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Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

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    #21
    Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

    Originally posted by eccerr0r View Post
    Here's another tidbit hint that probably can not be applied in this type of motor: Brushless fans have a hall effect sensor to know the position of the fan magnet so it can put the correct polarity near the poles so we don't have vibration instead of rotation when the fan initially tries to spin up. This is somewhat difficult to do with the no moving parts stir plate as magnet position would be difficult to feed back to the exciter.
    It's coincidental that you happen to mention this, as earlier today I was looking at videos that broke down and analyzed the driver circuits for those electromagnetic levitator toys. They use four coils exactly like the coils I use, but what they do, is they use hall effect sensors to determine when the levitating magnet gets off center. When it does, the current through the hall effect sensor changes slightly. It is amplified through an op amp then that change is used to offset the current flow in the coil that the magnet is leaning towards and it is added to the coil to push back on the levitating magnet. All of it happens so fast, that the net result looks like a magnet is prefectly levitating about an inch above four coils. You can even spin the rotating magnet and it will spin for a long time given the almost zero friction.

    BUT, that's not why I'm writing this response ...

    So I started really studying the datasheets for the stepper driver that the EE guy used and most of it made sense, but then I looked at the datasheet for the 8825 driver, of which I have several, and what I learned is that internal to that chip, it maintains a table so that it knows where it is within the stepping sequence, which can be micro stepped down to 32...

    There is a table in the datasheet that shows how much current is being applied to each of the two coil pairs at each step in the table. And what I noticed right away is that at step 1, it puts 100% of the current into coil pair A while only putting like 5 to 10% in coil pair B. Then as you step, it decreases the current in A and increases the current in B and it keeps doing this until you have stepped it all the way to the end (32 steps for the 32 mode, 16 for 16, etc.) and it appeared to me that after you have run all of the steps in a cycle, it would have moved the end of a stir bar from one of the four coils to the next adjacent coil - or effectively, a full set of steps would be ΒΌ turn of the spin bar.

    I also saw that when the step pin is held low for 1.8 microseconds then set high, it's on the low to high edge that causes it to step one time.

    This gradual transition of current is exactly what I've been trying to do in the first place... SO ...

    I ran some calculations to figure out, based on the desired RPM, how much time I would have to wait in-between steps to get a full rotation (which at 32 step mode for example, would be 32 steps - four times for a complete rotation). Using that, I was able to come up with a formula where I could feed the microcontroller an RPM that I want and it will then calculate the delay between steps.

    I need to play with the code a little but my first run looked promising ... although a little jerky so I need to figure that out (I think it has to do with the way I'm calling the stepping function that I wrote) ... but I think I'm finally on the right track here...

    Mike

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      #22
      Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

      Originally posted by petehall347 View Post
      i suppose being called motor less is not really true as it must be a motor of sorts when its working .
      this sort of thing wants me to see what happens to iron filings on a sheet of paper when placed over the coils .
      If they were placed inside a cup, I would assume they would just jump around since they don't have a north and south pole to keep them aligned with the coil pairs.

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        #23
        Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

        Originally posted by EasyGoing1 View Post
        If they were placed inside a cup, I would assume they would just jump around since they don't have a north and south pole to keep them aligned with the coil pairs.
        i thought it might make changing patterns .

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          #24
          Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

          Originally posted by eccerr0r View Post
          Yes this is still a motor that converts electrical energy to mechanical energy. Just that the rotor is not attached to the stator housing at all. The proper term is probably a stir plate with no moving parts.
          OK, more progress ... I was fairly successful using the DRV8825 stepper driver... the coils get pretty hot over time, ive been able to reduce that by setting the current choke to a lower value but if it gets too low, the pill wont track as well to the coils, but I think it might be a matter of making small incremental adjustments in the current and testing it in the kind of liquid I need to stir.

          I also ordered some bigger coils but I'm now thinking that maybe smaller coils would be more suited to the task. Not sure yet ... need to experiment with that.

          BUT - here is a video of the latest progress. I have my RPM formula obviously inaccurate because when the pill gets going at a decent speed in this video, I have it calculated at 70 rpm but clearly it's going much faster than that so I need to figure that out ... but it starts out at 10rpm then I turn the rotary and it climbs rpm by 2 per click ... when it gets above 50, it looses tracking until I reach 70 then it locks in pretty good and will stay that way until I turn it off.

          BUT HEY! .... PROGRESS!

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            #25
            Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

            Originally posted by petehall347 View Post
            i thought it might make changing patterns .
            If it does, there is nothing interesting about it ... take a look at the video I posted in the post before this one... you'll see what happens when it gets off track.

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              #26
              Re: Magnetic Stirrer Project Reset

              I'm glad you see the light and not fooling with the analog crap anymore.

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