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    Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

    ^ Exactly!

    Too many people online simply just shout numbers without any scientific evidence whatsoever.

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      Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

      Originally posted by momaka View Post
      Maybe whoever was in control of the conveyor speed for the assembly line accidentally bumped the knob to "high speed" and then the workers tried to compensate by installing everything quickly?
      i think u just described exactly the kind of thing that goes on in a chinese sweatshop!
      Originally posted by RJARRRPCGP View Post
      A Core 2 Quad, OTOH, exponentially goes up in watts when OC'ed, 250 W easily for the processor alone at 3.3!

      Easily like an OC'ed FX, if not more! In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if a 65 nm Quad makes my FX look like a green freak! LOL!

      The OC expert folks say 250 W+ easily for CPU alone with 1.4 V Vcore at only 3.3. So, that would easily mean at least a 350 W PSU, if not a 400 W PSU. (And that's with a video card that don't use a power plug, such as a GeForce GT 640 and GeForce GTX 750)
      i think their measurement might have been at the wall with a wattmeter which is a meaurement from the ac side and does not take into account the inefficiency of the psu.

      a common mistake is them thinking e.g. a 500w psu means 500w max from the ac side which is wrong... its supposed to be 500w max output from the dc side not the input ac side.

      their calculation of the cpu's power consumption is also prone to a degree of inaccuracy from trying to reverse engineer how much power the other components (mobo, ram, hdd, gpu) are using and they might have missed out a few other things in their calculation.

      i still think those cpu wattage calcs (where u input the stock clocks, voltages and wattage) are a good estimation of cpu power consumption assuming u dont go crazy with the overclocks and overvoltages till u cause the cpu's internal capacitance to totally screw up the tdp calculation!
      Last edited by ChaosLegionnaire; 01-01-2016, 11:58 PM.

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        Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

        Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
        i think u just described exactly the kind of thing that goes on in a chinese sweatshop!
        Well, I was thinking either that... or someone was playing that Macarena song on the radio / over the PA while the workers were on the assembly line.
        Explains why the components appeared all "dancy" on the board.

        Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
        i still think those cpu wattage calcs (where u input the stock clocks, voltages and wattage) are a good estimation of cpu power consumption assuming u dont go crazy with the overclocks and overvoltages till u cause the cpu's internal capacitance to totally screw up the tdp calculation!
        I don't know about that. In my experience, those calculators always grossly over-estimate the power needed.
        Personally, I prefer to go to cpu-world.com and look up the TDP spec of the CPU I am using, then do a bunch more calcualtions (such as, assume only 90% efficiency for CPU VRM), add 5-15 Watts for RAM, some more for HDD, and if there is to be a add-on graphics card, I try to look up the TDP of that too. That's it. If the CPU is to be over-clocked, I simply look up the CPU spec that is from the same family and has the same core but higher clock, and use the TDP spec from that. Easy! And a lot more accurate.
        Last edited by momaka; 01-02-2016, 03:50 PM.

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          Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

          Originally posted by RJARRRPCGP View Post
          ... The OC expert folks say 250 W+ easily for CPU alone with 1.4 V Vcore at only 3.3 ...
          Here's to your "experts":

          . . .

          http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu...locking_8.html
          Last edited by TELVM; 01-02-2016, 06:10 PM.

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            Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

            Lol, I just noticed the CPU glued to its heatsink by rock-hard thermal compound, being pulled from locked socket

            Hate when that happens…rotating the heatsink while CPU is still in socket often helps.
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              Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

              Premier DR-8460BTX

              SB3045ST @ 5V

              SB1060CT @ 12V

              S10C45C @ 3.3V

              2x 13007 transistors

              33 sized transformer

              2x 330uF 200V ANODIA caps

              2N65 for 5vsb

              4 diode treatment for AC rectification

              Incomplete EMI input filter

              Tiny heatsinks

              1x1000uF for every important output

              Not a single coil for ripple filtering

              Tiny toroid coils

              Tiny parts everywhere

              But it works and none of the caps are bulging... The fan is moving at full speed. This thing was buried in dust and tobacco residue...
              Attached Files
              Last edited by goodpsusearch; 05-07-2016, 06:12 PM.

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                Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                Originally posted by goodpsusearch View Post
                Premier DR-8460BTX
                SB3045ST @ 5V
                SB1060CT @ 12V
                S10C45C @ 3.3V
                ... And yet the label says the "dual" 12V rail can handle 14 + 16 Amps . Where the fuck do they see that at with a 10 Amp rectifier?

                At least they put a nice big label with bright red letters. Probably to warn users: "Warning! This PSU is dangerous!".

                Originally posted by goodpsusearch View Post
                2x 13007 transistors
                33 sized transformer
                2x 330uF 200V ANODIA caps
                2N65 for 5vsb
                4 diode treatment for AC rectification
                Incomplete EMI input filter
                Tiny heatsinks
                Typical Deer/L&C.
                Don't forget those big, low-resistance dummy load resistors on the output. I see the one for the 5V rail is 20 Ohms. Should keep the output caps nice and toasty.

                Originally posted by goodpsusearch View Post
                1x1000uF for every important output
                Not a single coil for ripple filtering
                Tiny toroid coils
                Tiny parts everywhere
                Woah DUDE, chill. Let's just go surfing! No, DUDE, not surfing the internet. I meant surfing those huge AWESOME ripple tidal waves from the PSU output. Yeah, now wouldn't that be TOTALLY RAD DUDE?
                /goofy_surfer_voice


                Originally posted by goodpsusearch View Post
                But it works...
                Typical Deer/L&C. x2

                I guess they are dependable PSUs - that is, you can always depend on them to kill your hardware.

                The case looks nice, though. Could be used to house the guts from another PSU if needed.
                Last edited by momaka; 05-07-2016, 11:18 PM.

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                  Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                  Originally posted by TELVM View Post
                  That was for 65nm quads. The 45 nms are much better.
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                    Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                    the Q9505 is a 45nm CPU...

                    And you can't do anything about physics...
                    If you increase the voltage, even a little bit, the powerconsumption skyrockets...

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                      Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                      And here is a Micro ATX (SFX) 1.3 which came with a Deluxe case so im guessing the PSU is also made by them because there is no UL code.

                      All caps seem to be Chengx but at least they are rated 105degrees.
                      No heatshrink anywhere, a probably underpowered 10A schottky, the fuse is soldered directly to the board, but at least there seems to be a PWM IC CG8010DX16 supporting UVP/OVP
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by Viperel; 05-12-2016, 10:59 PM.

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                        Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                        450W? For how many milliseconds?
                        PeteS in CA

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                          Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                          Originally posted by PeteS in CA View Post
                          450W? For how many milliseconds?
                          Actually,that might be another 0W PSU,as there are absolutely no PI coils (or ANY SPACE printed on the PCB for them,let alone holes),thus it won't do a watt in spec. Good only for smashing.
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                            Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                            Originally posted by PeteS in CA View Post
                            450W? For how many milliseconds?
                            I tried for the fun of it to hook up an 80W/12V bulb and the +12v rail showed 10.1V

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                              Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                              It's +5V heavy, you should load the rail as well. At least couple amps.
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                                Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                From the looks of those pictures, looks like the black Line wire is going to Neutral and the white neutral wire is going to Line. Be careful with that one and don't get electrocuted - or start a fire!
                                Old proverb say.........If you shoot at nothing, you will hit nothing (George Henry 10-14-11)

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                                  Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                  Originally posted by Behemot View Post
                                  It's +5V heavy, you should load the rail as well. At least couple amps.
                                  Well the same 80W bulb takes the 5V line down to 4.8v which is actually in the +/- 5% specs but i would not trust it hooked to a PC.

                                  Comment


                                    Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                    Originally posted by Viperel View Post
                                    Well the same 80W bulb takes the 5V line down to 4.8v which is actually in the +/- 5% specs but i would not trust it hooked to a PC.
                                    Ay, that PSU is no good then - not for powering a computer anyways. Maybe okay for playing with LEDs or small motors that don't care about smooth voltage. After all, those caps on the output are indeed too small, as Dan81 pointed out.

                                    Originally posted by Dan81 View Post
                                    Good only for smashing.
                                    Well, not exactly. There are still good parts in that power supply. They are just not good enough to make a functional PC PSU. But if you take the "crappy" schottky rectifiers from this PSU and put them in say, a small 10-20 Watt power adapter that uses regular diodes for the rectification, you would get a lot less heat and much better efficiency. Or, if you're game, you can build your own custom SMPS for something like an amplifier, like our other fellow Romanian, Th3_uN1Qu3, did many ages ago :
                                    https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10491

                                    Originally posted by everell View Post
                                    From the looks of those pictures, looks like the black Line wire is going to Neutral and the white neutral wire is going to Line. Be careful with that one and don't get electrocuted - or start a fire!
                                    It actually doesn't matter that much where he lives. Many countries in Europe use the type-F Schuko plug. And with those, Live-Neutral polarity is ambiguous (i.e. L/N can be swapped, depending on which way you insert the plug).
                                    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schuko

                                    As long as you are aware of that (especially if working on live stuff), it's not too much of a problem. And of course, if designing something with a line switch, you should always use a double-pole switch so that both Live and Neutral are disconnected.
                                    Last edited by momaka; 05-18-2016, 08:29 PM.

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                                      Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                      Originally posted by momaka View Post
                                      ay, that psu is no good then - not for powering a computer anyways. Maybe okay for playing with leds or small motors that don't care about smooth voltage. After all, those caps on the output are indeed too small, as dan81 pointed out.


                                      Well, not exactly. There are still good parts in that power supply. They are just not good enough to make a functional pc psu. But if you take the "crappy" schottky rectifiers from this psu and put them in say, a small 10-20 watt power adapter that uses regular diodes for the rectification, you would get a lot less heat and much better efficiency. Or, if you're game, you can build your own custom smps for something like an amplifier, like our other fellow romanian, th3_un1qu3, did many ages ago :
                                      https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10491


                                      it actually doesn't matter that much where he lives. Many countries in europe use the type-f schuko plug. And with those, live-neutral polarity is ambiguous (i.e. L/n can be swapped, depending on which way you insert the plug).
                                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/schuko

                                      as long as you are aware of that (especially if working on live stuff), it's not too much of a problem. And of course, if designing something with a line switch, you should always use a double-pole switch so that both live and neutral are disconnected.
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                                        Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                        Well the point is to load both rails *at the same time*. Loading only one at a time is called crossload and group-designs don't like that. Group regulated units are even worse.
                                        Less jewellery, more gold into electrotech industry! Half of the computer problems is caused by bad contacts

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                                          Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

                                          Originally posted by Dan81 View Post
                                          Actually,that might be another 0W PSU,as there are absolutely no PI coils (or ANY SPACE printed on the PCB for them,let alone holes),thus it won't do a watt in spec. Good only for smashing.
                                          Speaking more seriously, I've worked in power electronics for over 35 years. Those semiconductors, heatsinks, and magnetics are probably good for 200W continuous. The output noise would probably have horrible noise spikes (due to the lack of what you called "Pi coils"), and the conducted noise would probably be horrible, due to the lack of input inductors.

                                          But if loaded to 450W, its life would be minutes or even seconds. Those input rectifiers are probably not good for that much current; the MJE13007-clone transistors are not good for that much current (and their beta would probably be less than 5!); the heatsinks aren't adequate for that much heat dissipation, the transformer core might saturate, and the output rectifiers probably aren't good for that much current.
                                          PeteS in CA

                                          Power Supplies should be boring: No loud noises, no bright flashes, and no bad smells.
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