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Old 03-21-2010, 01:40 PM   #41
Per Hansson
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhatDude
Main reason I want the SL8UD is so I can run Hyper-V or VMware or Windows 7 with XP Mode as it has the VT and XD bit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhatDude
Damn that sucks... Guess I need to sell this machine and put the money towards a new one that supports VT...
Microsoft has removed the requirement for hardware virtualization in Windows 7;

http://www.techspot.com/news/38286-m...uirements.html
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Last edited by Per Hansson; 03-21-2010 at 01:42 PM..
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Old 03-31-2010, 02:02 PM   #42
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Well guess what!

I got a 670 complete from ebay for $60
Listed as faulty.
Sorry, I have no pics.

When I rec'd it, I checked the caps straight away.

Well, well, well same issue as found in the 470 vented caps in the CPU VRM.

I will poly mod this in due course.
Has anybody experience with poly modding these?
I have a bunch of 820uF 2.5V Fujitsu FPCAP RE
I suspect however some Pana FM 10mm (for endurance)
will have to be used as well to get the total capacitance
up to spec., certainly for the CPU VRM at least.

I have checked the mobo for details of XC837/0XC837 in order
to run SL8MA Paxville CPU but can only find;
CN-0X0392-13740-479-0061 Rev A01 on the mobo

I suspect this is not a compatible mobo.

I will also have to check the PSU to see if it is ok
Any help here appreciated

Thanks
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Old 04-10-2010, 01:21 AM   #43
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

JEWilson, let me start off by saying that you got a great deal on that. I have a 670 I bought off a guy on craigslist for $100 (dual 2.8GHz narconas, 2gb, quadro 1300) that was shipped with 820uf polys in place of 2200uf electrolytes (all but 5 that is...just had to replace all 5 of the 2200s). Will have to check my voltage when i get to work tomorrow. I think theyre either 2.5v or 4v, tho. Can post pics tomorrow, too.
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Old 04-15-2010, 01:11 PM   #44
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Great

That would be helpful

Thx
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:37 PM   #45
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Hansson
Got the mobo recapped now, took a long while
Some massive ground planes leading away all the heat from the soldering iron!
And, how may I ask, did you get around this? I tried my trusty 15/30watt iron first, then noticed the grounding plane, so I pulled out my big dog 150watt gun, but that didn't even phase it. Tonight, once I pick up a new tip, I'll try my Coldheat wand. Sometimes it can do stuff the conventional irons can't.

I have 15-20 of these system to repair, so I'd like something fairly quick. I find it amazing that nearly all 31 of these capacitors managed to vent themselves. It seems like after a couple spewed, the system would die and the rest would remain intact.

My systems are all identical: single 3.4Ghz Nocona, 2 x 512MB RAM, 250GB hard drive, DVD-RW, and DVD-ROM. Decent systems especially with the x16 PCI Express slot.

I'm keeping 2 for myself and the rest are going cheap to pay for the capacitors and initial cost of the systems.

Thanks!
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:59 PM   #46
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Don't use the ColdHeat! Thats a good way to destroy the motherboard in an instant.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:05 PM   #47
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Y

I found the same problem.

I'm using a 50W Antec variable heat setting control dial.
With some of the VRM caps, I had to exercise caution not
to damage the pcb as I was using the iron at its full output.

Even at this temp and power O/P, I had to keep the iron on the joint
to get enough heat into it. Had to wet some of the joints also.

Take your time, if it is not working, walk away and come back later.
That is probably the best advice I can impart.

In any event, with a number of well constructed pcbs from
manufacturers, I am coming up against this problem recurrently.

I am next, going to purchase a bench iron from a reputable manufacturer.

Also, are these only 470s?
I'm looking for 670s with the bad cap issue.

HTH.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:25 PM   #48
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Coldheat injects a high current into the joint to heat up the solder.

So essentially you could zap your VRM with the current from it.
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Old 04-20-2010, 09:35 AM   #49
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

TonyBerry; Welcome to Badcaps!
Yes, ColdHeat = Very bad idea, don't use it

To remove the caps with big ground planes like on this particular mobo just takes more time, but do you have prior experience recapping stuff?
It's not really different or anything from the normal stuff, we have quite good FAQ's on soldering instructions here on Badcaps; http://www.badcaps.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=24

The advise I can give is to use a good soldering iron, but don't overdo it, I use a 50w Weller temp controlled
As for the desoldering technique the most important thing is to add new solder to the joints, so you have an easier time melting and heating the solder that is already there...

JEWilson; the 470 and 670 use the same PCB, the only difference is that on the 470 not all PCI slots are populated and the SCSI is missing (as you can see in my pics)
So yea, the capacitor issue is exactly the same on the two systems

Last edited by Per Hansson; 04-20-2010 at 09:38 AM..
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Old 04-23-2010, 10:16 AM   #50
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Quote:
Originally Posted by JEWilson
Take your time, if it is not working, walk away and come back later. That is probably the best advice I can impart.
Thanks for the tip, but it wouldn't apply here. If I walk away, all the time I put into heating the ground plane is lost. I know, I know, just being literal.

Quote:
Also, are these only 470s? I'm looking for 670s with the bad cap issue.
I only have 470's in my possession. As stated below, they are the same exact board minus the on-board SCSI and the last 2 slots. On the 470, the power supply takes the space that the last two slots occupy. You could easily use a 470 board in a 670 case.
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Old 04-23-2010, 10:30 AM   #51
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Hansson
TonyBerry; Welcome to Badcaps!
Thanks. Found it via Google (like I'm sure most have).

Quote:
Yes, ColdHeat = Very bad idea, don't use it
Dually noted.

Quote:
To remove the caps with big ground planes like on this particular mobo just takes more time, but do you have prior experience recapping stuff?
Extensively. I've done dozens of the "pizza box" GX270 systems and I have done countless video game monitor chassis (Electrohome and Wells Gardner). Plus assorted projects here and there.

Quote:
The advise I can give is to use a good soldering iron, but don't overdo it, I use a 50w Weller temp controlled
My iron and my gun are both Weller. The gun is ancient, but still works like a charm. I measured input wattage on both and it's as it should be. I tested heat level on each tip and it is also as it should be (assuming my pyrometer is working, which it seems to be as the back of my mouth is ~98*).

Anyway, back to the issue, would I get any benefit by somehow removing the old capacitors before attempting to desolder the leads? They are absorbing heat, so I would assume anything would help. I did try flowing fresh solder, but that didn't help. I tried 3 different boards and even different banks of capacitors. The smaller bank of 3 (just North of the floppy connector) doesn't have a huge ground plane, but I couldn't get those loose either.
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Old 04-24-2010, 07:24 AM   #52
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

IMO removing the capacitors would just make it harder
I just flip the board over, add some solder to the capacitor legs and then I heat them one by one and at the same time I just push the capacitor on the other side of the PCB with my other hand untill one leg goes out as far as it will, then I heat the other leg and so on...

With boards that don't have so large grounding planes I can heat both legs at once and the capacitor will come out almost by gravity itself...
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:37 AM   #53
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

I decided this might be a good time to upgrade my "aging" Weller WES-51, so I purchased a Weller WESD-51. As expected, it really didn't do much better at removing these capacitors. It does seem to be getting more heat to the components though, because as I heat the backside of the board, the capacitor is getting so hot I can barely touch it to pull it out. I was able to get a good number of the capacitors on the areas without the massive ground plane, but no such luck on the "important" ones.

I'm considering something more aggressive at this point. If I could precision drill out the holes that the capacitor legs go through, I could save a lot of time and energy. I have also considered pulling the capacitor casings off and solder the replacement capacitors to the existing legs.

I've also thought about asking the local hobbyists who think they have some extreme soldering skills to do it for me. I'd offer them 50 cents a pop to remove a capacitor. They would jump at the chance to make "quick money", but they'd probably hate me (or refuse to do any more) after the first board.
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Old 08-14-2010, 11:36 PM   #54
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Hey all,

I was sent over here to get some advice on "poly caps"?

This was my Exchange 2007 server that crashed, umm.. burned up day before yesterday.



She gave no warning just quit. I have taken them out (but y'all say these are top caps so.....?) with a HAKKO 808 desoldering kit. (darn thing works fantastic!

Here I was thinking I was going to pop into RadioShack, but I now see that is not going to work as hoped
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Old 08-15-2010, 12:06 AM   #55
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

I hope you made a cap map taking note of the polarities in addition to uF and volts.

Excessive heat will kill any lytic after a while.
The ones that didn't bloat are probably aged pretty well and since you have them out anyway...

The photo is one that has been poly'ed.
Not sure if it's a newer revision or if its been rebuilt.

The Vcore caps can be down to 2.5v and 820uF is probably best.
The VRM-IN caps [caps on +12v that power the CPUs] need to be 16v caps and on a server I'd use at least 470uF.

The others you should probably leave as lytics at the original values because, without knowing exactly what they do or what actual voltage they are on, changing the uF or volts can much things up. [Little too late to check their voltages with a meter.]

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Old 08-15-2010, 12:09 AM   #56
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

When choosing replacement caps pay attention to old-vs-new diameters.
That will bite you when they don't fit later on.

And check your power supply too........
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Old 08-15-2010, 01:25 AM   #57
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
I hope you made a cap map taking note of the polarities in addition to uF and volts..
Oh yes i did and they are numbered on the board and polarity is clear

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Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
Excessive heat will kill any lytic after a while.
The ones that didn't bloat are probably aged pretty well and since you have them out anyway....
The ones that popped i had marked with a red sharpieI was not thinking I should pull all of them

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
The photo is one that has been poly'ed.
Not sure if it's a newer revision or if its been rebuilt..
might just be my pen marks?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
The Vcore caps can be down to 2.5v and 820uF is probably best..
All the ones I pulled were all 6.3v

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
The VRM-IN caps [caps on +12v that power the CPUs] need to be 16v caps and on a server I'd use at least 470uF..
Those are 16v 1000uF. you are suggesting change those?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCBONEZ View Post
The others you should probably leave as lytics at the original values because, without knowing exactly what they do or what actual voltage they are on, changing the uF or volts can much things up. [Little too late to check their voltages with a meter.].
There are four of the 6,3v that look in great shape. only thing is my range meter wont charge the board enough to get an accurate reading


I took your photo and circled the ones that I pulled.




If so many of them blew up how do you know if somethin much more fragile like a transistor/thyristor or a mofset isnt burned? They TO SMALL to see and toooo many of them!

After all, caps can be used as voltage regulators. Oh and how can you tell the VRM-in caps from the rest of them?

Sean

Last edited by bigcape; 08-15-2010 at 01:31 AM..
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Old 08-15-2010, 01:55 AM   #58
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

I hope this is not a thread jack..... but I am curious why you guys don't seem to like or talk about the 490 or 690.

I have 4 690's and 5 490's They are awesome machines. One of mine has quad core E5465 xeons 2.8Gz. the 490's have X5160 3.0Gz all dual procs and are screemers!

No offense but this is the only 470 I've had and in comparison it seems to be put together like Legos!
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Old 08-15-2010, 02:47 AM   #59
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

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Originally Posted by bigcape View Post
I hope this is not a thread jack..... but I am curious why you guys don't seem to like or talk about the 490 or 690.

I have 4 690's and 5 490's They are awesome machines. One of mine has quad core E5465 xeons 2.8Gz. the 490's have X5160 3.0Gz all dual procs and are screemers!

No offense but this is the only 470 I've had and in comparison it seems to be put together like Legos!
We repair broken things.
We talk about what shows up here broken.

Last edited by PCBONEZ; 08-15-2010 at 02:49 AM..
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Old 08-15-2010, 02:49 AM   #60
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Default Re: Dell Precision 470 Workstation

All of the caps you circled should be replaced with electrolytics.
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