and all seem OK. I noticed a lot of oxidation on some soldered connector pins, but it seems to be only an aesthetic issue because electrically speaking all seems OK.
    The only think I understood is that connecting only the MKH-D part of the keyboard the problem persists. The EMKS board (the matrix scanner) is directly connected to the MKH-D board. The MKH-D board is connected to the MK61-L by means of a FLAT cable, but this is not the problem as I said before.
    Someone had a similar problem and solved it?

    I have not re-soldered yet the pin cable on the PCB as in the video because all seems ok electrically (I checked the continuity from the connector pin to the microcontroller’s pin too) and to avoid to do a mess due to the very short distance pin.


    Thanks a lot.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by daigs; 02-02-2023, 03:11 PM.

    #2
    Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

    without reading any of that, i'm going to say you need to put it in diagnostic mode and do a rom test.
    yamaha stuff is notorious on this forum for rom failures.

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

      OK STJ I will try and report.

      In the meantime I checked all the 61 line's resistence from the 5V to each key's diodes and they results correctly all 33 Kohm as in the schematics

      So, increasingly strange...

      Regards.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

        can you post the complete service manual?

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

          Whenever I have seen odd resistance on an IC's input pin(s), it was due to the IC getting zapped by ESD. The input circuit inside being damaged.
          Keyboards can get nailed with ESD and this Yamaha has no extra protection.
          Otherwise, all that is left as a cause might be the matrix diodes, if they are leaky but their path is not to VCC or GND.

          I would guess the IC is damaged and maybe add resistors to overcome the leakage. ESD damage can also get worse with time I find due to ion migration. So it might fix it for a short time.

          cross-post here: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair...canning-board/

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

            I second redwire’s idea with the IC. They surely can behave like that. Matter effect in can even work for an hour and then kick out. Had that happening before. First you got to find the faulty board then get down and fix the issue.
            I don’t really buy the matrix board being at fault, but hey… that can be tested or swapped.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Yamaha Tyros strange keys issue

              After cutting several paths on the PCB and measuring the resistance, turns out that some vias were oxided. That oxide had produced a pseudo-layer of partial conductive material between signal and ground, creating a no stable recognition by the scanner. At the same time the ground layer near to the vias was oxided too and the copper was starting to lose the solder mask.

              Now all is OK.

              I hope that fix will last for some time, because some vias were hidden by the top board and I worked not seeing well.

              Thank you for your support!

              Comment

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