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Old 08-11-2017, 11:53 PM   #1
Doc38343
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Default Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Hey Guys,
This is a new one for me, an automobile trunk mount amplifier. the fellow who brought it said he didn't know much it was just working then it wasn't... LOL
Then he said he might have over loaded it but he didn't know.
I turned the gains and all to low, connected my 12v bench supply and there is no power light but fuses are not blown. I also can follow the 12v rail to both sides transistors that are mounted to the housing... however it dies out past there. I am going to pull the board out when i get time to work on it next but hey i thought somebody in here may know this amp and even possibly have the schematic/service manual.... hears to hoping!
Cobalt 8001 model

Took several pics because of lighting issues. Thanks for any help.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-001.jpg (510.2 KB, 6 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-002.jpg (733.5 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-003.jpg (809.3 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-004.jpg (846.0 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-005.jpg (818.5 KB, 3 views)
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Old 08-12-2017, 06:39 PM   #2
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Hey I pulled the end cover off this amp and traced the voltage again. I have the 12v rail right up to all 6 mosfets (they are good). What I found is that they are not being switched on. So I cannot find ANY info on this model online and Orion company website is so ashamed they don't list this model anywhere in support. LOL (you would think they would gladly release the schematic) Lots of fails on this one on google searches.
Anyway I followed the mosfet gate back to the transistor that should turn them on both sides are same. then i followed the transistor turn on trace and they both commonly attach to TL494CN IC chip pin 9. It is controlled by pins 4,5,6 and so i look at them and they are tied into the same voltage rail pin 4 to R11 - 10k, pin 5 to C7, pin 6 to R10 - 3K. So now i follow that rail and it hads back to the original 12v source section... this is where I cannot tell exactly where it ties in but it led me to my prime suspect... R1 is burnt black and I cannot identify it. It reads over 1.2 Meg but it is part of a voltage divider R3 - 12k (one end to grd) and ZD2 to turn on Q1 -NPN transistor. It cannot possibly be 1meg so please help me figure out it's value. It is entirely possible that is the only problem keeping this amp from working. It also lines up with his explanation that he may have overloaded the amp. Or it may just be the part that fails on a lot of these it is only a .25 watt resistor. I now have downloaded the datasheets for the IC's and transistors and i think i need to supply the Q1 base with 5v so i am testing the voltage side of R1 and i only got 0.8.. something else is wrong.. traces disappear under some big parts so CRAP!!! The rabbit ran!! Would have been to easy to have the voltage so i could calculate the value of R1.... anyhow thats where i am at right now. ... any thinkers in here tonight??
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-b00.jpg (531.8 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-b01.jpg (517.3 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-b02.jpg (545.6 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-b03.jpg (507.8 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg Cobalt8001-b04.jpg (525.6 KB, 3 views)
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 2PC1815.pdf (50.9 KB, 0 views)
File Type: pdf C1815.pdf (44.7 KB, 0 views)
File Type: pdf FQP65N06-1009554.pdf (784.6 KB, 0 views)
File Type: pdf tl494.pdf (1.27 MB, 0 views)
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Old 08-12-2017, 07:04 PM   #3
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

I discovered that the amp has a center connector marked REM between the 12v+ and the GND connectors. It has 0.36V testing from it to GND and it gives me 7.78v when i test it from it to 12v+. I suspected it was where the R1 voltage rail ran to and sure enough these readings match. Here is where I am lost in my understanding.. When I put the VM probes from this REM to the trace that goes to Q1 base.. it turns it on.. so I'm back to thinking R! is the sole culprit but i am no closer to figuring it's value. secondly why would it be burnt out at all it only goes to R3,ZD2 and the base of Q1 (tests good) BTW: when I connect the VM to the pin from REM it reads 0.69v but i guess that is enough to trip on Q1 because the LED lights.. but not the entire unit.
I will download the user manual to see how REM is applied in practice..


Couldnt find the exact manual but another very similar unit from the same series have that REM and it says "Switched 9-12V to remotely turn the amp off and on." All I can assume is they wire in a switch to the 12v system and then when it is OPEN the amp would be on and when the 9-12v is applied it would switch the amp off. I am going to introduce 12v to it and see what happens!!

Amazing... I now think R1 is supposed to be a 1meg... here is why. when i introduced 12v to the REM the pin at the base of Q1 got 5v. Nothing else happened with the exception of that LED (it only lights the Cobalt name thru fiberoptic)
HOWEVER the on light does not come on and the high current Mosfets do not turn on. No change at the PWM IC either.
Oh well screw this for the night.. back to rabbit hole one.... I thought i was getting somewhere and went NOWHERE!! LOL
Damn Cobalt... schematic please so we can fix your FUBAR amp...

Last edited by Doc38343; 08-12-2017 at 07:29 PM.. Reason: Result of test
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Old 08-13-2017, 02:33 AM   #4
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc38343 View Post
Couldnt find the exact manual but another very similar unit from the same series have that REM and it says "Switched 9-12V to remotely turn the amp off and on." All I can assume is they wire in a switch to the 12v system and then when it is OPEN the amp would be on and when the 9-12v is applied it would switch the amp off. I am going to introduce 12v to it and see what happens!!
No, the REM is for REMOTE start.
You wire the amplifier directly to 12v.
And then the REM wire goes to the ignition or better the stereo.
That way when you turn on the ignition or stereo the amplifier is started as 12v gets applied to this wire.
Otherwise it would be drawing power from the battery when the car is off...
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Old 08-13-2017, 07:38 AM   #5
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

for testing purposes, hook up the amp to 12V, and wire the REM to positive of the 12V PSU. Once you fire the PSU up, the amp should be turned on.
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Old 08-13-2017, 04:18 PM   #6
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Hansson View Post
No, the REM is for REMOTE start.
You wire the amplifier directly to 12v.
And then the REM wire goes to the ignition or better the stereo.
That way when you turn on the ignition or stereo the amplifier is started as 12v gets applied to this wire.
Otherwise it would be drawing power from the battery when the car is off...
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapLeaker View Post
for testing purposes, hook up the amp to 12V, and wire the REM to positive of the 12V PSU. Once you fire the PSU up, the amp should be turned on.
Thanks guys... I've never used one of these personally. My friend came to me because he knew i do a lot of electronics and amplifiers and such for music stores.
OK have a quick question... this thing has 2 30amp fuses and instead of relays they used a bank of 3 60amp capable mosfets on each side. Do i need to feed it more power (my power supply is only 10amp max probably 7 or 8 amps safely) I do have overload protection so if my supply detects over 10amp draw it will shut down immediately, it has not done this of course the amp has not turned on either. I figured Hansson was why the LED lit when voltage was applied. Makes sense that it needs a shut off. Perhaps I am closer to locating the issue than i thought last night. It will be tomorrow before i can fiddle with it after the business work is done. For testing i have the gain set to min but when it does turn on i was suspecting it will trip my supply overload. Even if it does I will know i have it turning on and can then connect it to my car battery for sound / distortion tests.

Last edited by Doc38343; 08-13-2017 at 04:19 PM..
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Old 08-13-2017, 07:12 PM   #7
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

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Do i need to feed it more power (my power supply is only 10amp max probably 7 or 8 amps safely) .
Well. How many amps is it rated for? Learning to take 2 measurements and make 3 or more is a basic knowledge of "Knowing electronics".

The power through anything DC is as simple as P=V*I. Or in this case: P/V=I
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Old 08-14-2017, 09:36 AM   #8
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Quote:
Originally Posted by goontron View Post
Well. How many amps is it rated for? Learning to take 2 measurements and make 3 or more is a basic knowledge of "Knowing electronics".

The power through anything DC is as simple as P=V*I. Or in this case: P/V=I
Thanks for the joke.
Can you read? Since it does NOT TURN ON there is no amp draw.
There are NO MARKINGS, NO DATASHEETS OR ANYTHING ELSE From this company.
You are very amusing.
Troll

Last edited by Doc38343; 08-14-2017 at 09:37 AM..
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Old 08-14-2017, 12:25 PM   #9
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

^ Or, you know, Google it? https://www.amazon.com/Orion-Cobalt-.../dp/B001CFHKUA

So, 800P/13.5V=59.2592592593I

Now, since you don't usually drive a full load first test (though, with how you act, i wouldn't put it past you) you can safely divide that by 10 or so. 6 amps will do yah.

You are the amusing one here not even a cursory Google search. Tisk Tisk.

Last edited by goontron; 08-14-2017 at 12:32 PM.. Reason: Had to throw in that last line. An yes, i am a troll ;)
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Old 08-14-2017, 12:33 PM   #10
Doc38343
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Quote:
Originally Posted by goontron View Post
^ Or, you know, Google it? https://www.amazon.com/Orion-Cobalt-.../dp/B001CFHKUA

So, 800P/13.5V=59.2592592593I

Now, since you don't usually drive a full load first test (though, with how you act, i wouldn't put it past you) you can safely divide that by 12 or so. 5 amps will do yah.

You are the amusing one here not even a cursory Google search. Tisk Tisk.
Thank you so much for your help. I now do not need to worry about carrying a heavy car battery into my shop. I am sooooo stupid.
Have a nice day

Please ignore my stupid post i couldn't delete it. I figure you were not simply being a smart ass but were actually trying to help.

My apologies......
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Old 08-14-2017, 05:29 PM   #11
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Default Re: Cobalt 8001 - no power light DOA

Quote:
Originally Posted by goontron View Post
^ Or, you know, Google it? https://www.amazon.com/Orion-Cobalt-.../dp/B001CFHKUA

So, 800P/13.5V=59.2592592593I
OrionCarAudio.com finally posted a link to the actual user manual. No schematic though.
Amplifier Section CO8001
Power Output in Watts RMS, 4 Ohms 300 x 1
Power Output in Watts RMS, 2 Ohms 400 x1
Externally Bridgeable yes
Remote Gain Function yes
Distortion at Rated Power < 0.9% THD+N
Frequency Response 20Hz to 30kHz
+0, -1dB
20Hz to 30kHz
+0, -1dB
Linear Bandwidth 20Hz to 20kHz
3dB
20Hz to 20kHz
3dB
Damping Factor > 150
Input Sensitivity rms
Input Impedance 80kΩ
Fuse Type (2) 30 Amp ATC
Dimensions 13.4" x 8.1" x 2.1"
Weight 7.3 lbs.
Crossover Section
Low Pass Crossover Continuously variable/
2nd Order
Continuously variable/
2nd Order
Low Pass Frequency Range 50Hz to 500Hz

Anyhow NEVER trust amazon listings for your specs.

Amp appears fixed. I took the board out and removed the burned R1 and with the microscope I was able to see the first third and gold bands Middle band looked black but also the burn area.. still I know voltage dividers can vary so I put a 100ohm in and she fires up nice.
Just as i originally suspected it trips my bench power supply protection.
(Since the manual verified the 30amp fuses and there are no shorts it uses more than my little supply can give)
Instead of carrying a battery in here i just called the dude and told him to stop by tomorrow so we can test it right.

Manual is attached for the next Victim of an Orion Cobalt 8001 (NOT 800.1)
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File Type: pdf GC05001_2008-12MLweb (1).pdf (1,022.2 KB, 0 views)
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