Need help wiring up 240VAC.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

I cannot find any information on inrush current for the PDU. The PDU is an HPE G2 Switched Horizontal 7300VA model #: P9S16A

The tech datasheet is just kind of a generic datasheet that lists all their PDUs and quick specs, there doesn't seem to be one specific for this PDU, and it doesn't list in-rush current at all.

Because we have a daughter who will eventually be going down in the basement, I think something with a cover would be a good idea. Sooner or later, she'll notice the plug, and hopefully, she'll be at the age where she'll know not to mess with it. However, having a cover I don't think would ever hurt. So long as I don't have to change the plug that comes from the PDU.

So, I'm thinking the reason they used the IP44 32A plug was because it could safely handle the in-rush current. I believe a company like HP Enterprise would have thought of all that stuff. This isn't one of those cheaper type PDUs made by some teenagers or something.

I think we can safely assume that a wire that is capable of handling 32A would be what this unit was designed for. That would mean I'd need 8/3 wire, right? And then the IP44 that Stj linked me too....but I still need some sort of gang box to attach it to the cement wall....some sort of enclosure, unless these things are meant to be attached directly to the cement walls, and not put in a gang box, then I just need the conduit.

For the breaker, a double pole 45-amp is what I need, right?

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

the reason they used an ip44 plug is because they dont expect you to hose it down!!
even ip44 can be used out in the rain, they just dont like pressure - like a burst pipe.
and obviously you cant flood the room over it.

ip67 connectors can go underwater!

if you do use an ip67 socket, you dont need to change the plug - an ip44 plug will fit. - or it should - i will check this later, i have some here.
i dont think your daughter could pull the plug out btw - they are a tight fit, and the cover drops onto a peg on the plug to lock it in.

to remove the plug you have to hold the cover up before pulling the plug out.


so, you need 32A or greater cable,
the socket - it has a wall-mountable box with it - the white bit on the foto.
a double breaker - ideally rated at 32A and "c" rated for trip sensitivity
and the plastic/metal tube to run the wire through etc.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

Yes, that's it. For the breakers, I found an article from HPE that tells me exactly what I need.

(breakers) - (2) 1-pole, 16A    (input plug) - IEC 32A, 1ph

So it looks like I just need a double pole 16A breaker (16 amp per pole) and the iEC 32A receptacle. That means I can use 10/3 wire.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

The HPE P9S16A 2U PDU didn't seem to come with the grounding wire. The back of the PDU, where the grounding cable gets hooked up, shows it's supposed to take a 10 gauge wire. My rack has those green bolts here and there, which are meant for grounding, from reading the rack manual. I need to have everything bonded properly. Where I placed the rack, right above, is a big bonding wire. It goes from the panel, all the way over and connects to the gas line, then to the water pipe, then there's a bonding wire that goes from the water pipe to the coax splitters.

I'm thinking of buying a bonding clamp to put it on that big wire, and then using some bonding wire the cable people left for me and running a wire from that big bare bonding wire down to the rack, so it's properly bonded. That would make sense, wouldn't it?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

Seeing how I can't buy 16-AMP breakers, should I be purchasing the 20-AMP? My neighbor, who works for the CAC, says I should go for the 15-AMP double pole, because it'd be safer. To me, it would make more sense to go for the 20-amp, because then it's not over-working itself, getting hot. If the PDU is drawing up to a maximum of 32-AMPs, and we use wire and breakers rated for a maximum of 30 AMP, isn't that where we run into trouble? However, going higher never hurts, right?

We can run 14/2 into a 20-amp breaker just fine, but running 12/2 into a 15-amp breaker isn't smart.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

For the electrical wire, I can use 10/2 with this right, or will I need 10/3? If there's only three connectors in the IP44 plug, with 10/2, I could hook the bare ground to neutral, the white to the one 120 load line, the black to the 120 load line, couldn't I? Or should I be going for 10/3?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

This is the breaker I'll be purchasing, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Square-D...20CP/202353326

The PDU is a European PDU I found out, so that 32A is derated (80% of it's max rating I believe). That's what keeps throwing me off. They (the internet) says this is how they do it Europe, so the plug that's on there, rated for 32A, should be perfectly matched to this unit, and the receptacle I buy, if I buy it from Europe, should be 32A as well.

I need a UPS eventually, but now that means I'm either gonna have to rewire the PDU, which I don't wanna do, or stick with the European standard and find a PDU for this, to supply a nice, clean, steady supply of power.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

Shit, I was just going over the datasheet again for the IP67 receptacle and noticed the three pins are neutral, ground, and line.E

How can I wire this up without violating the NEC? I thought it'd be neutral, line, line. But it appears that one line is meant for 240VAC. How can I tie two 120VAC's into one 240VAC? Or do they make breakers that produce a single 240VAC output?

I think I'm going to need to find some sort of 120V step up transformer. Or some sort of wall-mount transformer that just accepts the double-pole 120VAC and provides the proper outlet. Anything like that second idea exist? Or is there a chance my plug actually expects 120V, 120V, and Neutral?

[goontron]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

^ phase A, phase B, and ground is fine.

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

i'm skipping reading most of this to say NO 16A breakers.
they arent running in parallel here.
you need 32A breakers.

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

right, i read the rest of the posts.

your wiring a 32A circuit using one line as the live and the other line as return,
you need 32A breakers and 32A+ cable.

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

Shit, I was just going over the datasheet again for the IP67 receptacle and noticed the three pins are neutral, ground, and line.E

How can I wire this up without violating the NEC? I thought it'd be neutral, line, line. But it appears that one line is meant for 240VAC.

this is a language difference.

in europe we call one side of the line "Live" and the other side of the line "Neutral" and only fuse the Live side.
the Neutral side is bonded to the earth at the entry to the building.

you need to connect one of your Line's to each of the power terminals through your 32A breaker and then run the earth wire.

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

i took some foto's for you.

with both ip67 and ip44 plugs in an ip67 socket, and showing the mounting holes and cable entry points of the socket.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

this is a language difference.

in europe we call one side of the line "Live" and the other side of the line "Neutral" and only fuse the Live side.
the Neutral side is bonded to the earth at the entry to the building.

you need to connect one of your Line's to each of the power terminals through your 32A breaker and then run the earth wire.

Right, and this will not violate our National Electric Code? I can legally do this? Run one 120VAC down the L/+ pin, run one down the Neutral, and then just run the Earth to my Neutral Bus-Bar?

Should I be using 8/3 without a ground, or 8/2 with a ground? From the pick of the receptacle, there's no bare copper wire going Earth. I'm going to have the PDU grounded externally to the rack through the ground screw on the back, I'm going to have the rack grounded to my bonding wire.

[goontron]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

^ That's how a NEMA 10-30 socket is wired. These IP rated sockets are basically the industrial version of a range/dryer socket in the US. Wiring code wise anyway.

The neutral is bonded to chassis

Here's a question. Why not just use a range/welder/RV plug like any electrician would?

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

i took some foto's for you.

with both ip67 and ip44 plugs in an ip67 socket, and showing the mounting holes and cable entry points of the socket.

That's perfect!!!!!

I had gone to EEVBlog to ask some questions about wiring this up, and boy did that cause a stir! A few (they seem smart and know what they're talking about) suggested what you suggested, just run 120VAC down L/+, and 120VAC down Neutral.

There's a couple though that says this won't work at all, is dangerous, and I need to send the PDU back and purchase the correct one. So I've reached out to my VAR to verify. HPE had listed this as International and when I talked to their Sales rep, who talked to a tech, they said so long as I purchased the proper outlet and followed the NEC or hired a professional to hook it up, it would work in my country, which is the USA. So now we gotta see who's right, who's wrong I guess.

[Spork Schivago]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

I think I understand the problem they're talking about. Page 8, https://h20195.www2.hpe.com/v2/GetDo...e=a00002909enw

These are the two built-in breakers:

(2) 1-pole, 16A

It's that 1-pole that would cause safety issues. So it looks like either replace the entire PDU or purchase something like this:

https://www.zoro.com/acme-electric-t...specifications

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

no, just get 2 30A breakers and the socket and wire it.
i think the breakers on the pdu are not input related and are for passthrough power to extra devices.

btw, that transformer does not say the windings are isolated.
it looks more like it's intended as a 3phase stepdown.
"Input Voltage: 240/480VAC", "Output Voltage: 120/240VAC"
it could even be a bunch of taps on the same winding - known as an AutoTransformer.

[budm]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

At 120V output, the current will be 60A so the wire gauge will be really large.

[stj]

Re: Need help wiring up 240VAC.

u.s. electrical standards are a fucking trainwreck!
btw, how the hell did that NEMA blade-contact stuff ever get accepted???
it has no shielding from water or small metal objects getting down the edge.

in most of the world the plugs either have shielded pins, or the socket atleast has a "rim" that covers the edge of the plug to some degree or other.