Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

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  • ohmmy
    Senior Member
    • Jan 2013
    • 182
    • USA

    #21
    Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

    Originally posted by tom66
    Think this is the device


    If it's working, and conducting, voltage between B-E (outer two pins) should be approx 0.7V.

    ...and it's not a 1117; replacing it with one may cause damage...

    Is VSS definitely positive? I suppose it could be what SAMSUNG call VCOM. It would not cause jumpy image.

    Jumpy image could perhaps be caused by VGH/VON or VGL/VOFF going bad.
    Weird that a 1117 caused no issues and same symptom?

    Actually the VSS was a negative voltage -7.43v

    What is VGH/VON VGL/OFF?

    Comment

    • tom66
      EVs Rule
      • Apr 2011
      • 32560
      • UK

      #22
      Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

      VSS therefore must be VOFF/VGL as I thought. So -7.5V approx is fine for that. Try and find the +20V to +30V supply. It will be on there somewhere.
      Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
      For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

      Comment

      • ohmmy
        Senior Member
        • Jan 2013
        • 182
        • USA

        #23
        Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

        Originally posted by tom66
        VSS therefore must be VOFF/VGL as I thought. So -7.5V approx is fine for that. Try and find the +20V to +30V supply. It will be on there somewhere.
        Would it be labeled something?
        Last edited by ohmmy; 11-21-2013, 05:01 PM.

        Comment

        • tom66
          EVs Rule
          • Apr 2011
          • 32560
          • UK

          #24
          Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

          Yes.
          Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
          For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

          Comment

          • ohmmy
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2013
            • 182
            • USA

            #25
            Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

            Found these:

            VONE: 27.6v
            VOFF: -11.3v
            VSS: -7.43v
            HAVVD: 7.50v

            All tested with original N2 diode back in

            Comment

            • ohmmy
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2013
              • 182
              • USA

              #26
              Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

              Any good? Also, why can't I find more than one tab bond on this. Doesn't make sense there'd only be one for the entire panel

              Comment

              • tom66
                EVs Rule
                • Apr 2011
                • 32560
                • UK

                #27
                Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                Those look reasonable.
                I'm guessing it's an unrepairable fault.
                As for one bond, it's a new direction LCD TVs are going in. All the panel drivers (all 4,098 columns) fit into one bond now to save money.
                Previously I've seen as few as two, never just one until now.
                Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

                Comment

                • ohmmy
                  Senior Member
                  • Jan 2013
                  • 182
                  • USA

                  #28
                  Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                  Ah. Why do you think hitting that diode with the freeze spray caused the image to attempt to go normal?

                  Comment

                  • tom66
                    EVs Rule
                    • Apr 2011
                    • 32560
                    • UK

                    #29
                    Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                    It's not a diode, it's an NPN transistor. Perhaps you were cooling the tab too? I forgot about that, it is odd. Would help to get a scope out and check the various signals.
                    Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                    For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

                    Comment

                    • ohmmy
                      Senior Member
                      • Jan 2013
                      • 182
                      • USA

                      #30
                      Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                      I directly cooled the tab too and picture was only affected by cooling the transistor. Don't have a scope

                      Comment

                      • tom66
                        EVs Rule
                        • Apr 2011
                        • 32560
                        • UK

                        #31
                        Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                        What happens to VOFF and VONE if you cool that transistor?
                        Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                        For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

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                        • ohmmy
                          Senior Member
                          • Jan 2013
                          • 182
                          • USA

                          #32
                          Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                          VOFF: -18.54 when sprayed and quickly goes up and stabilizes to -11.37
                          VONE: stays the same when sprayed at 27.6V

                          Voltage drop across the transistor from B to E is -0.6v

                          Also when the voltage at the base of that transistor drops to -6.67v is when picture is 85% better (when freeze sprayed)

                          Comment

                          • ohmmy
                            Senior Member
                            • Jan 2013
                            • 182
                            • USA

                            #33
                            Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                            I'm tempted to try adding a resistor before the base of the transistor to drop the voltage down to around -5v and see if that gives a better picture? Lol

                            Comment

                            • newtothis
                              Badcaps Legend
                              • Mar 2013
                              • 1556
                              • england

                              #34
                              Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                              Its worth a try

                              Comment

                              • ohmmy
                                Senior Member
                                • Jan 2013
                                • 182
                                • USA

                                #35
                                Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                How would I calculate right value resistor to use?

                                Comment

                                • newtothis
                                  Badcaps Legend
                                  • Mar 2013
                                  • 1556
                                  • england

                                  #36
                                  Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                  Oh I am sorry I am having a bad day and not thinking.

                                  A resistor will not work... Resistors reduce current not voltage.

                                  To drop voltage you need a regulator

                                  Comment

                                  • tom66
                                    EVs Rule
                                    • Apr 2011
                                    • 32560
                                    • UK

                                    #37
                                    Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                    Actually a resistor could work by loading down that output. But I would only consider that a temp fix and replacing that transistor is likely the permanent solution.
                                    So, -18V, picture poor (expected: very lucky LCD panel doesn't fry!) and -11V, picture OK? Or other way around?
                                    Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                                    For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

                                    Comment

                                    • ohmmy
                                      Senior Member
                                      • Jan 2013
                                      • 182
                                      • USA

                                      #38
                                      Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                      Other way around, -18v when it's cooled and the picture is trying to rejoin into one image

                                      Is that transistor definitely bad? I measured -0.6v across base and emitter

                                      Comment

                                      • tom66
                                        EVs Rule
                                        • Apr 2011
                                        • 32560
                                        • UK

                                        #39
                                        Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                        That is well beyond what I would expect for most LCD panels! It is possible this Samsung does it differently but I would be surprised.

                                        If you have an NPN through hole transistor lying around you could probably do a quick check and put it in place of the existing one. Link to the datasheet and we can see if it will work.
                                        Please do not PM me with questions! Questions via PM will not be answered. Post on the forums instead!
                                        For service manual, schematic, boardview (board view), datasheet, cad - use our search.

                                        Comment

                                        • ohmmy
                                          Senior Member
                                          • Jan 2013
                                          • 182
                                          • USA

                                          #40
                                          Re: Samsung LN32D403E4D - Jumpy/Double Image

                                          So I have no idea what happened, but now the picture is way worse!

                                          The gamma chip is super hot to the touch now but the measured voltages from it aren't all over the place, they give steady lows/highs

                                          If I cool that same npn transistor now, there's no affect. Here's a pic
                                          Attached Files

                                          Comment

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