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    #21
    Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

    Why would an energy company subsidise something that causes a reduction in energy usage?
    1.) As mentioned, building new generating capacity is very expensive;

    2.) Adding to the power distribution infrastructure is also very expensive.

    Both of those assume that electricity usage is increasing rather than static or decreasing. That is the case in most of the world. And both assume that generation and distribution are being run close to full capacity, which is often the case (California, where I live, "imports" electricity from neighboring states, and various government regulations make adding distribution capacity difficult, slow and expensive).

    Putting it simply, electric utilities have significant economic incentive, under current conditions, to encourage energy conservation, even without the government programs that force utilities to subsidize things like CFLs, and uneconomic boondoggles like wind and solar power.
    PeteS in CA

    Power Supplies should be boring: No loud noises, no bright flashes, and no bad smells.
    ****************************
    To kill personal responsibility, initiative or success, punish it by taxing it. To encourage irresponsibility, improvidence, dependence and failure, reward it by subsidizing it.
    ****************************

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      #22
      Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

      had a cheapie at the shop start singing and flickering yesterday.tried to open it up but broke the tube.its 2 months old and the lytic read 17 ohms esr.
      the board is brown around the transistors.i expect the others to die soon.
      i cannot take flicker or buzzing/squeeling so they will come out as soon as they start.
      if i hadnt broke it the other may have been ok with a new cap.
      the original is an aishi.

      Comment


        #23
        Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

        My dad recently got a cheapie one too, and put it in, it takes like 4-5 seconds to start up, and it buzzes quite a lot. Its very dim at startup too. I wonder what quality parts are in this one...

        Have any pics?

        PS - use a small saw to cut open the plastic base, instead of trying to pry it open.

        -Ben
        Muh-soggy-knee

        Comment


          #24
          Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

          mine is a k-lite.
          the other one in the fixture had a hard time starting this morning.
          got frost last night and we shut down the furnace for the season.about 60f in here.
          high esr cap most likely.
          Attached Files
          Last edited by kc8adu; 04-06-2012, 08:53 AM.

          Comment


            #25
            Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

            Still have a 20w Philips bulb going strong after 7 years maybe? It's actually made in Germany! Newer ones are made in China.

            Comment


              #26
              Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

              kc8adu:
              LOL, does that thing even have a fuse?

              Rulycat:
              does it buzz/hum? if so, then it probably has a magnetic ballast. Those magnetic ballast ones usually last quite a long time, much longer than electronic ballasts.

              -Ben
              Muh-soggy-knee

              Comment


                #27
                Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                Originally posted by ben7 View Post
                kc8adu:
                LOL, does that thing even have a fuse?

                Rulycat:
                does it buzz/hum? if so, then it probably has a magnetic ballast. Those magnetic ballast ones usually last quite a long time, much longer than electronic ballasts.

                -Ben
                Silent as far as I can tell, the ballast is much larger than the socket and the tubes themselves, perhaps they simply overspeced it in the good ol' days.

                Comment


                  #28
                  Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                  fuse resistor in shrink tube in power lead.
                  have a ton of rubycon ssp? 33@250v on hand so i tried one in the one i got apart.
                  it worked fine.not enough room for it but it proved the cap is the problem.the second ones cap was 15ohm esr.
                  junk cfl like these set folks against them all after this sort of failure.
                  methinks these 2 shop bathrooms are going to get old 3' preheat fluorescents in place of these cheesey 3 bulb fixtures.
                  thats the only reason we used cfl's.
                  i am finding most are pure junk.

                  Comment


                    #29
                    Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                    Aishi CD11GE datasheet:


                    Specified life 12,000 hours

                    Comment


                      #30
                      Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                      Originally posted by PeteS in CA View Post
                      1.) As mentioned, building new generating capacity is very expensive;

                      2.) Adding to the power distribution infrastructure is also very expensive.

                      Both of those assume that electricity usage is increasing rather than static or decreasing. That is the case in most of the world. And both assume that generation and distribution are being run close to full capacity, which is often the case (California, where I live, "imports" electricity from neighboring states, and various government regulations make adding distribution capacity difficult, slow and expensive).

                      Putting it simply, electric utilities have significant economic incentive, under current conditions, to encourage energy conservation, even without the government programs that force utilities to subsidize things like CFLs, and uneconomic boondoggles like wind and solar power.
                      Why subsidise energy saving devices that are of poor quality?
                      I still think there should be legislation covering quality (and warranties) of energy saving devices; a name I thought of would be the Energy Saving Lamp Quality Act which covers all energy saving lamps.
                      My first choice in quality Japanese electrolytics is Nippon Chemi-Con, which has been in business since 1931... the quality of electronics is dependent on the quality of the electrolytics.

                      Comment


                        #31
                        Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                        Originally posted by kc8adu View Post
                        fuse resistor in shrink tube in power lead.
                        have a ton of rubycon ssp? 33@250v on hand so i tried one in the one i got apart.
                        it worked fine.not enough room for it but it proved the cap is the problem.the second ones cap was 15ohm esr.
                        junk cfl like these set folks against them all after this sort of failure.
                        methinks these 2 shop bathrooms are going to get old 3' preheat fluorescents in place of these cheesey 3 bulb fixtures.
                        thats the only reason we used cfl's.
                        i am finding most are pure junk.
                        I saw a failed CFL at a Chinese restaurant in Claremont, NH. lol.
                        (the Imperial buffet next to Walmart)

                        And it looks like the CFL that gets installed there keeps failing at the same spot.
                        Last edited by RJARRRPCGP; 04-06-2012, 09:57 PM.
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                          #32
                          Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                          If you like to see the schematics of the CFL, go here:
                          http://www.pavouk.org/hw/lamp/en_ind...hilipsgenie11w
                          Never stop learning
                          Basic LCD TV and Monitor troubleshooting guides.
                          http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...956#post305956

                          Voltage Regulator (LDO) testing:
                          http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...999#post300999

                          Inverter testing using old CFL:
                          http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...er+testing+cfl

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                            #33
                            Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                            i guess i live in a odd place if i can use up 12000 hours in 3 months!
                            Originally posted by b700029 View Post
                            Aishi CD11GE datasheet:


                            Specified life 12,000 hours

                            Comment


                              #34
                              Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                              Originally posted by kc8adu View Post
                              i guess i live in a odd place if i can use up 12000 hours in 3 months!
                              Hahaha!

                              It says on the datasheet they can withstand up to 130deg C temps - there is no way I am believing that xD.

                              -Ben
                              Muh-soggy-knee

                              Comment


                                #35
                                Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                well that room can get dammed hot after a healthy dose of homemade chili the night before.i guess if it can peel paint it could kill crap cfl's too.

                                Comment


                                  #36
                                  Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                  Why subsidise energy saving devices that are of poor quality?
                                  It's a feel-good symbol, and actual performance is incidental. If the @#$%y quality is noticed, the politicians can just blame the universal bogeyman, Big Business. Subsidizing @#$% gets many people POed. If government does it directly, those people get POed at the politicians who imposed it. If government forces utilities to do it, with the extra cost passed on to consumers, many won't notice the extra charge, and many who do will get POed at the utility company rather than the pols who played this subsidy shell game.
                                  Last edited by PeteS in CA; 04-08-2012, 01:38 PM.
                                  PeteS in CA

                                  Power Supplies should be boring: No loud noises, no bright flashes, and no bad smells.
                                  ****************************
                                  To kill personal responsibility, initiative or success, punish it by taxing it. To encourage irresponsibility, improvidence, dependence and failure, reward it by subsidizing it.
                                  ****************************

                                  Comment


                                    #37
                                    Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                    like the tv converter box fiasco.
                                    most were total shit.only reason there was such a program was the folks who would have just stopped watching tv rather than buy anything.would have cut deep into tv network proffits.
                                    lots of folks could have spent $40-$80 much more wisely than on some junky box.
                                    btw back on the cfl thing.
                                    the only thing green about this "green" movement is the flow of cash!
                                    the things have to sell on their qualities rather than force.
                                    i would rather use 60+ year old preheat fluorescents with high quality high cri tubes than these trashcan fillers.
                                    and i loaded up on cases of tubes that were being banned to have a lifetime supply.
                                    lots of older ge and sylvania f96t12/850 on hand here.old enough to be full mercury.

                                    Comment


                                      #38
                                      Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                      Originally posted by kc8adu View Post
                                      like the tv converter box fiasco.
                                      most were total shit.only reason there was such a program was the folks who would have just stopped watching tv rather than buy anything.would have cut deep into tv network proffits.
                                      lots of folks could have spent $40-$80 much more wisely than on some junky box.
                                      btw back on the cfl thing.
                                      the only thing green about this "green" movement is the flow of cash!
                                      the things have to sell on their qualities rather than force.
                                      i would rather use 60+ year old preheat fluorescents with high quality high cri tubes than these trashcan fillers.
                                      and i loaded up on cases of tubes that were being banned to have a lifetime supply.
                                      lots of older ge and sylvania f96t12/850 on hand here.old enough to be full mercury.
                                      Yeah, I know, its such a shame!

                                      Your right, its all about the cash, people are more worried about cash than their own health and/or safety and/or happiness.

                                      Its so funny but worrying too; people pay for the cheapest CFLs, so they end up with CFLs that don't last long, and have poor light color. Yet they complain about it!


                                      There are a lot of ignorant people in this world.

                                      -Ben
                                      Muh-soggy-knee

                                      Comment


                                        #39
                                        Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                        Originally posted by ben7 View Post

                                        Its so funny but worrying too; people pay for the cheapest CFLs, so they end up with CFLs that don't last long, and have poor light color. Yet they complain about it!


                                        There are a lot of ignorant people in this world.

                                        -Ben
                                        I used to sell electronics at a major retail store and saw this all the time. For example the cheapest DVD player we had was a store brand piece of crap made by some Chinese company I've never heard of. These had an extremely high failure rate and eventually got recalled for being a fire hazard (wiring gauge too thin). We sold a Sony unit that was much better for only $5 more and I tried to steer everyone toward that unit, however ~70-80% of people still bought the store brand unit since it was a little cheaper, and then complained when it failed a month after the 90 day warranty expired. I wanted to say "I told you so" to them, but of course you can't do that when working retail (at least if you want to keep your job).

                                        People buy cheap crap and then wonder why it doesn't last or perform to expectations, then they complain about it. The solution is simple: Stop Buying Cheap Crap, but it seems that much of the general population simply doesn't get it. This quest for the cheapest even harms those not buying cheap junk since it becomes progressively harder and more expensive to get good quality products when manufactures see that only price sells, and thus cut corners to lower their prices to compete.
                                        Last edited by dmill89; 04-09-2012, 09:27 PM.

                                        Comment


                                          #40
                                          Re: Cheap CFL teardown after failure

                                          back to cfl's
                                          got 4 more of those huge plant growing cfl's from my neighbor to fix.
                                          replaced caps and they were ok.
                                          left one in a test fixture.big 6m opening this morning.working a tx station when i noticed this light blinking on my voice peaks.yep rf sensitive!this was on 50.125. 100w ssb

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