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**lti** · 05-31-2013, 09:00 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Replace all the KZGs. You might be able to use polymer caps, but I don't think anyone has tried on that board. Just find replacements from a good manufacturer (Rubycon, Nichicon, Panasonic, or Sanyo/Suncon) with similar specs to the KZGs. I think Nichicon HM series is an exact replacement for those.

I think your solder is too large. I use 0.032" diameter solder, and that might even be a little too thick for this purpose.

**ratdude747** · 05-31-2013, 09:17 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Yup, the 9300 is a denutted tyan K8WE, same minus the SCSI option is always installed and one of the two LAN ports is missing. Otherwise they are one and the same. Recap the board and you'll have a winner.

(Kinda ironic, I more or less had a thread on those going... good boards indeed)

**y_not** · 06-01-2013, 11:21 AM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

I should also add that you don't want a "pencil tip" on your iron for this purpose. You need a chisel tip, a big one! Like a 1/8" wide tip point @ 700-800F temp setting.
On my iron & ratdude's, which is temp controlled by the magnet in the tip itself, that's would be p/n: PTC8.
But it'll be different for yours. Only buy Weller brand tips, the Plato's are junk and not worth the cost savings.

Due to the large copper ground planes on multi-layer modern PCBs, you need the sheer thermal mass of a large tip in order to be able to have the reserve to keep heat on the joint!

**y_not** · 06-01-2013, 02:10 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Check out these videos too.
They explain the relationship between thermal mass, tip temp & the joints heat requirements.

Dave Jone's EEV Blog - Soldering Tutorial Pt. 1 (Hardware)
http://youtu.be/J5Sb21qbpEQ
Dave Jone's EEV Blog - Soldering Tutorial Pt. 2 (Soldering Technique)
*Covers the tip mass, etc... here.
http://youtu.be/fYz5nIHH0iY

Pace Soldering Lessions - 1980
*Still very useful and good info on thermal mass & what Pace calls "workpiece indicator".
http://youtu.be/vIT4ra6Mo0s

There are 9 lessons in the series as well as a repair & rework series.
http://www.youtube.com/user/paceworldwide?feature=watch

Have fun!

**the_it_male** · 06-12-2013, 06:56 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Thanks for all the help and pointers on this project I am working on. Learning to solder was interesting.

OK..Good news is

, I got one board up and working fine. I replaced all the bloated 1500uf caps and one or two 820uf caps. I left all the other 820uf in place because they didn't look to be bloated, although I know they can still be bad. I took a big chance and ordered my caps off of ebay from a place in New York. Link to caps. I looked through this forum and did google searches on how to spot bad rubycon caps. These look to me to be genuine. If there not, we will see how long the system stays up and running.

The bad news

if you can call it that. The other board, I cannot get to come up. I did the same thing and replaced all the bloated 1500uf caps. The 820uf caps that I replaced on the other board did not need to be replaced. They were already replaced with the rubycon caps and didn't have the KZG caps.

I will admit, I did make a rookie mistake and had one cap turned wrong and had neg to pos. After I tried to turn the machine on (the cpu fans spun for a few minutes and then went off) I disconnected everything and inspected the board and found that cap to be wrong. I un-soldered it and re-soldered it the right way. Is that ok??? or do I need to replace that cap altogether? It is next to another cap in between the pci slots.

Once I swapped that cap, I plugged the board back in and got nothing at all, not even a fan spin up as before. Even though that cap is in the pci section would it cause this, or would it cause just that pci slot not to work?..........

I did notice though that the chipset heatsink next to the 24pin power connector would get warm while the power was plugged in, almost like some power was getting to it (btw....PS does work in other computer).

Also, my brother-in-law told me that this system was on when they had a major power failure at his office. One of his guys plugged something into a power stip and it blew it as well as knocked out power on everything. This might have fried something more than the caps that were already bulging out??

Sorry about the long message, but I figured I better mention everything and not leave anything out.

Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks Again

**y_not** · 06-13-2013, 02:00 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

I would suggest posting some pics of the eBay caps.
Post photos of the bungs as well as the vent. I can see the bungs on the eBay auction photo, but can't see the vents. Post each anyway, just to be sure on both as for what you received that is.
Then the experts here can identify whether they're fake or not.

As for the bum board, I'm not a board component level repair expert, but I know that bad joints, messed up traces & lifted pads can be the source of most problems on rework.
Check out aaaallllll your joints with a high powered glass, a bright light & take your time. Go at it from different angles too, sometimes they like to hide from view!!
Depending on whether you have a light strong enough to backlight and fully illuminate a multi-layer PCB, you can also put a light behind the PCB and check it that way as well. I'd do both ways if you can, just to be sure.

If you can post pictures of the rework areas, that'd help too.

Lastly, I'm a bit unclear as to what caps you did & did not replace on the bum board?
If there are any "bad series/brands" you need to replace them all, not just the ones showing physical signs of failure. IE. All KZG/KZJ caps have to go and the general rule is all 470uF and higher "bad caps" need to go. Especially when you don't have an ESR meter.
What brand/series are the blue polymer/hybrid caps I see in the photo?

**Topcat** · 06-13-2013, 02:27 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

https://www.badcaps.net/store/produc...roducts_id=147

Mine were cheaper (theirs are 10 for $6.90, mine are 10 for $5.90), not 8+yr 'old stock' like pictured (their datecode shows circa 2005) , and guaranteed not to be fake... Way to go, buying ebay junk, then coming here and wondering whether you got hosed! It annoys me to no end that people have the gall to come here and expect answers to questions, but are too cheap to buy from here, which supports the very site you're asking for help.....especially when they aren't saving anything and then get fake crap off ebay.... Ohh well....I guess after 12 years of people's cheapskatery I should be used to it....but it doesn't make it any less aggravating...

**brethin** · 06-13-2013, 02:33 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

^

**ratdude747** · 06-13-2013, 03:57 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by brethin View Post

^

Agreed.

**retiredcaps** · 06-14-2013, 12:42 AM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by Topcat View Post

It annoys me to no end that people have the gall to come here and expect answers to questions, but are too cheap to buy from here, which supports the very site you're asking for help.

That is why I personally refuse to answer any questions when people come here and say "I bought this kit off ebay and it didn't solve the problem and I was directed here".

Buying caps from digikey, mouser, etc because they have values that the badcaps.net store doesn't carry is one thing.

**y_not** · 06-14-2013, 11:38 AM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by Topcat View Post

Mine were cheaper (theirs are 10 for $6.90, mine are 10 for $5.90), not 8+yr 'old stock' like pictured (their datecode shows circa 2005) , and guaranteed not to be fake... Way to go, buying ebay junk, then coming here and wondering whether you got hosed! It annoys me to no end that people have the gall to come here and expect answers to questions, but are too cheap to buy from here, which supports the very site you're asking for help.....especially when they aren't saving anything and then get fake crap off ebay.... Ohh well....I guess after 12 years of people's cheapskatery I should be used to it....but it doesn't make it any less aggravating...

Topcat,
I do hope I didn't offend when I asked the OP to post photos so they could be identified.
I guess I wasn't really thinking, just acting in the interest of the common good, read niceties. Figured what was done was done & needed to move on for us to help the OP out any further. I would never suggest anyone buy them on FleaBay though, I have read the writing on the wall & drank the very tasty Kool-Aid here. eBay caps baaad.. no buy.... Noooo siiiirreeeeeee!!

I couldn't agree more. Like retiredcaps said, it's not like they're going to reputable competition to get what they need because you don't have it. Or maybe you do, but they're outside the country and it's more time effective, or you have only some of what they need, so it makes more sense to get it all elsewhere. I can understand that. Such is business.
But these eBay shysters really get me.... grrrrr.

I don't do beer, but... here's an ice cold Coke in a glass bottle. Have a cold one on me and just sip your frustrations away.

We can hang out with Jack & Thor by the lake while we fish.

We all know you do wonderful work and this is a fantastic resource you have set up here on the Interwebs. I have ZERO problem supporting you when the time comes. I have no problem paying a few bones more on shipping for product through you than Mouser or whatever, being the level of service & knowledge you offer.
Which reminds me... I need to shoot you an e-mail regarding stock on some caps I need. Just have to get around to it. LOL

**the_it_male** · 06-14-2013, 01:00 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

First off, I didn't mean to offend you Topcat and your site. I did look through your store for some Rubycons in the 1500uf 6.3 and did not find any. I didn't even look at other brands because after reading many sites, I thought rubycon was like the better brand. Don't forget I am noob with this stuff so I don't know what's what. Also, I noticed on your shipping page you said you only ship on Tuesdays and Fridays. I wasn't sure how long it would take to get them and I had a brother-in-law wanting something done fast for his business, so I jumped and ordered the ones I ordered. I have another board or two laying around that I want to play around with and there is no rush on those, so I will order the next caps from you. Again, I apologize for doing what I did.

Thanks for the reply y_not. Sorry if I got you in deep caca.

I took some pictures (hope they are clear enough) of the things you asked about. I de-soldered the cap that I put on backwards and left it off thinkng that it might have blown it. That is the cap that I took photos of.

The 820uf caps I didn't replace on the second board were already rubycon mbz's. Just an fyi on this board, there are 2 220uf KME caps, and 3 16v 1800uf KZG caps. The rest are ruby's of some sort or poly's which I took photos of. On the system that is running now after I replaced the 1500uf caps, it had 820uf kzg caps still on it.

Hope this helps.

Again, I apologize for ordering what I did and not from here. In the future I will order my caps from here.

Attached Files

**y_not** · 06-14-2013, 01:56 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

The blue polymers are Sanyo/Oscon. The others are UCC. Brand wise they are good, and failure rates are low in polymers assuming no moisture gets in them.
With those UCC KZG/KZJ caps, it's my understanding that they should always be replaced, mo matter what. They're a good brand, just a bad series. They can't handle the heat and they like to dry up, going way out of spec sometimes with no visible signs of failure. Near as I can ascertain, the KMEs should be fine, series wise.

Of course one never knows for sure without an ESR meter. So replacing the aforementionedseries may, or may not fix anything.

As for the reversed cap, I can't really comment on that, someone else more knowledgeable than I will have to answer that one. Which cap was it, ie. where is it located on the board?

**retiredcaps** · 06-17-2013, 09:55 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by retiredcaps View Post

That is why I personally refuse to answer any questions when people come here and say "I bought this kit off ebay and it didn't solve the problem and I was directed here".

Prime example ...

https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...postcount=2813

**ratdude747** · 06-18-2013, 11:37 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by retiredcaps View Post

Prime example ...

https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...postcount=2813

Whoever that mooch is makes my blood boil. Almost as bad as a company making counterfeit NEC chips and sending buyers to the real NEC for support (which when the bogus part numbers were used the scam was revealed 5 years later).

**spleenharvester** · 06-20-2013, 05:57 PM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Just thought I'd chip in and say the reason I don't buy caps from here is because I live outside the US and with packaging costs it would probably cost less to buy a new motherboard. So refusing to reply to posts that use other sellers may not always be the best course of action.

Cheers

**retiredcaps** · 06-21-2013, 01:11 AM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

So if you get free correct advise from volunteers on solving whatever problem you have (say fixing a $1,500 TV), you feel absolutely NO obligation to give something back to help support this site? Someone has to pay hosting, disk space, server, bandwidth, backups, upgrades, licenses, etc.

The people who sell kits (with potentially fake caps or crap brand caps) get all the profit and none of the "dirty" work when the caps fail to fix the problem. How is directing customers to here to get free technical support right?

**spleenharvester** · 06-21-2013, 10:06 AM

Re: HP XW9300 boards and questions

Originally posted by retiredcaps View Post

So if you get free correct advise from volunteers on solving whatever problem you have (say fixing a $1,500 TV), you feel absolutely NO obligation to give something back to help support this site?

Sorry what? I made it very clearly I actually CANNOT support the site for the simple reason I live too far outside to realistically buy something. If that's what you're fishing for you really need a "donate" button.

I help out regularly on another forum owned by a company (or did until I got caught up with work) and we never refused to help anybody who'd bought kit elsewhere, be it us regular users, or mods, or even some of the technical support staff there.

EDIT: And I wasn't sticking up for the dodgy ebay sellers, either. Not sure where you got that from. I was merely pointing out not all of us are able to buy from here (would be great if I could, we get completely ripped off here in the UK for component prices!)

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HP XW9300 boards and questions

HP XW9300 boards and questions

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