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Old 05-12-2009, 07:42 PM   #41
MegaOne302
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Thumbs up Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

I’m just being a smart ass; it’s been so long since I ordered anything from them that I truly forgot they even existed.

Thanks for the reminder, I'll order all the needed 8mm and 10mm sp-caps from them if they have.

Thank you sooooooo much dude...
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Old 05-12-2009, 07:56 PM   #42
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Oh god! Don't say dude to him. Geeze, the last guy....

Well, let's just say it wasn't pretty. hehehehehee

>>why didn’t I find them in my Mouser cat...<<

ROFL!

The new on is over 2-1/2" thick and just about 4 pounds.

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Old 05-12-2009, 07:58 PM   #43
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

lol

I take the dude thing back.

Thank you Sir...

Last edited by MegaOne302; 05-12-2009 at 08:04 PM..
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Old 05-12-2009, 08:43 PM   #44
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Nah, this is Tuesday.
Dude is okay on Tuesday.
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Old 05-12-2009, 08:44 PM   #45
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Thumbs up Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

You're the best...
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Old 05-13-2009, 04:45 PM   #46
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

That’s odd…

Looks like they don’t make 16v 1200uf sp-caps. The closest match I find is 16v 1000uf; is it ok to use those for the 12v line?

Looks like anything over 1000uf can use an low e-cap.

Last edited by MegaOne302; 05-13-2009 at 04:54 PM..
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Old 05-13-2009, 05:13 PM   #47
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

I'm guessing the 1200uF 16v are the VRM input caps. ???

uF isn't so important there as ESR.
Assuming 3 or 4 VRM input caps. it's common practice when Switching from lytics to sp in VRM input to use 330uF-16v or 470uF-16v polys.
That's also what you'll usually see on boards that come with polys there originally.
My preference is 470uF 16v or to use the Intel-Dell method below.

A number of Intel boards built for Dell mix one lytic with two polys in VRM input.
Since all 3 [or 4] are in parallel that gives the best of both worlds.
- Very low ESR and uF not so low.

For those caps the ESR keeps the noise out and the uF smooths out PSU voltage fluctuations from load changes and start-up/shutdown ops.
Using one 16v 1800uF [or up] lytic there isn't a bad idea just in case the mobo some day gets attached to a crappy PSU that lets voltage wander around.
.
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Old 05-13-2009, 06:29 PM   #48
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

So there are two VRM banks, one for the 2.5v for the Vcore ESR filtering and one 16v bank for gross ESR filtering of the PSU.

I still don't fully understand what the uf value means; is it the repeated ripple value the cap can handle?

Last edited by MegaOne302; 05-13-2009 at 06:38 PM..
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Old 05-13-2009, 08:13 PM   #49
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Quote:
Originally Posted by MegaOne302
I still don't fully understand what the uf value means; is it the repeated ripple value the cap can handle?
uF is capacitance in Micro-Farads
The Ripple rating is how much Ripple Current can pass through the cap without it overheating. It is similar to the Watts rating on a resistor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MegaOne302
So there are two VRM banks, one for the 2.5v for the Vcore ESR filtering and one 16v bank for gross ESR filtering of the PSU.
No.
Not two banks.
Power-In side and Power-Out side.

See PIC. [Only one cap shown in each spot for simplicity.]
-
VID tells Controller what Vcore voltage should be on CPU.
Controller Senses the Vcore voltage.
Controller turns MOSFETs on-off [very fast] to adjust voltage.

VRM-IN caps give MOSFETs clean power by filtering out noise from PSU.
VRM-OUT caps give CPU clean power by filtering out on-off pulses from MOSFETs.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg Basic_VRM.jpg (42.4 KB, 107 views)
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Old 05-13-2009, 09:15 PM   #50
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Double filtering for the CPU I see.

Ok, so the two cap banks act as filters but in kind of different ways.
The VRM-In bank filters the 12v line-in, protecting the MOSFET-in from line noise and surges.

Then

The VRM-out bank filters the MOSFET-out, protecting\stabilizing the voltage to the Vcore from a kind of switching noise.

Did I get everything?

And I thought DC current was easer tamed…

Really nice drawing BTW…
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Old 05-13-2009, 09:34 PM   #51
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

You're getting it now!!

MOSFETs are basically switches that turn on-off very fast.
They aren't on-off at the same time [or length of time].
Controller adjusts their on-off 'duty cycles' to get the desired voltage for Vcore.
-
The switching action of the MOSFETs causes pulses that the VRM-OUT caps filter out.
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Old 05-13-2009, 09:36 PM   #52
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

There aren't any modern processors with a Vcore over 2 volts so 2.5v rated caps are just fine there.
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Old 05-13-2009, 09:43 PM   #53
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Yes, I was thinking the same. The Vcore was around 1.34v

Tanks for today’s lesson.
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Old 05-16-2009, 05:27 PM   #54
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Lightbulb Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Hi PC,

Is there any way to view the capacitance and ripples in a circuit with the cap left in? I have a feeling many motherboard caps uf are overshot to get the ESR low.

Thanks,

Joe
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:07 PM   #55
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

You'd need an O'scope to see ripple.
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Old 05-16-2009, 11:10 PM   #56
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Can one be easily built or cheaply bought from eBay? If so, can you recommend a very basic one?
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:19 AM   #57
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Build an Oscilloscope? . Not likely.

You can find them on ebay and if you're patient come in under $200 and -sometimes- a lot less [$100 ??] but you need to be careful about getting one that actually works. - LOTs of busted ones for sale on eBay.

Ideally you'll need a Digital Storage Oscilloscope [DSO] or at least a Storage O'scope vs an Analog. Analog is best used for signals that repeat over and over without changing and noise doesn't do that. A Storage scope will capture a moment in time and display it vs changing on every refresh of the screen as an Analog scope does.

A 20MHz Bandwidth as adequate for SMPS noise but 60-100MHz are fairly cheap and you can do much more with them.

There are also USB versions that display on a PC that are adequate and it's kind of handy to be able to save the image on the PC which most regular scopes can't do and most that do need a bunch of extra gadgets.

I have an old Mainframe Tektronics with plug-in bays that lets me swap plug-ins to reconfigure the scope for different things. With the right plug-ins it can be bumped up to 1Ghz or even changed into a Spectrum Analyzer. I presently have 6 plug-ins for it and currently it's good to 400 MHz. The down sides are it's BIG and HEAVY and those plug-ins need a bunch of room in a clean static free storage space.

Also have a light weight Tektronics 60MHz scope that the F*K-WADs from FedEx dropped on the front and smashed all the knobs off, broke the front face-plate into 6-8 pieces, and snapped the handle in half. Insurance paid for it 100% but I was wanting a lighter O'scope, not another project...

I actually -just- ordered a Hantek DSO-2150 60MHz USB scope yesterday but it's obviously not here yet so I can't offer a review.
Those usually run $200-$230 or so on eBay.
http://www.hantek.com.cn/english/pro...st.asp?unid=63

There's a long scope discussion here about an Owon Scope and scopes in general:
http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6312

.

Last edited by PCBONEZ; 05-17-2009 at 02:24 AM..
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:31 AM   #58
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Thumbs up Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

OMG, Bob is here too? That discussion is a must read...

I know what you’re saying, I too am FedUp with FedEx, hope they fold soon.

Thanks for your knowledgeable advice sir.

Keep us informed on the USB scope performance.

Joe
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Old 05-31-2009, 12:05 AM   #59
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasty
Shadow-

Can you visually check the 3 caps there and report their labeled voltages?

Cheers!
Toast
Bah, finally got around to doing this.

The new CPU cooler that I ordered got lost in the mail!
Australia Post

Eventually I got it and now it is finally fully installed. I checked out the caps while I had the PC case open.

The electrolytic caps are 820uF, 6.3V Nichicon HN(M).
This is the second revision of the motherboard (after the HN(M) capacitor problem plagued this motherboard).

I am surprised that Intel still decided to use these capacitors.

Having said this, the ones that I have are most likely not plagued by the HN(M) capacitor problem. They have been running for years without even a hiccup. Too bad I never bothered to note down the date stamp for the capacitors.
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Old 06-12-2009, 01:10 PM   #60
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Default Re: Intel D865GLC AA C28906-410 Recap

You drew a diagram minus a inductor coil! This is vital item. This take pulses from the MOSFETs and inductor coil does a "flywheel" in electrical inertia so ripples and spikes are minimized and futher filtered with v-core capacitors.

Cheers, Wizard
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