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Old 02-03-2018, 08:52 PM   #1441
dmill89
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Quote:
Originally Posted by momaka View Post
I guess my guess of "65%" wasn't that far off. That's truly terrible, though.

A big part of that comes from the fact that this PSU uses a linear 3.3V rail that is derived from the 5V rail. So with your 12 Amp load on the 3.3V rail, the loses are (4.8383V - 3.3366V) * 12 Amps = 1.5V * 12 Amps = 18.02 Watts of loss just from the 5V-->3.3V rail linear regulator circuit.

So I guess we can give this PSU the benefit of the doubt that with a more realistic PC load (either 5V or 12V heavy instead of 3.3V-heavy), the efficiency should be somewhat better - probably in the low 70% range. That's still laughable, of course.
in order to be a little more realistic I dug an old crappy motherboard (ECS L4VCA2 socket 478 board with a 2.5 ghz Celeron) I didn't care about (since the likelihood of this POS PSU blowing up and killing the board was decent) out of the shed, fired up memtest86 and added an additional 55W 12V load in the form of an automotive headlight to simulate drives and a load on the GPU (the CPU is 61W TDP).

The results are interesting...., while all rails are now in ATX spec, the 12V rail is on the low side and dancing all over the place (note: the 12V pics were taken with my Nikon D7000's 6fps burst mode to give you an idea of how rapidly it is fluctuating, it went from 11.784 to 11.888 to 11.783, to 11.778, 11.781 in the space of about a second, I don't own an oscilloscope but I imagine it would look pretty bad on one):






5V @5.1834V:


3.3V @ 3.3618V:


Its is drawing 167W to power what should be a 110-120W load, so efficiency is still in the 65-70% range:
Attached Images
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Last edited by dmill89; 02-03-2018 at 09:10 PM..
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Old 02-03-2018, 09:43 PM   #1442
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Quote:
Originally Posted by momaka View Post
Besides, anything is better than bulged CS
Eww, I saw those kind in a PSU, likely a Coolmax, when at the former WinCycle recycling room, back in 2009 or 2008... (maybe 2010)

They were bulging and leaking...
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Old 02-04-2018, 10:17 AM   #1443
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

dmill89: Just a tip, if your meter can handle somewhat high AC frequencies you can try putting it in AC mode and see what it shows on the 12v rail. (Cheap mans scope )
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Old 02-08-2018, 02:01 PM   #1444
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

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Originally Posted by goodpsusearch View Post
My source informed me yesterday evening that he has made another psu package for me. The packet will include:
1) Power Innovator, Model LC-B250ATX
2) FORCE, Model SL-800EPS (MAX 500W)
3) FSP GROUP INC., Model FSP250-60HEN
4) AQPPROX!, Model app550PS
5) PANSTAR, Model PSA-235
6) HANTOL, 550W
7) POWERTECH, ATX-450W
8) THERMALTAKE TR2-420 PP

And it is for free! I am going to post pics and info about them as soon as I get them
They're here!

Force SL-8600EPS (MAX 600W)

The only notable difference it has from this unit..
..is the fan, that is different. Here, we have a sleeve bearing Globe fan that seized and cooked the output inductor toroid coil.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg fan.jpg (305.1 KB, 26 views)
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (671.0 KB, 46 views)
File Type: jpg 2.jpg (419.0 KB, 40 views)
File Type: jpg 3.jpg (636.1 KB, 42 views)
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Old 02-08-2018, 02:45 PM   #1445
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Powertech ATX-450W

This was dead right out of the box. 5vsb is there, but when shorting green to ground the fan moves for a second and stops.

Main features:

-Fewer and fewer components used

-Smaller and smaller parts. Just look at that cute main transformer

-Light as a feather.

-Super group regulation with 1 toroid coil for all voltages

-Thin and short input caps with terribly printed sleeves

-Funny scissors drawings appear on PCB. They tell you what to do with this pos.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg label.jpg (263.4 KB, 28 views)
File Type: jpg fan.jpg (295.4 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (532.9 KB, 43 views)
File Type: jpg 2.jpg (511.0 KB, 37 views)
File Type: jpg 3.jpg (358.8 KB, 30 views)
File Type: jpg 4.jpg (514.2 KB, 38 views)
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Old 02-08-2018, 03:22 PM   #1446
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Hantol HPSU550

Same model as this, but different platform.

Fan stopped working and toroid coil started burning, as usual.

Look at the fuse! It got so hot and then exploded violently. The metal holders started melting. Really terrible stuff.

12A rectifier for 12V and 16A for 3.3V and 5V. This thing is still being sold and people are buying it.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg label.jpg (223.6 KB, 27 views)
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (581.2 KB, 38 views)
File Type: jpg 2.jpg (501.1 KB, 35 views)
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Old 02-08-2018, 03:37 PM   #1447
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

At best those three could do 175W-200W continuous. At least only one of them has unsafe generic Y-caps (the other two have none at all, ).
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Old 02-08-2018, 07:00 PM   #1448
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

And I doubt that the ripple will be in specs at any power draw!

PAN STAR PSA-235

This is an ATX power supply made back at 1998.

It has been cleaned a bit, but still has tons of dust on it. Obviously, it has seen many hours of use. It's still in working condition Well, that was before I removed 6 Teapo caps from it. Sorry, I forgot to take pictures before that.

The label claims it's a 235W unit, but I don't think this is possible with that tiny main transformer and 220uF primary capacitors.

The main transistors are 2x C4161, I couldn't find a datasheet online, but it seems they are rated for 7A, lower than 13007.

5vsb uses a MIP160 IC! This is something I would never expect in such an old and cheap power supply. Unfortunately, it is not rated for more than 0.6A!

For 12V, we get 2 diodes on a bracket and the other 2 main rails use 10A rectifiers. The label rating of 25A for 5V is a blatant lie.

Any comments?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg label.jpg (253.1 KB, 20 views)
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (405.6 KB, 32 views)
File Type: jpg 2.jpg (588.4 KB, 33 views)
File Type: jpg 3.jpg (612.9 KB, 31 views)
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Old 02-08-2018, 07:11 PM   #1449
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

And I would like to post a link to the "200W" version:
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showpo...&postcount=105
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:58 AM   #1450
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Ask and ye shall receive!

Those heatsinks actually look credible for 235W, likewise the output inductors. But for decent hold-up time it would need 470uF input caps. If you intend to use the thing, replace those 4700pF non-agency approve line-to-ground caps! The main transformer is also too wimpy. And those output rectifiers? 8A from dual axial lead rectifiers? 14A and 25A from what appear to be two 10A dual rectifiers? For how many milliseconds?
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Old 02-09-2018, 12:14 PM   #1451
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

I noticed that POS PSUs 99 or near close to 99 percent enough, have a primary failure...
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Old 02-11-2018, 03:15 AM   #1452
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

A dead Athena Power "Hercules" Model: AP-MPS3ATX35
This power supply came out of a PC i'm fixing up.
From what i've been told this PSU was purchased from Fry's Electronics less than 10 years ago.
So this is going to be the first PC power supply i'm putting here so apologies if i make any mistakes.
Anyways, on to the power supply.
Label...

Does not look bad but it will be in a moment.
Top Side....

Heatsinks don't look too bad but you may notice some stuff off about this supply.
Bottom side.....

Soldering does not look very good.
Primary.........


This does not look very good.
The switching transistors are 2 13007's (how suprising) while the one for 5VSB is a BU3150.
The wires on the common mode choke look a bit thin.
There's no varistor and the glue appears to be hot glue.
The capacitors are Cheng LS 470uf 200v
Time for the best (or worst) part, the secondary....................


The s20c45c diodes are for the 3.3v and 5v rails.
The f16c20ct diodes are for the 12v rail.
All of the capacitors are EJICON KF.
The 12v rail has one (badly soldered) 1000uf 16v capacitor with no PI coil.
The 5V rail has one 1000uf 10v capacitor with no PI coil.
The 3.3V rail has one 1000uf 10v and one 220uf 16v capacitors with no PI coil.
Both the -12v and -5v rails have one 220uf 16v after a small coil.
The 5VSB rail has one 470uf 16v cap before a coil and a 1000uf 16v capacitor after a small coil.
This does have a fan speed controller but the temperature probe had a 1cm gap between it and the heatsink.
Speaking of the fan, here is the fan............................................... ........

Just your typical cheap fan.
Not much else i can say about this unit other then it's trash.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 20180210_220822[1].jpg (1.70 MB, 185 views)
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File Type: jpg 20180210_233548[1].jpg (1.65 MB, 175 views)
File Type: jpg 20180210_233942[1].jpg (2.72 MB, 184 views)

Last edited by ruky con; 02-11-2018 at 03:19 AM..
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Old 02-11-2018, 09:33 AM   #1453
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Excellent pictures! Nice quality and focus.

Looks like the engineer that designed this thing was high! I really hate the way parts are placed on PCB.
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Old 02-12-2018, 04:12 PM   #1454
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Well, if you put real agency approved Y-caps in place of those GP parts (and replace the fan if it's non-op) it could be a noisy but otherwise decent 225W-250W PSU. The output caps look like some less than excellent brand, though they haven't launched. Replacing them with something along the lines of PW or LXZ might be good, just because they're 10 years old. Giving the 5VSB circuit a look-over would be good, replace any small lytics. If there's room you might even consider kludging an OVP crowbar into the 5VSB output circuit.
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:23 AM   #1455
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

The fan still works but the bearing might be getting a bit dry.
The "Y Caps" definitely need to be replaced.
And if i do try to fix this power supply i most likely will use parts i have on hand.
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Old 02-14-2018, 05:08 PM   #1456
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmill89 View Post
in order to be a little more realistic I dug an old crappy motherboard (ECS L4VCA2 socket 478 board with a 2.5 ghz Celeron) I didn't care about (since the likelihood of this POS PSU blowing up and killing the board was decent) out of the shed, fired up memtest86 and added an additional 55W 12V load in the form of an automotive headlight to simulate drives and a load on the GPU (the CPU is 61W TDP).

The results are interesting...., while all rails are now in ATX spec, the 12V rail is on the low side and dancing all over the place (note: the 12V pics were taken with my Nikon D7000's 6fps burst mode to give you an idea of how rapidly it is fluctuating, it went from 11.784 to 11.888 to 11.783, to 11.778, 11.781 in the space of about a second, I don't own an oscilloscope but I imagine it would look pretty bad on one):
Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Hansson View Post
dmill89: Just a tip, if your meter can handle somewhat high AC frequencies you can try putting it in AC mode and see what it shows on the 12v rail. (Cheap mans scope )
I was able to get an oscilloscope (hurray for < $30 analogue scopes on e-bay) on this thing with the same load and the results are pretty bad. The scale is set to 50mv per division, looks like we're looking at 200mv+ (ATX spec is 120mv on the 12v rail and even that is pretty bad) spikes and a very solid 100mv+ ripple with a 110-120w 12V heavy load:



And here's the 5V rail on the Seasonic tester with the 137W 5V heavy load, scale set to 20mv per division so we're looking at around 40mv ripple (50mv is the ATX spec on this rail):


and about 50-60mv on the 12v (same 20mv per division setting):


The 3.3V rail is surprisingly stable though, scale set to 10mv per division so right at 10mv ripple on this rail:


While bad in general it does look like this PSU does handle a 5V/3.3V heavy load better than a 12V heavy one.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSC_0990.jpg (442.0 KB, 141 views)
File Type: jpg DSC_1005.jpg (541.1 KB, 141 views)
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File Type: jpg DSC_1007.jpg (564.1 KB, 140 views)

Last edited by dmill89; 02-14-2018 at 05:23 PM..
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Old 02-15-2018, 02:20 AM   #1457
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Nice score, $30 well spent!
Yea the 3.3v on these supplies are usually really silent because they are usually derived by linear regulators from 5v.
So in effect they get filtered twice...
This was the PSU you recapped partially with used caps right?
Still looks decent for what it is, I would not expect any miracles to happen even if you recapped it fully
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:02 PM   #1458
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

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This was the PSU you recapped partially with used caps right?
Correct
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Old 02-15-2018, 07:28 PM   #1459
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Hansson View Post
This was the PSU you recapped partially with used caps right?
Still looks decent for what it is, I would not expect any miracles to happen even if you recapped it fully
Yah I guess acceptable for what it is (a piece of crap) but still definitely not all that good overall (I realize it isn't completely "fair" to test a partially re-capped PSU either since there may be other caps that are failed but didn't bloat). I definitely won't waste time fully re-capping this though, I've got too many much better units.

Here are a few comparisons (all on the 5V/3.3V heavy Seasonic tester 12V@4A, 5V@10A, 3.3V@12A with the oscilloscope in the 20mv per division setting):
Rosewill branded L&C LC-8400BTX:
12V:

5V:

3.3V:


Antec Basiq BP350 (FSP):
12V:

5V:

3.3V:


PC Power & Cooling PPCMK3S600 (rebranded Seasonic M12II):
12V:

5V:

3.3V:
Attached Images
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Last edited by dmill89; 02-15-2018 at 07:50 PM..
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Old 02-23-2018, 02:24 AM   #1460
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Default Re: the gutless, bloated, and fried power supply hall of shame

I feel like something is missing from this power supply.

It claims it's maximum output is 4.5-9.5v 800mA.
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